VERY 'dodgy' ebay seller!

[motorollin]

Amithony wrote:
Probably a good idea. Everyone has a right to their opinion, but no-one has the right to say theirs is necessarily right.  

Really?

--
moto

[Amithony]

motorollin wrote:

Amithony wrote:
Probably a good idea. Everyone has a right to their opinion, but no-one has the right to say theirs is necessarily right.  

Really?

--
moto

Yes. Really.
Except we ALL know that the Amiga is the best system that was ever made, period.

[motorollin]

@Amithony
So I have the right to say what my opinion is but I don't have the right to say that I think it is the correct thing to believe? How ridiculous...

--
moto

[fatboy]

OK back again!

Just had 10 mins blasting on Banshee on my Amiga Technologies A1200 on my NEWish 37" Panasonic Flat Screen TV...by coincidence I got a call from my brother-in-law who was just setting up an Amiga I gave him last year, for his 8 year son!

That say's it ALL for me?

Here I am with a classic piece of 90's computer technology playing an old Amiga game on my BIG screen TV. My nephew is at his dads house and about to do the same on a machine twice as old has him...and I know he loves it!!!!!

What a great machine!!!...timeless....and NOT worth getting into heated debates over....just enjoy  ;-)

[arkanoid]

motor: he's saying that you are free to say that your opinion is "right", and you can make a logically true arguement to back-up your opinion. but you can never PROVE that your opinion is necessarily right. Opinions are subjective. Thankfully, this world is still full of people that have their own opinions and as long as your argument is sound than it is right...for you.

the idea of one absolute truth is a false idea dreamt up by lawyers, because "proving" absolute truth makes them VERY rich. In most situations people should just learn to live with other people's opinions and, as fatboy just said, just enjoy Amigaaaaaaaa!!  :crazy:

[motorollin]

arkanoid wrote:
motor: he's saying that you are free to say that your opinion is "right", and you can make a logically true arguement to back-up your opinion. but you can never PROVE that your opinion is necessarily right.

I agree with you, but that's not actually what he said.

--
moto

[arkanoid]

well, i'm not sure. but i think that is what he might have been hinting at. :-)

but anyways, time to install Opus Directory!! \o/

[mongo]

arkanoid wrote:
motor: he's saying that you are free to say that your opinion is "right", and you can make a logically true arguement to back-up your opinion. but you can never PROVE that your opinion is necessarily right. Opinions are subjective. Thankfully, this world is still full of people that have their own opinions and as long as your argument is sound than it is right...for you.

the idea of one absolute truth is a false idea dreamt up by lawyers, because "proving" absolute truth makes them VERY rich. In most situations people should just learn to live with other people's opinions and, as fatboy just said, just enjoy Amigaaaaaaaa!!  :crazy:

Just because an opinion is subjective doesn't mean that it can't be right, or wrong.

It is my opinion that 1 + 1 = 2.

[arkanoid]

yep, 1+1=2 is your opinion and it happens to be an objective opinion that is provable and "correct". Because if you were an architect and suddenly decided that 1+1=3, you would soon be proven "wrong" when your buildings collapsed and fall to the ground.

Try proving that copying 20+ year old software is wrong, or that I do not see the colour red as others see blue and blue as red. Those are subjective opinions and unproveable.

You could try using "the law" to prove you are correct, but then the law is nothing but a social construct that changes over time to suit hypocrits in power. For example, not to long ago it was "wrong" in the law's eyes to be homosexual.

[mongo]

arkanoid wrote:
Try proving that copying 20+ year old software is wrong, or that I do not see the colour red as others see blue and blue as red. Those are subjective opinions and unproveable.

I don't think the objection is to copying 20 year old software. I think the objection is to selling copies of 20 year old software for profit.

You could try using "the law" to prove you are correct, but then the law is nothing but a social construct that changes over time to suit hypocrits in power. For example, not to long ago it was "wrong" in the law's eyes to be homosexual.

How do you determine what is right or wrong, exactly?

[billt]

if i recall correctly, i remember seeing him selling ancient software, which his customers probably found difficult to find. So what's the problem?

old and hard to find does not equate to no problem.

[Belial6]

No, it is not your "opinion" that 1 + 1 = 2.  1 + 1 = 2 is a statement of fact.  That statement of fact may be right or wrong, but it is a statement of fact none the less.

Sorry to split hairs, but the whole opinion/fact things is a pet peeve of mine.  It is common for people to think that by saying "It's my opinion", they get to say that untrue statements of fact are just as valid as true statements of fact.

An opinion is a subjective statement who's true answer can change based on who is making the statement.

A fact is an objective statement who's true answer is always the same no matter who is making the statement.

Either one can be true, and either one can be false, but that does NOT mean that false statements of fact are opinions.

So, the statement that piracy was a significant factor in the downfall of the Amiga" is a statement of fact, and therefor is either true or false.  Opinion does not come into it.  Now, it is perfectly reasonable to state that there is not enough information to determine whether it is true or false, and thus we have to make guesses.  But, it is definitely a statement of fact.

Now, "Amiga is the best computer ever made." is a statement of opinion.  This could also be wrong if you made the statement, but actually thought the Atari was better.  It is just unusual for a statement of opinion to be wrong because the person making it, generally defines the true answer.

And just to make things funky, it is also possible to make a statement of fact ABOUT your opinion.  e.g. "It is my opinion that the Amiga was an amazing computer!"  That is a statement of fact.  Why?  Because it is either true or false that that is my opinion.

Sorry about the rant.  As I said, the definitions of opinion and fact are pet peeves of mine.  Carry on with the debates over the FACT of what effect piracy did or did not have on the fate of the Amiga, as well as the OPINION of whether copying and selling 20+ year old software is right or wrong.

[Amithony]

motorollin wrote:
@Amithony
So I have the right to say what my opinion is but I don't have the right to say that I think it is the correct thing to believe? How ridiculous...

--
moto

Touchy subject I see. I can think of many examples of late, can you? Our world has been changed by people trying to force their beliefs on the world. My point was that we had the right to believe what we believe, but not the right to jam it down other peoples throats because we think we are more right than they are. I'm not saying what the ebayer did was right, i was saying stoning him for it isn't right either. But again, that's my opinion.

[Ideal]

piracy was a factor as to why many software companies
stopped supporting the Amiga.

You all crave 'new' software, but new developers are reluctant to spend hours of there time knowing full well someone will soon be pirating their wares.

Err... I think you'll find the most significant reason why developers stopped supporting the Amiga was that the manufacture of actual Amigas stopped...

[motorollin]

Amithony wrote:
Touchy subject I see.

Not at all. I have heard people say many times that you "can't" say that what you think is the right thing to think, when in fact you can say exactly that. You might be wrong and other people might disagree with you, but that doesn't change the fact that you have the right to say it.

Amithony wrote:
I can think of many examples of late, can you? Our world has been changed by people trying to force their beliefs on the world. My point was that we had the right to believe what we believe, but not the right to jam it down other peoples throats because we think we are more right than they are.

Ahh ok, but that's not actually what you said before. For the record I do agree with you here, and I'm not trying to be deliberately obtuse, but I think your original comment that 'you can't say that what you think is right' was a bit vague.

--
moto

[Amithony]

Love your work. This is exactly my point. You have the right to that opinion also without anyone flaming you for it.