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Author Topic: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?  (Read 16275 times)

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Offline snowman040Topic starter

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Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« on: January 13, 2006, 01:15:17 AM »
Just wondering is Gateway still owner of Amiga patents ? I've seen some news about licences being sold, but who is THE owner ? And if someone recalls what was the amount of money involved in Gateway's Amiga Technologies buyout ?
 

Offline Dr_Righteous

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2006, 01:28:33 AM »
IIRC, everything Amiga that Gateway owned became the property of Amino Corp. which then started Amiga Inc... Then after some time sold it all off to KMOS Inc. which has now become Amiga Inc.

In short, Amiga Inc. owns all IP associated with Amiga... Hardware and Operating System.
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Offline yester64

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2006, 06:52:15 AM »
Just like to add, that Commodore is back in business. Well, of course its not the original Commodore, but we see.

http://us.gizmodo.com/gadgets/commodore/index.php

and the company webpage

http://hardware.commodoreworld.com
 

Offline Senex

Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2006, 08:31:54 AM »
It seems the real ownership is still with Gateway (or its subsidiary Amiga Development LLC, respectively), while Amino/AI got licences to some of the IP. Which exactly or if any at all they still possess seems to be unknown. At least so far noone I've talked to, be he a dealer or developer, seems to have ever seen a real proof of Amino/AI really possessing what they claim to own.

Well, so far just my experience and humble opinion as a plain user - if anyone did see real proof, I'd be glad of course to see him posting here to throw light on it. But as far as I do see the situation, there's only indirect proof - i.e. noone having publicly claimed yet to be the real owner instead.

Not to mention that already Escom could not prove in 1997 to exclusively own AmigaOS 3.1 source code as it was not part of the Commodore sales contract.
 

Offline boing

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2006, 10:13:31 AM »
You are correct.  I remember following this case when it was announced.

  AFAIK, and I'm rarely wrong (humble aren't I?) Aminos got the right to the name, but Gateway retained ownership of patents.  Frankly the new "Amigas" seem to lack all the novel hardware that makes an Amiga an Amiga. Haynie was right in one regard: they are more or less just PPC-based PC's.

  I have long wondered on this forum why so few people are aware of the ruling of the German court which really seemed to imply that Gateway only thought they bought the full Amiga rights.

  Since nobody challenged Gateway's ownership (and in fact people were happy to see a monied owner come along) it seems that the complications of international law (not to mention patents and the complexities of fledgling IP laws and precedents) have kept Gateway shielded from legal challenges.

 For all we know, Gateway found out after the fact that they really didn't have everything.  But they're in the US, and who in Germany has the interest and money to make an international challenge?  For all we know Aminos/Amiga/whomever knows they don't have an actual ownership to the OS and are desperately hoping nobody figures it out.

  Frankly I've often wondered by various interests haven't just hired a lwayer backtrack the various post-CBM "IP" transfers and find out where it all stands.  If Deloitte and Touche liquidators screwed up it may well be that at least the OS is floating around out there, actually unowned in a grey netherworld (legally).

  I don't see why the pios or bPlan guys or AROS or whomever don't just run with the ball once they confirm what the German court ruled. Confirmation wouldn't be very hard.

  Since nobody has protected a legitimate onwership of the OS, a judge might just give it to whomever asks first, or just consider it in the public domain due to lack of an interested/actual owner.  Continued ownership of trademarks requires demonstration of protection of that trademark and an orphaned OS might be treated similarly.

 

Offline Argus

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2006, 11:16:06 AM »
Ben Hermans is an attorney, perhaps Hyperion have quietly done just that.
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Offline Senex

Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2006, 11:27:54 AM »
@Argus

If so, then this would have had happened less than a year ago, not before. But indeed Hyperion would be the only ones who'd really benefit from doing so - AROS devs don't want the sources and MorphOS doesn't need them.
 

Offline motorollin

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2006, 11:34:39 AM »
Quote
Senex wrote:
AROS devs don't want the sources

Why not?

--
moto
Code: [Select]
10  IT\'S THE FINAL COUNTDOWN
20  FOR C = 1 TO 2
30     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA
40     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAAA
50  NEXT C
60  NA-NA-NAAAA
70  NA-NA NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA NAAA-NAAAAAAAAAAA
80  GOTO 10
 

Offline Senex

Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2006, 11:39:18 AM »
@motorollin

I guess it has simply progressed way too far to jeopardize it by any "pollution" through legally uncertain code.
 

Offline motorollin

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2006, 11:47:19 AM »
Would it be necessarily be illegal if boing's comment is correct?

Quote
Since nobody has protected a legitimate onwership of the OS, a judge might just give it to whomever asks first, or just consider it in the public domain due to lack of an interested/actual owner.


--
moto
Code: [Select]
10  IT\'S THE FINAL COUNTDOWN
20  FOR C = 1 TO 2
30     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA
40     DA-NA-NAAAA-NAAAA DA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAAA
50  NEXT C
60  NA-NA-NAAAA
70  NA-NA NA-NA-NA-NA-NAAAA NAAA-NAAAAAAAAAAA
80  GOTO 10
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2006, 11:50:48 AM »
Quote

motorollin wrote:
Quote
Senex wrote:
AROS devs don't want the sources

Why not?

--
moto


Because 68k asm source code for a 15 years old operating system is very close to useless. TECHNOLOGY HAS MOVED ON! :-D

Even Hyperion have stated that little of the origianl source code was used, do you really think it would have taken 4 years JUST to port an OS from one machine to the next with the full source code?

Offline amiga1084

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2006, 12:37:00 PM »
Hello All,

I still believe the rumor that Bill Gates/MicroShaft scared
Gateway to stop making,marking new Amiga.Why would you buy
the rights if all you want are the patents.Gateway was &
still is just other PC Clone company what are the patents worth
to them.They wanted to change but good old Billy Boy wouldn't
let them.Thats my opinion and I am sticking to it.Merv
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2006, 12:42:17 PM »
Quote

amiga1084 wrote:
Hello All,

I still believe the rumor that Bill Gates/MicroShaft scared
Gateway to stop making,marking new Amiga.Why would you buy
the rights if all you want are the patents.


It was a complete package, they bought it play around with it for a bit... got bored/sacred (whichever) and sold the trademark to a bunch of idiots.

They held the IP/Patents, 'cos patents are always good to have. But they have all expired now, Amiga is nothing but a valueless trademark now.

Offline Senex

Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2006, 12:46:54 PM »
@Amiga1084

They were considered useful (actively or passively) for law-suits with other companies.

Compare Gateway <-> HP:

"Also on July 2, 2004, Amiga Development LLC ("Amiga"), an entity affiliated with Gateway, filed a lawsuit against HP in United States District Court for the Eastern District of Texas, alleging infringement of three patents relating to computer monitoring, imaging and decoder technologies. Gateway seeks an injunction, unspecified monetary damages, interest and attorneys' fees. HP and HPDC have answered and counterclaimed, alleging infringement by Amiga and Gateway of four HPDC patents related to personal computer technology."
 

Offline gizmomelb

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2006, 01:11:43 PM »
Quote

boing wrote:

...
  Frankly I've often wondered by various interests haven't just hired a lwayer backtrack the various post-CBM "IP" transfers and find out where it all stands.  If Deloitte and Touche liquidators screwed up it may well be that at least the OS is floating around out there, actually unowned in a grey netherworld (legally).
...



My ears pricked up at that - if someone cares enough to fill me in on what the current known status is, as well as some of the background (I was out of the Amiga when the crash came) then I can ask my contacts at Deloittes and maybe I can do some digging around.  I work for a company that writes legal tracking and forensics software, and have good contact with Deloittes.  Not guaranteeing I can find anything (confidentiality and all that).. but at least I should be able to find out who the current listed owners of different names/IPs actually are, and possibly what isn't owned by anyone.

Gizmomelb