MiniMig with AGA

[DyLucke]

I'm definitelly interested on the project and i could buy one unit once everything is set for an standard user.

However i would like to know what is going to implement at the end this Rev B board.

020 or 030 code? Hig res modes? Gfx and audio card emulation?
Will it be faster than a 030 /50?

Maybe this is asking too much for now... XD
But it would be good to know what are we exactly aiming to.

[whiteb]

Two posts....

[whiteb]

I'm definitelly interested on the project and i could buy one unit once everything is set for an standard user.

However i would like to know what is going to implement at the end this Rev B board.

020 or 030 code? Hig res modes? Gfx and audio card emulation?
Will it be faster than a 030 /50?

Maybe this is asking too much for now... XD
But it would be good to know what are we exactly aiming to.

Initially, 68000 (Softcore), they are planning an 020 soft core. That is all I know.

There will be Plug in boards to extend CPU's, like the 68060 test card they have.

[bbond007]

@hattig

Toccata emulation may help for that. Anyway I'd like to see 020 support before. And Cirrus||Virge emulation after 020 support :-)

Cirrus and Virge were really tack-on PC parts retrofitted to Amiga. Virge was actually known  in the PC circle as a "3D Video Decelerator" meaning that the 3D rendering performance was slower than simply using the CPU.

I really think the developers would be better off expanding the AGA core to support some "new" chunky 8bit, 16bit or 24bit modes. Here we have the opportunity to go back and fix AGA and make it would it should have been.

[bbond007]

The board is equipped with a 24-bit stereo audio DAC. Upgrading Paula to 16 bit and writing suitable AHI driver won't be a big problem. I'm also thinking about more sophisticated solution.

There is still a lot of unused memory bandwidth which can be used for implementation of an advanced flicker-fixer or graphics board (although implementation of CL/S3 chips seems to be impossible).

Both the AHI and P96 require at least 020 CPU and this is the next design object.

Wow. Very cool. If a 16bit Paula is not a big problem, I can't wait to hear about the "more sophisticated solution". Is it a DSP or something?

Is Minimig 1.1 obsolete after this? I'm still trying to get an ARM controller

[Linde]

I really think the developers would be better off expanding the AGA core to support some "new" chunky 8bit, 16bit or 24bit modes.

I agree, but more specifically, "new" should mean Graffiti and/or P96, in my opinion.

I guess that if we see this speed increase on the 68000 core running at 7 MHz, there will be a similar improvement factor to the 030, no? Someone got any estimate for what happens speed-wise when you minimize the memory delay times and increase the clock speed of the 030 to whatever th FPGA is able to maintain? Will we see other improvements like 1 instruction/cycle?

Is there a full list of other computers/arcade boards/video games that run on this hardware?

I'm sorry; just a bunch of questions that will obviously be answered automatically once this thing is out.

[xyzzy]

The NatAmi design is planning to extend AGA, I think if the MiniMig AGA core is extended then it should be designed to be register compatible at least.

[Crumb]

Cirrus and Virge were really tack-on PC parts retrofitted to Amiga. Virge was actually known  in the PC circle as a "3D Video Decelerator" meaning that the 3D rendering performance was slower than simply using the CPU.

that comment makes me think you have never used RTG on Amiga. On Amiga CirrusGD5446 and Virge work great, infinitely better than AGA. Moreover, P96 drivers already exist for that. When I say Cirrus/Virge I mean making something register compatible so P96/CGX work with it. You could run your Cirrus/Virge at whatever frequency you like since it's not a real chip. BTW, Virge3D part works faster than software rendering with slow cpus. I am not interested on Warp3D on minimig anyway but it would be possible.


[/QUOTE]I really think the developers would be better off expanding the AGA core to support some "new" chunky 8bit, 16bit or 24bit modes. Here we have the opportunity to go back and fix AGA and make it would it should have been.[/QUOTE]

I disagree with that because nobody is going to write drivers for that extensions. So zero software would actually use it. In contrast if a gfx chip supported by P96 or CGX was supported we suddenly would be able to run ALL amiga RTG software.

[xyzzy]

The most obvious way to expand the AGA core is to add oodles of extra bandwidth to allow high-res AGA screenmodes and ultra fast blitter access without slowing down CPU accesses. This should be transparent to all well-behaved software. Games might need a compatability mode however.

[Jose]

While no software is able to use them (new would have to be written), I think implementing HAM10 and some of the other AAA modes would be very interesting because techniques are already available to use those Amiga chipset tricks.
For example imagine a copper with SuperHiRes resolution AAA one was HiRes only and it would have opened possibilities in video effects that would have made the Amiga lead in a whole bunch of areas back in the day.
Those Commodore management guys were really either completely dumb or sold out to M$.

[Karlos]

Cirrus and Virge were really tack-on PC parts retrofitted to Amiga. Virge was actually known  in the PC circle as a "3D Video Decelerator" meaning that the 3D rendering performance was slower than simply using the CPU.

They might be slow by PC standards, but they are way faster at productivity work than AGA ever was. Getting an RTG card was one of the best things I ever did for my Amiga.

[bbond007]

that comment makes me think you have never used RTG on Amiga. On Amiga CirrusGD5446 and Virge work great, infinitely better than AGA. Moreover, P96 drivers already exist for that. When I say Cirrus/Virge I mean making something register compatible so P96/CGX work with it. You could run your Cirrus/Virge at whatever frequency you like since it's not a real chip. BTW, Virge3D part works faster than software rendering with slow cpus. I am not interested on Warp3D on minimig anyway but it would be possible.

I disagree with that because nobody is going to write drivers for that extensions. So zero software would actually use it. In contrast if a gfx chip supported by P96 or CGX was supported we suddenly would be able to run ALL amiga RTG software.

I had CV64/3D in my A2000 and in my 1200T I had a Bvision and later ended up trading that out for a G-REX/Voodoo III.

I disagree that "nobody" would write the extensions for p96. Given that line of thinking, nobody would have written P96 driver for UAE.

[trip6]

Alll that stuff your mentioning is interesting and would be nice, but personally I just want it for playing OCS\ECS and AGA games and to make sure that its compatability with games is as close to 100% as possible for the cores that are developed. If any of the extra stuff on the wishlist breaks games compatability, then to me a separate core for that type of computing should be developed. After all the board is called FPGAArcade it is supposed to be a modern FPGA replacement for original stand up arcade games and now the amiga as well.

[kolla]

They might be slow by PC standards, but they are way faster at productivity work than AGA ever was.

But what productivity work is this project good for? SCALA, Deluxe Paint, Brilliance, various old music, and animation software. What do they all have in common? Do not work well with RTG.
Personally I cant wait to play with DPaint on AGA with heaploads of chipram, just hope it will work

[trekiej]

I wonder if there is a enough room to add RTG to the FPGA.
I hope this leads to an Amiga software revival.

[kolla]

I wonder if there is a enough room to add RTG to the FPGA.
I hope this leads to an Amiga software revival.

Why would it? Seriously, if RTG is so important, then why not get a Mac mini with MorphOS or some OS4 box already? As a bonus you get PowerPC, heck lot more CPU power and RAM, and they are available *now*!