Pointing Fingers get chopped off.

[uncharted]

MarkTime wrote:
p.s.

you all are completely wrong.  It's the competition between AOS 4, Genesi, and AROS that has saved this community.

Without competition, we have stagnation.

I agree with this, however that isn't what I'm talking about.  I don't want a single amiga comapany, I want options.  I just don't want my options to behave like children arguing over who has the coolest bike.

In the real world businesses can be competitive without the crap we witness here.

[uncharted]

bloodline wrote:
I have always advocated cooperation between all the "factions".
It is my wish that all AmigaOS compatible systems remain.. well... compatible, in both Software and Hardware.

MOS and AROS have been able to cooperate, and thus our systems should, in theory at least, be compatible to some degree on the same hardware.

But it would have been nice to create an "open" standard from which we can all pool our resources and create one uber system.

Still politics, comercial interests and the need to make huge sums of money abound...  :-(

As I've just said, I'm not after everyone involved holding hands or having group hugs.  That opportunity has well and truely past, and probably wouldn't be in the best interest of the community.

I just want to see there being some agreement, not to bitch about each other constantly. It should be the products doing the talking.

I'd also like to see each OS available for all currently available hardware (obviously I'm talking PPC only here with the exception of AROS), this would give true choice to the customer.

[uncharted]

seer wrote:
Sure, but that's competition between companies, not end users.. This fighting between end users is pointless... Besides, the fighting between the CEO's is pointless as well.. The battle should be fought with good PR (Both sides suck at this) and independed reviews (That reminds me, Wayne ? Your Peg up and running ?)

I wish I could of put it as well as you have.  You've hit the nail on the head.  yes compitition is healthy, but the RIGHT kind of compitition.  If compitition in the Amiga market meant lower prices, better features, more support, greater reliabilty then great.  But what we get is bitching, backstabbing, and rivalries and feuds that have lasted over 5 years.  How does that benefit me? (or any other user)

[seer]

I wish I could of put it as well as you have.

You're welcome.. I'm sorry you didn't post your intended message tho..

But what we get is bitching, backstabbing, and rivalries and feuds that have lasted over 5 years.

Yes. To be honest, I couldn't care less that the end users are doing this. It's what I want and/or can get, not what another user wants me to get..

What does bother me is the "disgusting" (by lack of a better word) FUDding and namecalling between al companies involved..

Ah well.. Welcome in the wonderfull "World of Amiga" (Remember that ?)

How does that benefit me? (or any other user)

It doesn't. Simple as that.. I know a few people who won't buy anything from either side because of their stance towards each other and to some users that are online..

Reason ? If a CEO can't even be polite to a rival CEO or a user/customer (Even if the user/customer is isn't a nice chap), how "rude" is it's customer service going to be if I ever need them ?

--Edit--

But hey, what's 2 users in this market ?

[filson]

No-one is bothered about the bigger picture, everyone is wrapped up in thier own agendas, in their own camps, and in thier own hero worshiping to notice anything sensible

he he. the few and the many.
I don't think everybody is all wraped up like that. I know it had no intention in stereotyping everybody, but I hope that others will nod agreeingly when I say that we would just like an alternative to what is established computing and we would like to get some business support for this alternative.
Is it too much to ask for, to get an os that is not bogged down by greedy ceo's or total and utter chaos in its development?
Since when did we just had to accept that most commercial code is crap?

[Dagon]

-Edit- IMHO MarkTime is quite right, MOS and AROS made AInc sit up and take notice. I remember when they planned to end "AmigaOS" with the Classic line... The others (AROS, MOS and PowerOS) came along and AInc did a U-Turn... not the first or the last mind...

I remember on the Amiga irc net that fleecy or Bill had said that they won`t develop AmigaOS 4.0 unless AmigaOS 3.9 wouldn`t sell 50.000 copies.

I bet they didn`t have any intention of spending a cent for AmigaOS and they wanted just its userland for the Tao system they had licenced.

Then they didn`t have a choice so they let Hyperion develop further AmigaOS.

Well it would be very nice seeing AmigaDE on AmigaOS like other OSes have JavaVM, not replacing it.

I was very happy that MorphOS team would continue our beloved OS and it wouldn`t end with 3.9 because the new admins wanted to sell DE.
But now the plans have changed and AmigaOS will be out soon.

But it would have been nice to create an "open" standard from which we can all pool our resources and create one uber system.

We have the AmigaOS 3.x as a common API :-) it would be nice to have some more standards fot the new features these 3 AmigaOS will have.

That way it will be very easy for the developers to port their apps. Each OS will be benefited by that.

[reticuli]

Perhaps it's time for a divorce?

Let's face it, how can either side survive so long as the "community" is so bitter and dysfunctional?

To survive we have to attract outsiders to our preferred platforms but how many outsiders are going to be keen on joining either faction so long as this atmosphere of distrust and hate continues?

Genesi continually express they have no interest in the Amiga brandname and as such supporters of Genesi should honour Genesi by establishing a dedicated MorphOS community totally separate from the Amiga brandname.

BLASPHEMY!

Wait... think about it for a second. Surely making a name for yourself based on your own efforts is more appealing and rewarding than cashing in on an allegedly defunct brand? Wow... just imagine, if Genesi succeed, you can stand up smugly and say "We did it all by ourselves"

Meanwhile, the AmigaOS band walk away with the Amiga name (which, after all, Genesi has no interest in) leaving Amiga to either sink or swim purely on it's own merits.

And we all live happily ever after...



but...



... We all know that's utter BS.

Genesi want the Amiga name and they want it at all costs and both they and their supporters know that without some kind of link to the Amiga name MorphOS is as dead as a crispy peking duck in a chinese restaurant.

After all, that's why the MorphOS supporters are the biggest name followers of all. If the name didn't matter, they'd have left the Amiga sites years ago and tried to stand on their own two feet but, alas, the baby is still crawling.

[iamaboringperson]

So when will the Amiga community get it's dignity back?

itll take some time ;-)

[KennyR]

So when will the Amiga community get it's dignity back?

When it gets rid of useless do-nothing companies, name followers, FUD spreaders, greedy businessmen, blind followers, lying companies, trolls, hypocritical PC users who haven't owned an Amiga for years who still want to complain about the current state of the system, companies with awful customer support, the mid-90s attitude to progress, pirates, crappy PR, crackers of shareware, "ROMs" beggers, whiners, hackers, virus writers, apologists for any of the above, and general lamers.

Ich hoffe nur das AOS4 auf Pegasos laufen wird, da ich diesen schnuckeliger finde als das Teron-Board.

[artman]

@uncharted

"When will the Amiga Community get it's dignity back?"

Never lost mine bubba, Been with the Amiga since '85 or '86, can't remember exactly.  Always thought it was great, ever if everyone else was blind.  AInc could fold, and the rest of 'em could fold too.  I'd still be here having fun with my A2000.  Appreciate something for what it is, not for what you wish it could be.  Regards

[artman]

@kennyr

Damn, try breathin' into a paper bag.. see if that helps.  Just kiddin'! :-D  :-D  :-D

[Warface]

@Uncharted:

Your point sounds more and more like "you are all biased, except me"... Hope you are aware of your own agendas and bias. Expressed even in the first post, claiming an end for this... :-)

Those who are unaware of their own bias are the most dangerous.

[elendil]

@seer:

Some time ago somebody suggested that AOS lovers and MOS lovers would come together during a show and let them fight it out with foam (?) bats .. I still think some of those should have done that..

hahahah! I am all for that. You better fear me when I enter the battle frenzy with my blunt, black, heavy, two-handed rubber-sword!

Sincerely,

-Kenneth Straarup.