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Author Topic: We Need a Philanphropist  (Read 5088 times)

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Offline Vlabguy1

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2008, 03:19:30 PM »
Believe me..this is one of the reasons why I play the lottery..If I win a couple of Million..I would def. contribute to the Amiga.  


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Offline Phantom

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2008, 03:45:14 PM »
The best think is to attract a Saudi-Arabian businessman. One other solution is Bill Gates. Don't laugh with that. :lol:  :lol:
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Offline mfletcher

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2008, 04:33:53 PM »
Quote

bloodline wrote:
Quote

CLS2086 wrote:
Quote
Amiga Inc. own nothing of value.

Yes they do ! Patents and rights !! :rtfm:


Patents on technology that can't even be made any more... valueless.
Right to what? The name? What does the name actually matter?

You would do well not to use that smiley with me... you are welcome to disagree with me, but I am well read on the subject of Amiga.


Calm Down! Sheesh! You sound like a prima donna.

These patents might not hold any value to you, but to a lawyer, its a potential revenue stream i.e. they can sue your ass off if you try to infringe upon them. A lot of law firms deal with nothing but Patent IP prosecution and do just fine.

The name, the brand "Amiga", has something in spades that perhaps Minimig, AROS, etc lack. Recognition. Picture your average 30 something joe walking into Curry's or Dixons. He may or may not have owned an Amiga at one point. Anyway, which is he more likely to recognise? Amiga, or Minimig?

Ive been thinking a bit of where the Amiga is going and what hopes it has of being resurrected. To be honest, the conditions that made the Amiga popular back in the 80's and early 90's are gone now.  The Amiga sold in a price range that the PC could not compete. Nowadays you can buy PC's for cheaper.

And hoping that it could be bought up by an Indian or Chinese firm and sold to the markets there? Aint going to happen. You could get a PC for the same amount of money and have Linux installed on it. Bang all you want about how great OS 4 and AROS are, but Linux is more mature and has a lot more support, momentum. Theres no way an Amiga based OS could be a selling point.

And it wont take off in the third world either. As One Laptop Per Child (OLPC) has demonstrated, people in these countries have more pressing concerns (ie food, water, some electricity) than owning a cheap laptop.

The future doesnt look bright.
 

Offline matthey

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2008, 05:58:34 PM »
Quote

mfletcher wrote:
You could get a PC for the same amount of money and have Linux installed on it. Bang all you want about how great OS 4 and AROS are, but Linux is more mature and has a lot more support, momentum. Theres no way an Amiga based OS could be a selling point.

And it wont take off in the third world either. As One Laptop Per Child (OLPC) has demonstrated, people in these countries have more pressing concerns (ie food, water, some electricity) than owning a cheap laptop.


The selling point of the Amiga is that it uses less resources needing less electricity from using slower processors, less memory and smaller storage requirements. A modern Amiga using (fewer) standard "PC" parts could be produced in quantity for cheaper and marketed as a "green" computer. Amiga still beats Linux in ease of use too. Obstacles are of course, lack of modern Amiga applications as you mentioned, and Amiga Inc. killing everything Amiga related. Nothing a rich Amiga philanphropist can't take care of. I'm building my fortune now with my net worth doubling about every 3 years as I was in early on oil and agriculture :idea:.
 
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2008, 06:31:10 PM »
Quote

mfletcher wrote:
Quote

bloodline wrote:
Quote

CLS2086 wrote:
Quote
Amiga Inc. own nothing of value.

Yes they do ! Patents and rights !! :rtfm:


Patents on technology that can't even be made any more... valueless.
Right to what? The name? What does the name actually matter?

You would do well not to use that smiley with me... you are welcome to disagree with me, but I am well read on the subject of Amiga.


Calm Down! Sheesh! You sound like a prima donna.


Maybe I am!

Quote

These patents might not hold any value to you, but to a lawyer, its a potential revenue stream i.e. they can sue your ass off if you try to infringe upon them. A lot of law firms deal with nothing but Patent IP prosecution and do just fine.


Except all the patents that covered the Amiga are both of no modern technological value and expired... You do realise that Patents only have a life of about 20 years... Technological, the Amiga is to modern computer what the Gloster Meteor is to the F22...

Quote

The name, the brand "Amiga", has something in spades that perhaps Minimig, AROS, etc lack. Recognition. Picture your average 30 something joe walking into Curry's or Dixons. He may or may not have owned an Amiga at one point. Anyway, which is he more likely to recognise? Amiga, or Minimig?


It would make no difference now. The Amiga brand has no market value... Even the Commodore brand has more value, though clearly given the fact the last company to use the brand has just gone bankrupt, it isn't worth very much.

It would cost a fortune to give the Amiga brand recognition now... it's been out of the public eye too long, and even then, it was never a mass market (computers were niche in those days) or premium brand.

Quote

Ive been thinking a bit of where the Amiga is going and what hopes it has of being resurrected. To be honest, the conditions that made the Amiga popular back in the 80's and early 90's are gone now.  The Amiga sold in a price range that the PC could not compete. Nowadays you can buy PC's for cheaper.


This is all very true... it's also true of the technological problems that the Amiga was designed to solve...

Quote

And hoping that it could be bought up by an Indian or Chinese firm and sold to the markets there? Aint going to happen. You could get a PC for the same amount of money and have Linux installed on it. Bang all you want about how great OS 4 and AROS are, but Linux is more mature and has a lot more support, momentum. Theres no way an Amiga based OS could be a selling point.

And it wont take off in the third world either. As One Laptop Per Child (OLPC) has demonstrated, people in these countries have more pressing concerns (ie food, water, some electricity) than owning a cheap laptop.

The future doesnt look bright.


There is no future for the Amiga as a mass market machine. But it has massive hobby potential, the popularity of Minimig has proved that.

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2008, 09:48:20 PM »
Quote

bloodline wrote:
There is no future for the Amiga as a mass market machine. But it has massive hobby potential, the popularity of Minimig has proved that.


You might be right, but otoh, you might be wrong: a fast Amiga with HDMI output and an HDTV digitizer might sell really well as a set-top box! An amiga-based tv recorder that could also play existing video games, and which promoted the development of new software by not locking up the tools and documentation would be hot.

The end cost of a system like that could be lower than that of buying an HD tivo and a Wii, assuming you build the whole thing with commodity-grade PC hardware and just provide the legacy application support via software emulation.

IMHO, there's still room in the marketplace for more than one product per application.
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2008, 09:59:43 PM »
Quote

pkillo wrote:
Quote

bloodline wrote:
There is no future for the Amiga as a mass market machine. But it has massive hobby potential, the popularity of Minimig has proved that.


You might be right, but otoh, you might be wrong: a fast Amiga with HDMI output and an HDTV digitizer might sell really well as a set-top box! An amiga-based tv recorder that could also play existing video games, and which promoted the development of new software by not locking up the tools and documentation would be hot.

The end cost of a system like that could be lower than that of buying an HD tivo and a Wii, assuming you build the whole thing with commodity-grade PC hardware and just provide the legacy application support via software emulation.

IMHO, there's still room in the marketplace for more than one product per application.


Really? I popped the lid off my set-top box/HD recorder I have here... the box contains a single chip (which is built by Broadcom and handles everything! HD video and 5.1 stereo sound) + 16meg of RAM + a 80gig HD... the whole thing cost £99 two years ago... There is no way any Amiga based system could ever compete with that!!!

If you honestly think a late 80's hardware/software solution has any place in the modern market then you really need to look into the state of the industry!!!

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2008, 12:00:14 AM »
No system that relied on antiquated hardware designs could succeed in this arena of course. But you didn't understand me; I'm not talking about selling souped up minimigs in a set top box. I'm talking about selling a modern PC in a set top box, and taking advantage of the intellectual property related to the Amiga that still has some residual value: the software.

A Wii or PS3 goes for US$400 and an HD TiVo goes for US$200+, so that's $600. It's totally possible to build and sell decent computers for that price. Heck, at volume you can do it for 75% of that price - Dell does. Given the rights to and possession of the IP involved, it would be more than possible to develop a system that was Amiga-like but built around existing Intel processors and PC chipsets.

With the ability to run 68k and PPC Amiga software in emulators that worked like Apple's Classic environment for OS X but with greater transparency to the end user, you'd immediately have a large base of applications and games that could be distributed to end-users digitally, at little cost. Build in a few nice apps (like an iMovie work-alike that you could run from a handheld remote and an MP3 player tht can talk to your iPod) and give them away with the system, and many people would buy it.
 

Offline swosloverTopic starter

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2008, 12:08:27 AM »
I still think there is a market somewhere between the Apple and PC markets.

Not everyone wants a PC or Mac, even where they do want a Mac they may not want to pay Apple prices.

A cheap alternative to a PC is something which I believe could be a marketing possibility.

TBH though I can't imagine it will be long before either Sony or Microsoft shift apps with their consoles.




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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #23 on: June 01, 2008, 12:27:15 AM »
Sony I can see doing that; not Microsoft, though. They need you buying a console _and_ a copy of Windows for your PC.
 

Offline swosloverTopic starter

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #24 on: June 01, 2008, 12:33:19 AM »
What if you could buy windows as well?
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Offline bloodline

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #25 on: June 01, 2008, 01:34:15 AM »
Quote

pkillo wrote:
No system that relied on antiquated hardware designs could succeed in this arena of course. But you didn't understand me; I'm not talking about selling souped up minimigs in a set top box. I'm talking about selling a modern PC in a set top box, and taking advantage of the intellectual property related to the Amiga that still has some residual value: the software.


Right... ok, But I'm not convinced that the Amiga platform has any software to offer... Remember it has been 15 years now since the Amiga was a viable commercial platform... The Open Source community has filled the space the Amiga could have competed in.

Quote

A Wii or PS3 goes for US$400 and an HD TiVo goes for US$200+, so that's $600. It's totally possible to build and sell decent computers for that price. Heck, at volume you can do it for 75% of that price - Dell does. Given the rights to and possession of the IP involved, it would be more than possible to develop a system that was Amiga-like but built around existing Intel processors and PC chipsets.


Well... yes, that would be the only way, if there is a way...

Quote

With the ability to run 68k and PPC Amiga software in emulators that worked like Apple's Classic environment for OS X but with greater transparency to the end user, you'd immediately have a large base of applications and games that could be distributed to end-users digitally, at little cost.


Apple used software translators as stop gaps only... I own several Macs... but all my software is intel... The Amiga platform has been out of action too long, and that is the problem... If you are going to use Emulators to offer the entire software base, then you may as well run the Emulator on a modern OS, like Linux for free (My set top actually uses Linux!).

Quote

Build in a few nice apps (like an iMovie work-alike that you could run from a handheld remote and an MP3 player tht can talk to your iPod) and give them away with the system, and many people would buy it.


Ahh... this is where it falls down... In order to make the Amiga platform attractive you need to write new apps... but the Amiga lacks even basic standard modern OS features... SMP support, Multiuser, Journaled File system and Memory Protection... Retrofitting them into AmigaOS would render it incompatible with all old Amiga software even at a source code level. So why waste time  try to bolt alien concepts onto AmigaOS... when you could use a free well-proven alternative like Linux.. which already has all the software already written, often free and open source?

Offline Nlandas

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2008, 08:34:18 PM »
Quote

swoslover wrote:
We need a rich, Amiga lover anyone know any?

Perhaps Roman Abramovich used an a500 in his youth!

Then we can have some new ppc cards!


Would you only want a PPC card for your aging system or a whole new motherboard with access to newer equipment? I know the retro appeal of Amiga is why some people stay. I'm hear for that now too but I'd really love to buy a new motherboard that ran AmigaOS.

I know I'm dreaming but if someone with deep pockets got a license for AOS 4, when the legal battles are over, and funded a new hardware board with some kind of backwards compatibility, wouldn't Amigans buy that? Maybe not, I'd like it though.

Otherwise, NatAmi and Clone-A are our best hope for hardware to carry us as our systems start to die. I've already been through one A4000.

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Offline Fester

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2008, 09:26:11 PM »
Perhaps a hobbyist with loads of resources could recapture the excitement of the Amiga with some up-to-date technology? Market it for the hell of it and enjoy it for what it is?

Having someone invest in our tough little classic would certainly be something I'd follow with great interest.

But we have excellent emulators, I still have hope for AROS, we have the Minimig and perhaps the Minimig 2 or the Extra Super Minimig someday?

There's plenty of fun things to follow even without the influx of serious money.

 

Offline Darrin

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2008, 10:32:49 PM »
Quote

Boot_WB wrote:
My name's Rich, and I'm an Amiga lover :-).

Does that count?


Only if you have a mate named Phil who is an anthropologist.

...  OK, that was a really bad joke.  :-D
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Offline WotTheFook

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Re: We Need a Philanphropist
« Reply #29 from previous page: June 11, 2008, 10:38:50 PM »
I'm sorry, but for some of the suggestions in this thread, we don't need a philanthropist, we need a psychiatrist.

It's a hobby that's getting on for 20 years old guys, enjoy it for what it is now and what it was. Minimig, Natami, etc. have a place in that they allow more modern hardware to run 1990s software without a floppy drive of a type that's almost extinct now.

The Amiga hardware is as obsolete as a Sega Megadrive, Super Nintendo, Atari ST etc. I don't think anyone is seriously going to build a 21st Century piece of kit with backwards compatibility to 1990s Amiga hardware on a production scale, it's too small a market these days and any investor will want projections on payback and profits which just couldn't be predicted.

No-one is prepared to take that financial risk, that's why these home brewed projects stay as little more than that. A-Cube a taking a risk with Minimig that may not pay off longer term, that's more than likely.

Sorry, I'm not wearing rose-coloured glasses tonight.