Do you consider either the PegososPPCs or AmigaOne to be true Amigas?

[Hammer]

Until the "AmigaOne" can run AmigaOS4.0, it will not be a true Amiga.

---------------
redfox

I recall that the AmigaOne was packaged with the _licensed_ Amiga’s Kickstart ROMs for Linux PPC/UAE setup…

[Hammer]

What operating system it runs doesn't matter.

It does matter. What happens if the OS includes a virtual Amiga chipset functions?

Running Linux on an Amiga still leaves you with an Amiga.

Such a set-up still requires Amiga's Kickstart functions to boot into 68K Linux.

Running Windows/MacOS on other hardware doesn't turn your machine into a X86/Mac.

Running MS Windows NT 4.0 on DEC Alpha AXP or PowerPC or MIPS will turn your box into a MS Windows NT 4.0 box.

Once upon time, Microsoft has a vision of running Windows NT everywhere. Except they forgotten the transparent recompiling concepts (e.g. dotNET framework).

Note that SoftWindows 95 (for MacOS platform) was based from the licensed MS Windows 95 source code.  In a sense, it’s closest for Microsoft to release a MS Windows 95 for the PowerPC platform.

[Brian]

I consider the AmigaOne to be a true Amiga once the OS4 runs nativly on it's chips. I consider the Pegasos to be nothing more than an Amiga emulator running on PPC with it's own compatible OS.

It's a bit like asking if ppl consider PowerMac to be a true Mac, only with the difference that it's a huge step for the Amiga due to *include full Amiga history here*.

But nice of you to start yet another Ami vs Peg thread, we sure need those. :-P

[teo]

I dont really consider either to be a real true amiga right now. But i would say the AmigaOne with AOS4 wil be more of an amiga that pegasos, only because of its official partnerships and branding. Mind you i wouldnt mind running AOS4+ on whichever is the better board based on my personal requirements in future, performance vs cost vs size. Yes smaller is better to me as i can do far cooler cases and dont need more than 1 or 2 pci slots.

I think people opinions will change when AOS4 comes out and runs on many hardware configurations, and this question will become as ambiguous as "Do you consider either the ASUS's or GIGBYTE's to be true PC's?"

Speaking of which, one thing amiga should consider in my opinion (and some others ive spoken to as well) is porting aos to x86 but only support a small group of boards and chipsets, eg certain ASUS or GIGABYTE models. This would get the prices down, the performance up, fix supply problems and solve the compatability problems with the multitude of PC hardware configs out there (as amiga would only support a few of the best and most reliable ones) They have already apparently made the OS mostly hardware independant now apart from a small group of functions... I wonder why...

[DaveP]

I think its a question of heritage. Without the operating systems neither Peg or A1 retain enough of the Amiga hardware heritage ( any! ) to be called "Amigas" purely from that point of view.

AmigaONE with AOS4 will contain a significant amount of Amiga heritage - apart from ExecSG which is wholly new - in terms of source tree and re-use.

MorphOS with Pegasos will contain some Amiga heritage, that is the look and feel and the API but distinctly less.

Then finally you have the userbase, both contain users that have classic Amigas - but then so does the Windows and Linux communities so I think that one is far more nebulous.

So summary, in order of true Amiganess ( most to least ):
    A1 with AOS4
    Peg with MOS
    A1 and Peg on their own

[mikeymike]

Estimated time to thread degradation into MOS v OS4 flamefest T minus....

3 minutes to reach minimum safe distance...

[lempkee]

i think the answer is quite obvious here,

youhave amigaos and u have morphos , and the hardware? ... pegasos and amigaone.
beyond any reasonable doubt...amigaos is the reason why so many stayed on amiga, and pegasos aint amigaos.


anyway i think we need a vacation from this flamefest #### , i really dont see what there is to fight about or whatever......
both will continue and both will make noise, but this is only before the amigaos4 is out, i dont know what will happen after its released but i guess the world might explode?

=)))))

[Staticman]

I agree.
Now lets all go down the pub

:pint: :pint: :pint:

[Staticman]

-edit-

double post

[Madgun68]

..and pegasos aint amigaos.

That's because the pegasos is a motherboard. :roll:

[Warface]

It will be the usual, preference biased explanation for everyone. If someone decided for the AOS4/AONE then AOS4/AONE will be more Amiga, and the same is true for the opposite.

In my eyes neither the AmigaONE nor the Pegasos is an Amiga anymore. So much for remaining objective. :-)

On the subjective point, I consider the Pegasos being a turbocard for the Amiga, without the need for the classic Amiga itself. Yes, it was a long way, and call it evolution if you want: this fate was evident from the start. The ties connecting the Pegasos to the "root" are the engineers who created it, and the programmers behind it who made software for the turbocards.

On the AmigaONE side though, the ties are the Name and the Company which owns the name. The hardware have little to do with the roots apart from the sticker. Never the less, both solution is almost the same, that's the source of ppl trying to find and exaggerate the differences so desperately.

My Pegasos is not an Amiga, but I use it as an Amiga, and the transition was smooth enough for me to believe that.

It's just an opinion though. There are thousand others :-)

[takemehomegrandma]

Samuar wrote:

But, do people consider one or the other, or neither; to be true Amigas?

Well, I can't use my TV as a monitor and I can't exactly write copperlists on any of them, can I? ;-) Well, CPU modules is not that usual in x86, but hardware wise these new "Amigas" is pretty darn close to every standard PC out there. It has the same common CPU/NorthBridge/SouthBridge design. But remember how we allways have looked with great envy on all those cheap PC components, like Network Cards, Graphic Cards, Memory Modules, etc, some of which hardly were available at all to the Amiga computers (and when they were available, it had a 400% price tag compared to the PC). Now when we are finally there, now when we have pretty much everything we want integrated directly on the motherboard, is this the when we turn around and look back and say "it was better before"? No! Of course it would be nice to have a modern version of the Amiga custom hardware, but with regular PCI/AGP implemented as well. I wrote some comments on this on the A5000 thread. But that will never happen, because how does that make sense from a business point of view? What could a 2004 version of the AGA offer that standard PC components couldn't, and how will it justify the enourmous development costs?

Do you think whether it has AmigaOS 4 running on it would affect your opinion on the above question?

Not at all. OS4, AROS and MorphOS are all reimplementations of the classic AmigaOS 3.1 API, with some unique extensions of their own. The main difference between OS4 and MorphOS is the name, which is totally unimportant to me, and frankly I like the MorphOS design better! :-)

[takemehomegrandma]

Hammer wrote:

What operating system it runs doesn't matter.

It does matter. What happens if the OS includes a virtual Amiga chipset functions?

HW emulated in the OS? UAE is not an OS, but it emulates Hardware - is that a "real Amiga"? Perhaps, it's for sure the only Amiga a lot of people uses ...

[Lando]

Samuar wrote:
Serious question. Theres a bit of rivalry and competition between PegososPPCs and the AmigaOne. But, do people consider one or the other, or neither; to be true Amigas?

AmigaOne: No
It's a generic board, buggy, horrendously expensive and currently only runs linux.  The only connection it has in with the Amiga computer is the sticker that Eyetech put on it.  

Pegasos:  Yes.
It is custom designed (like the real Amiga) by Amiga hardware experts (like the real Amiga),  runs existing Amiga applications (both PPC and 68k) (like the real Amiga) .

Most people realise the Teron/AmigaOne is dead and it's only the real "name" fanatics who would still consider purchasing one, especially with all the problems people have been experiencing, and  the far-superior (and far cheaper) Pegasos II due out very soon.

Do you think whether it has AmigaOS 4 running on it would affect your opinion on the above question?

Maybe.  Since AmigaOS4 doesn't run on either of them right now we'll have to wait and see.  OS4 could be a buggy piece of crap.

Thanks for your replies in advance,

You are welcome.

[Step]

In my opinion, the AmigaOne series of computers is as much Amiga as the classic line ever was and is, the reason behind it is that it is endorsed and licensed by Amiga as the owner of the trademark, thus makes it a follower to the classic line, altough with a different approach of manufacturing. The same for the OS. The Amiga500 is no less an Amiga than the A1000 is just because Commodore began manufacturing them, right ?

As for the hardware, neither the AmigaOne nor the Pegasos (or whatever they will call it) is amigalike in the construction itself, but the AmigaOnes carry the name as they should, its just a matter of ownership.

Beos could be called Amigalike thanks to its hidden amiga mode, atheos, aros and many more aswell.
There's nothing wrong with calling MorphOS amigalike, cause it is. But it will not be more than that unless they aquire the official status of TM ownership.

[DaveP]

@Lando

Can you tone down your flamebait a bit. Some of us are trying to have a civilised discussion in here.