CV64/3D vs CV64

[samanosuke]

Right... I was planning on picking up a CV64/3D for my A3K but on stumbling upon another topic I am now not so sure. What I want to know is will the Amiga screens (via Ambra) be redirected to the CV64/3D saving the need for a monitor switcher? Does the CV64 have this option? Are any WarpGL games (eg Freespace) compatible with the CV64/3D? And if so are they playable? And finally is the performance of the CV64/3D really that bad? I am not sure which of the two to go for if any. Would I be better off picking up another Picasso IV instead?

[Amigaz]

samanosuke wrote:
Right... I was planning on picking up a CV64/3D for my A3K but on stumbling upon another topic I am now not so sure. What I want to know is will the Amiga screens (via Ambra) be redirected to the CV64/3D saving the need for a monitor switcher? Does the CV64 have this option? Are any WarpGL games (eg Freespace) compatible with the CV64/3D? And if so are they playable? And finally is the performance of the CV64/3D really that bad? I am not sure which of the two to go for if any. Would I be better off picking up another Picasso IV instead?

Wonder what Brian & Patrik says about this  :lol:

Guess those guys are the exeperts  :-)

Have an A4000 '060 with a CV64 3D here with CybergraphX V3 (V4 on the way to me) latest Warp GL installed.
Have sucessfully got Nighlong running and Quake I.
Haven't got freespace running yet, only get an error message saying No ModeID selected from the Freespace GUI after the Hyperion intro is finished, the system error code is 8000000B (freespace.exe).
Might be that I'm not using the latest CybergraphX.

[Brian]

Without the CV3D scandoubler there's no redirection possible with the CV3D. And with a scandoubler already in place on the A3000 it would be silly to get another one and bypass the builtin for this reason. Also the CV3D scandoubler would have to be moddifyed to fit the shorter graphicslot on the A3000. So for the saving of a monitor switch this is not the option. Going for the CV64 card you would save the need for a monitorswitch but I can't say if 3D software support it since it lack 3D hardware. Can't speak for the PIV at all.

[Amigaz]

Brian wrote:
Without the CV3D scandoubler there's no redirection possible with the CV3D. And with a scandoubler already in place on the A3000 it would be silly to get another one and bypass the builtin for this reason. Also the CV3D scandoubler would have to be moddifyed to fit the shorter graphicslot on the A3000. So for the saving of a monitor switch this is not the option. Going for the CV64 card you would save the need for a monitorswitch but I can't say if 3D software support it since it lack 3D hardware. Can't speak for the PIV at all.

Wonder how Patrik will comment this  :lol:
We are eager to hear his reply... :-D

[Lemmink]

As it was allready said If  you want to avoid the use of a monitorswitch go for thr CV64. Though a PIV is an option too, but as long as you don`t plan to use one of the PIV extramodules it`s a waste of money, as the Performance is just about equal and the A3000 allready has a scandoubler.

I won`t expect much in terms of 3D performance from the CV3D. The active support for the card in Warp3D stopped somewhere along the way, meaning the existing driver simply wasn`t updated from a certain point on.
On my CSPPC 060/200 System Heretic II was faster in softwarerender then in hardwarerender with the CV3D back then, though it looked better then in softwarerendering.

There might be a small performance bump with GLQuake or the special Version of Descent (no, not Freespace, the old thing from the stoneage) for the Virgechip.

[samanosuke]

I've seen a CV64 on eBay but the cheeky git is asking 199 Euros for it! I paid less than that for my (brand new at the time) Picasso IV currently sitting in my A4K. Are there any other Zorro based graphics cards worth considering? Preferably one which works in conjunction with the A3K's scandoubler?

[Argus]

@samanosuke

Try a GVP Spectrum 28/24 card.  It's Zorro II/III autosensing and has a built in monitor switch, so you can run a cable from the A3000's flicker switcher to the card direct; no external switch box required.  It is a nice card, uses a Cirrus Logic 5426 or 5428?? I believe, has 1 or 2MB 60ns?? graphics memory and works with all versions of CybergraphX and Picasso96, but no flicker fixer so not great on an A4000 if you want to use a SVGA monitor and see the native AA screenmodes.  The PicassoIV card is faster, uses a Cirrus Logic 5446 chip instead and has 4MB 45ms EDO RAM for graphics memory and has the nice built in AA flicker fixer; but this card is best suited for the A4000, imho.  In a pinch, a PicassoII+ card is a nice fallback, it has only 2MB of the 45ms RAM and uses the same graphics chip as the Spectrum but is Zorro II only.

[Lemmink]

You could also get a Piccolo (nearly the same as the EGS Spectrum) or the bigger brother, the PiccoloSD64 that has 2/4 MB.
The Picasso II+ is a good card but only for an A2000, for a ZIII System it's only a better then nothing solution.

[samanosuke]

I already have a Picasso IV installed in my A4K. The reason I am reluctant to get another is simply cost - I don't really want to pay a premium price for a card when the A3K already has a built in SD/FF. So how much slower is the GVP from the PIV? I certainly don't want anything more than even slightly slower. Also, how does the Piccolo compare speed wise? Is it P96/CGX compatible? And does it have a pass through for native screenmodes aswell?

Thanks to everyone so far for their answers... without you guys I might have bought a turkey (CV64/3D)

[Brian]

IMHO there's nothing that comes close to the CV64, CV3D, PIV (hearsay) for zorro... these are in a league of their own. I sold my old piccolo 2M card, and tested a Merlin4Mb card.. both was painfully slow, DO NOT GET THEM! I say don't even concider a card with less than 4Mb.

[x56h34]

@Brian:

Picasso II is a nice card, however only if used in Zorro 2 environment (e.g. with A2000). But you are right, even if used with A2000, I'd still rather go for CV64/3D or Picasso IV as they are newer and offer 4MB or video ram. CV64 is perfect for A3000 owners in every way.

[ckillerh3]

Can one use a flicker fixer in the A4000 video slot along with the Cybervision 64 card in a ZorroIII slot and cover all bases?

[Amigaz]

My A4000 had a Micronik scandoubler in the video slot and a CV64 in the top zorro III slot before I re-aranged everyting, now using a CV64 3D.

[jlariv8957]

Hi,

I don't have nor this card nor cybergraphx but i'm using picasso 96 and there are some options to emulate amiga native mode (normaly done by AGA/ECS chipset) by the RTG card, i've tested it what a difference with ECS whaouh blasting !! but compatibility is very average, so if you use your favorite wordprocessor it should run fine without interlacing artifact and so on but don't expect play games that use native modes !

[zipper]

jlariv8957 wrote:
Hi,

 but don't expect play games that use native modes !

In my tests years ago I got about 40% success rate for games and fakenative P96 modes. Did not work for F1GP, which I was interested in :-(