Fair prices

[terminator4]

I guess we all wish you could buy amiga gear as cheap as some of the apple stuff...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-PowerMac-G3-PC-WORKING_W0QQitemZ390003032936QQ :-D

[redrumloa]

terminator4 wrote:
I guess we all wish you could buy amiga gear as cheap as some of the apple stuff...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-PowerMac-G3-PC-WORKING_W0QQitemZ390003032936QQ :-D

Apple stuff can be expensive too  :-D

[ami_junki]

I guess the irony is that the Amiga was made as a lowcost home computer which was affordable to the average home and now the prices are shooting up so that the Amiga will most likely in the future be only for the super rich.  Though I can understand because there are less machines and the demand is there but I think it is sad that a machine that was made for the people will soon be available only to the ones with deep pockets.

[redrumloa]

@ami_junki

Actually it is a myth that Amiga was ever a low cost computer. Certain models like the A500 itself you could argue for the specs it was reasonable, but even addons for the A500 were sky-high. Forget about big box Amigas, one of the reason Commodore died was the nose-bleed prices of the big boxes.

[nine3o]

Terminator4 wrote:

as I got my A4000 for $650 (sure makes it look like a bargain now, if i'm desperate b/c i need bread to feed myself this is a nice investment)

I thought you got a great deal considering that machine was near mint and came with a CV64/3D card :-D

How is the old beast holding up?

[Ilwrath]

@RedRumLoa

Actually it is a myth that Amiga was ever a low cost computer

I TOTALLY beg to differ on that...

The A1000 was priced competitively against other high end computers of the day (around $1500).  But look how much better it was than ANYTHING ELSE in the home market at the time.  It could be easily argued that this was a bargain price.

The A500 was priced downright cheap.  The only thing near it's price range were the old 8-bitters.  And, yes, expansions did seem expensive, but really weren't much more than for other systems.  $600 for a hard drive seems a lot when it attaches to a $600 computer.  Somehow that same $600 hard drive doesn't seem as outrageous when it attaches to a $1500 computer.  And, really, did the Amiga 500 NEED a hard drive?  Mine never did.

The A2000 was priced in the mid range of PC clones.  And, again, WAY more advanced.  Heck, for the price of an upper-end PC clone, you could get an A2000 with a PC emulator, and have both.  That was a GREAT deal.

The A3000 started creeping up in price.  Commodore was trying to define it as a high-end workstation.  It was, but by name, it was associated with games market the Amiga 500 was still dominating.  

The A1200 and A4000 were released late, and Commodore's goose was already cooked by this time.  They weren't bargains at all, but simply sold to the people that already loved Amigas.

By 1992 or so, I'd agree that the price advantage compared to the market was a myth, but I never would have started with the Amiga at all had the A500 not been so much cheaper than any other modern computer of 1989.

[nishtek]

@Ilwrath

I agree with you.  By early 90s CBM definitely lost its competitive edge, and none would be impressed (other than amiga users) with A1200/4000/4000T (16.7 million palette - those machines should have had 24 bit build in with all colors available to user, not just 256, but flicker fixer build in for vga monitors - just like a3000, price at least same or close to a PC compatible )  and SCSI-2 at least not slower ide.
By comparisson, paid $2000 for 386-dx40 with dot matrix printer, monitor, added Sound Blaster 16 ISA card cost $300 back then but still, who would be convinced to buy an amiga 4000? (more than $2300)
By the way anyone that thinks amigas are cheap should look at 68060s and PPC (also issue of hardware availability). :-o

Today, same challenge exists.  How to make a low cost computer.  The challenge to Acube/Hyperion is to find a partner, who would be willing to mass produce the next generation amiga, one with office suite, graphics package, 99% accurate emulation of classic amiga software with browser (firefox port would be nice) - motherboard price of $400.  User can add cheap hardware or buy complete pre-built system for $600-700.

[terminator4]

@nine3o

She's holding up great.  I installed a socket for the battery (so i can replace it easily with 2032).  That price seems now like a good deal (at the time of purchase seemed a lot as A4000s sold for $300).  But i ain't selling it, not unless i'm hungry and need bread to feed myself  :roflmao:   Still, considering you didn't have to ship it (this thing weighs a ton) this was good deal for both of us i hope.
I wish i could find a faster cpu for it (040 is kinda sluggish but ok)... :-)
Did you end up keeping the A1200 or you got rid of all your amiga gear? :-P

[X-ray]

All depends on the model of Amiga. I don't regard ANY A4000T as ever being sold cheap, brand new.
Same applies to 060s and PPCs. Nothing cheap, and at the time they came out on Amiga cards, there were cheaper and faster options on other platforms.
It is all about the sum total of the experience. That's what people pay for, components to contribute to that 'Amiga feeling'
 ;-)

[nine3o]

Kept the A1200, it's the last Amiga I have.  Decided to convert all the SCSI stuff to IDE (that is a bit different since I have always ran SCSI on my Amiga gear, learning experience) so I can stuff a small IDE CD/DVD drive inside the case and free up some desk space.

It was a GREAT deal for both of us, cause I knew it was going into good hands.

But at the time, no A4000T's sold for $300, especialy a near mint one like mine.

And if you do need to sell for bread, I would gladly buy it back. :-D

[terminator4]

it would take a while for me to sell it (if ever) :-D

[orange]

well Amigas are slowly 'dying' but so are we, I think prices will drop but don't know when. Do you think your children will buy old Amiga hardware at all?
Also, people get bored with old games eventually and then start selling.

[nine3o]

orange wrote:
Do you think your children will buy old Amiga hardware at all?

I doubt they will buy amiga hardware because they never experienced the Amiga life before the crumble of C= plus they will all have some type of handheld device with them (e.g. pre-teens all having cell phones) with quite a bit of horse power that would emulate this stuff with no effort.

Considering there is already handheld emulation on the PSP and GP2X, no one will want to be confined to a desk any more and emulation will take over when our kids grow up and take our positions.

[darksun9210]

i don't know how much of the amiga scene will get taken on by younger generations...

maybe kids these days will in years to come be fighting over PS3's and things in twenty years time?

i'm not sure about the demo scene anymore. its not like you can do any coding for an Xbox360 or is it?... iPhone SDK? yeah right... looks destined to be dominated by the latest PC DirectX powered same ol' same ol' pixel shader/stream processor workout within the sandbox of a microsoft environment...

all i know is, i'm never going to "sell up" again. what i got now and will get in the future, you can pry from my cold dead fingers! :-D
what my (if i have any) kids make of it (Dad's being backwards again!) is down to them.

[Gavilan]

First of all, let me tell you guys that i have learnt a lot from all your different point of views.

Maybe i should have cleared out some point at the beginning of my topic, but hey, i was desperate...

anyway, i feel in some way very sad, and in some way very happy.

Why? Well, for the beginning, for me, being "forced" to sell this Amiga hardware (knowing is "priceless", or at least, knowing that only few thousands units were made (its not like a hard drive or a floppy drive for a pc, but then, try to convince my mother of that, for her, im just a "junkie collector", and i dont live in a flat, i live in a "deposit full of old useless hardware stuff)  :-D ), was very difficult.
Im saying "forced", because i really needed the money, and my Amiga hardware are among the most expensive things i have in my house.
Happy, because i know for sure they went to very good hands ("new" amiga users in Argentina, a small but fast growing community), and happy becasue i could afford and paid my debts

Sad, on the other hand, because i know, these stuff is special, very special for me. I know theres live beyond Amiga, but you have no idea how many years i saved money to afford one PPC card, for example.
I was a kid reading Amiga Format or CU Amiga, and dreamed a lot about having one of those cards.
I didnt have much time to enjoy them full time, and like my mother said to me: "keep up the good memories, and the time you used them".
For me, thats an elegant way of telling me another story i dont wanna hear, but thats my problem, i know. She will never understand my passion with this loyal machine.

anyway, all my stuff, my important stuff is gone, im with empty hands, clean consious, zero money i owe to other people, and now the roll begins again...

Time to begin saving for "new" Amiga stuff....who knows, maybe im lucky and get another PPC card in the near future for a "realistic price". And please let me do an explanation  here: in Argentina, our currency is VERY weak. So, to afford someting, wheter be dollars, euros or pounds, you really have to save a lot of money. Maybe that was my point, that to pay sometimes the end up prices of some Amiga eBay items, are impossible for people from this side of the world...

I dont discuss their value, and of course if there is a market and people willing to pay, then maybe thats a fair price, but i was refering to the financial situation in my country, even tough i know the financial crisis is globalized.
I really wish i could earn my salary in euros or dollars...that way i could afford 100% times more Amiga hardware (but then i would go nuts for sure...)

Maybe being an Amiga user in this part of the world is not the cheapest hobby, but hey, its SO fun!!!!

Thanks a lot guys for all support, understanding, and your points of view

Sincerely

Sebastian