Amiga OS4 on old (PPC) Macs

[Raffaele]

persia wrote:
It would be hard for Amiga to compete without a killer app, actually without any of the "standard" apps let alone a killer app.  It can render web pages

Amiga browsers such as AWeb and IBrowse render web pages upto HTML 3.2 and no CSS...

Although nowadays vaste majority of forum sites, and newspaper sites are now full of CSS...

Luckily it is now available OWB Browser [see news here on Amiga.org] which handle both HTML 4 and CSS and then you can see any internet page...

can't handle html mail.

You can tell your mail program to view it thru external HTML viewers such as Strangé (pronounced as "Strange-eh")

http://alfie.altervista.org/soft/strange.html

http://alfie.altervista.org/images/strange.jpg



That uses htmlview datatype

It's video and audio editors are primitive.

Sure you are right about video editors... But take a look at modern Amiga audio editors...

Have you ever seen programs such as DigiboosterPro, or Sound-FX or HD-REC?



http://www.hd-rec.de/

  You can't open Adobe docs

http://www.flickr.com/photos/54643129@N00/714589386/

 or see flash on youtube.

For simply flash swf files the Amiga SWF player has just being updated two days ago

http://aminet.net/package/gfx/show/FlashPlayer

For common handling of Youtube, in MorphOS we have a good italian Arexx script TUBEXX, which performs all the task simply using HTTPResume and mPlayer.

Some OS4 users in Italy are porting it to OS4...

http://www.webalice.it/pgermano/tubexx/main.html

You can't edit raw images.

Digicamgui reads any Camera with PICTBRIDGE standard:

http://www.seal-amiga.co.uk/robert/amipodder/projects.html#digicamgui



PTPDigCAM:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/54643129@N00/712913997/

Also MorphOS ShowGirls could import various image formats such as RAW...

http://www.webalice.it/fulvio.peruggi/public/Pegasos&MorphOS/Articles/06_MorphOS_TLOS/showgirls_001.jpg

See also:

http://amiga.sourceforge.net/

And check there for ImageMagick suite...

You can't edit and host webpages on it.

Metalweb:

http://www.vapor.com/metalweb/



Amaya (available thru cygnix X11 engine):

http://os4depot.net/?function=showfile&file=network/browser/amaya.zip

http://wookiechat.amigarevolution.com/pics/amaya_os4_1.png
http://wookiechat.amigarevolution.com/pics/amaya_os4_2.png

Famous Apache web-manager (native on Amiga):

You can't open a Word document.

http://pegasos.jinak.cz/clanky/amiga_programy/final_writer.gif

Amiga Writer loads Word files upto version 6 or 7 (Word2000)

I do not remember exactly what of them...

Documents of Word 6 or 7 could be easily loaded and saved by any Windows Office Suite...

Who would buy it and why?  

Sure you have been away from Amiga scene from loooong time don't you?
 :roll:  :lol:  :-P  :-P

[guru-666]

funny, I have always questioned the value of my amiga in 2007, but after all my other machine went down I have been using my amiga 4kt060 for several months and find I can do LOTS of stuff. I still have other machines at work but still the amiga is more usefull than I used to think...

[AeroMan]

@Raffaele

  Wow, quite cool... ... I'm a bit outdated about Amiga Apps.
  What is the base machine I need to run all of this ?


     Marcelo

[motorollin]

Well legal or not, I'm now convinced that this works. Having had another suggestion from AmigaMac, I got my copy of the OS4 boot CD to boot on my Mac Mini and get as far as launching ExecSG, and then it just went to a black screen. I assume this is because my model of Mac Mini isn't the same as the one the boot CD is written for, which apparently causes problems with the video driver.

--
moto

[DBAlex]

@motorollin:

Holy Cr*p man!

Could you send the files to me perhaps? (Shall I PM you my Email?)

I have a late 2005 G4 Mini with a 64mb Radeon 9200, Will it work?

Thanks, Alex.  :-o [Posted from the Mac Mini]

[spihunter]

I thought that all the mini's came with Radeon 9200's. How could it be that different, that one would boot and one wouldnt? :-?

[DBAlex]

@spihunter

Agreed, Although i'm not sure if motorollin is talking about the two different models from when Apple secretely bumped up the mini's specs, meaning one still had a 1.42ghz G4 CPU with a 32mb Radeon 9200 and one had a 1.5ghz G4 CPU with an upgraded 64mb 9200 [The model I own]

Maybe these are the differences he is referring to possibly?

Alex. :-D

[Raffaele]

DBAlex wrote:
@motorollin:

Holy Cr*p man!

Could you send the files to me perhaps? (Shall I PM you my Email?)

I have a late 2005 G4 Mini with a 64mb Radeon 9200, Will it work?

Thanks, Alex.  :-o [Posted from the Mac Mini]

AHHHH!

At least one people with the right MacMini and the right Firmware...

Please let him download that wannabe loader, so he could test it, and in the end we will see if that was an hoax or not...

However Alex be careful...

backup your MacOS X installation, because this loader could be malicious software and harm your computer...

I warned you...  :oops:

[DBAlex]

@Raffaele

Holy Cr*p! [Again]

Now my heart is beating fast.. ahhhh! Where do I download it? How do you know I really have the *right* mac model?

And I just bought a 320gb External HD so I can back up the Mac to that... But im going to nuke this machine soon anyway and install Linux, Me and OSX have never really got on...! ;-)

Also, please PM me with details of how you think my mac is the correct model...! and also links to downloads etc ... Thanks!

 :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)

[spihunter]

@DBAlex,

I have the file to if you cant get anyone to email it to you. Let me know....

I just want to know if this works or not. even if its limited...

[Raffaele]

by AeroMan on 2007/12/30 1:44:26

@Raffaele

Wow, quite cool... ... I'm a bit outdated about Amiga Apps.
What is the base machine I need to run all of this ?

Audio programs run with normal Classic Amigas, you just add some more ram and a good accelerator card with at least 68020...

You must have also good soundcards to get them work at their best...

Metalweb web-designer it is not produced anymore by Vaporware, if I remember well, but you can still found it in some shops.

It will be better if someone could buy the program sources and update it and enhance it with new features.

The same it is for AmigaWriter.

Amaya runs with any Amiga equipped with Cygnix X11 engine...

But even if Cygnix it is 68K compliant, it is better to run it from a PPC... Else it will slow down the 68xxx (020, 030, 040) and become to be usable starting from 68040, 68060

Programs like Showgirls work only into MorphOS PPC...

PTPdigCam and DigicamGUI should work on PPC hardware...

Strangé HTML Viewer for Email programs (and more) works on any Amiga (with at least OS2.1 I think)

OWB works only on PPC OS4.0

Amiga Apache I don't know if it has been updated recently but it works flawlessly even on ancient Amigas...

Sure you need to have at least 68020, 030, or 040 if you do not just want to create webpages to be put in servers, and you want that your Amiga will be the server...

But sure Amiga Apache it is hard to be hacked...

There was an Amiga Server in 1999/2000 which sustained heavy DDOS attack, and pirates were not capable to hacking it...

Then it generates so much trafic that the provider closed the communication with it, but it was not taken down by the malicious attacks...

(Must find again the forum site and forum thread in which I read of this fact...)  :roll:

[DBAlex]

@spihunter:

PM Sent.

@Raffaele:

PM Sent too IIRC  :-)

[Raffaele]

Sorry double post...

[Colani1200]

motorollin wrote:
I assume this is because my model of Mac Mini isn't the same as the one the boot CD is written for, which apparently causes problems with the video driver.

Did you try this with the OS 4 classic CD? I read somewhere that the A1 version is needed, maybe that is the problem.

[motorollin]

Colani1200 wrote:
Did you try this with the OS 4 classic CD? I read somewhere that the A1 version is needed, maybe that is the problem.

It doesn't ask for another CD, so I assume it just boots from the boot disc. Unless I'm missing something...

--
moto

[HenryCase]

Hans wrote:
DRM code in UBoot? I doubt it. That would be the silliest place to put copy protection as replacing the bios would eliminate it. I'm not even sure if there is any DRM code in OS4; the A1 or classic Amiga hardware are dongles enough as-is.

Fair point.

Hans wrote:
I doubt that analysing UBoot would give you much knowledge about OS4 as it only affects the bootloader that copies the Kernel modules into RAM. I doubt that it would be too hard to write an alternative bootloader; the second-level booter basically searches for a kickstart directory and loads the modules as per instructions in the kicklayout file.

The real issue remains the drivers, and the fact that the HAL is compiled right into the kernel. It would make more sense to decompile the Loader module, and the kernel. Someone who could isolate the HAL code sections would be able to create a patch in such a way that the patch code contains no copyrighted IP. Replacing the HAL is a sizeable task.

I thought the BIOS would give us some clues about how the drivers worked, didn't realise the HAL (HAL = Hardware Abstraction Layer, right?) was purely run through software.

Hans, can you explain how the A1 version of OS4 boots (from your understanding of the matter)? I have never seen an A1 booting so my knowledge is limited. Does the system perform a POST?

Taking the display driver as an example, does the BIOS have to load the software kernel before anything is displayed on screen, or can you, like on x86 PCs, bring up BIOS settings on screen before the main OS starts?

motorollin wrote:
Well legal or not, I'm now convinced that this works. Having had another suggestion from AmigaMac, I got my copy of the OS4 boot CD to boot on my Mac Mini and get as far as launching ExecSG, and then it just went to a black screen.

That's awesome. You're not the only one to have some success here either:
http://moobunny.dreamhosters.com/cgi/mbmessage.pl/amiga/152833.shtml

Colani1200 wrote:
Did you try this with the OS 4 classic CD? I read somewhere that the A1 version is needed, maybe that is the problem.

The versions of OS4 released so far are meant to be similar, but I agree that the A1 version is more likely to be successful, as the h/w for MacMini is closer to A1 h/w than CSPPC/BPPC h/w. Also, if these are the leaked Project Moana files it would have been developed with A1 OS4 as Classic OS4 wasn't as complete at the time the Moana announcement was made.