Why not AmigaOS4 for x86 Platforms?

[FastRobPlus]

Tomas wrote:

bloodline wrote:

What are the only Computers in the World that don't crash?

Playstation 2
Playstation 1
Game Cube
N64
SNES
Genesis
XBOX

I've seen both a Playstation 1 and an XBOX crash :-)

I have had my ps2 freeze up on gta vice city and that was a brand new orginal version of the game

I've seen an Xbox crash... The guy had it in the back of his pickup truck, and the tailgate fell down while he was on the highway.

I've seen a 3D0 crash while playing "Battle Chess." It gave a red border "guru" style error and reset!!!!  I was stunned.  I didn't know a lot about the 3D0, but bought one at launch.  That was the first time I knew that 3D0 was heavily Amiga-influenced.

Speaking of influence - the Epyx/Atari Lynx handheld crashed once (can't remember what game) and the screen was frozen, expect for the red and peach colored Amiga OS 1.x mouse pointer!

[Hammer]

OS4 on a G5 (which is 64bit, btw) would scream past x86, in GUI performance and most video applications. Of course I'm assuming that OS4 or OS5 will be ported to the G5 in the future. AmigaOS was designed for a low MHz 68000 processor. If the design is kept tight, then think of what it could do on a 64bit processor like the G5.

AMD64 and 970FX are about the same in terms of general performance e.g Cinebench 2003.

[Karlos]

Hammer wrote:
AMD64 and 970FX are about the same in terms of general performance e.g Cinebench 2003.

All this willy waving is well and good, but is there an existing amiga application, or any in development that can even tax the existing G4 sytems?

Don't get me wrong, faster hardware is better, but it seems to me that our existing developer base has yet to catch up with what existing PPC amiga/amiga-like systems are theoretically capable of.

[Hammer]

All this willy waving is well and good, but is there an existing amiga application, or any in development that can even tax the existing G4 sytems?

Any 3D rendering applications would tax any MPUs e.g. AOS's Cinema 4D R4.2.

PS; I don’t if AOS4’s primary media player can play Microsoft’s WMV-HD 1080p formats.

[Karlos]

Hammer wrote:

All this willy waving is well and good, but is there an existing amiga application, or any in development that can even tax the existing G4 sytems?

Any 3D rendering applications would tax any MPUs e.g. AOS's Cinema 4D R4.2.

Raytracers are not typical applications. They are compute bound a lot of the time, most applications are not. But of course, this is why you chose it as an example. I'm thinking of the typical "Why doens't my new 16GHz AMD x128 run word any faster?" experience ;-)

For C4D, an altivec optimised version would be a better first step. I'm sure users used to using a 680x0 raytracer (those that still do, that is) would be more than happy with the increase :-)

But then again, I'm sure most Cinema4D users moved to PC ages ago ;-)

PS; I don’t if AOS4’s primary media player can play Microsoft’s WMV-HD 1080p formats.

I don't know if sources for the required codec are available to even test it.

[mdwh2]

Karlos wrote:

Hammer wrote:

All this willy waving is well and good, but is there an existing amiga application, or any in development that can even tax the existing G4 sytems?

Any 3D rendering applications would tax any MPUs e.g. AOS's Cinema 4D R4.2.

Raytracers are not typical applications.

So what's a "typical" Windows application that taxes the latest CPUs? I guess there's games, but I can't really think of applications (at least, ones that couldn't be similarly discounted as "not typical").

[mdwh2]

lempkee wrote:
Antiriad:

yeah what a wise comment there :-) , just look how it went for BEos / Warp and all thoose other OS's that just had to go x86 and get wiped off the face of the earth.

Okay, I look at how BeOS was far more popular on x86 than it ever got on PPC.

Now, I don't know how profitable it was for them in comparison - but if they were raking in the money on PPC, then losing on x86, why did they stick with the latter?

The fact is that BeOS tried all three (their own PPC machine, Macs, x86 PCs), and failed on all three. That they tried x86 last before finally going bust doesn't prove anything.

As for bringing up OS2 Warp, what about all those OSs that went a non-x86 route and got wiped off the face of the earth (like, you know, AmigaOS, which is probably not used more than OS2 these days)?

sure they have a certain user amount still, sure they have alot of problems getting support for all their devices so naturally they just run XP or whatever to fullfill all their needs.

by saying it simple: there is no way to support x86 unless u support ALL the motherboards and geuss what...wont ever  happen and if people thought the A1 bugs was annoying then you should check the x86 pc arena.

The A1 has graphics and PCI cards doesn't it? Will people go rushing to XP because AmigaOS doesn't support every single PCI card out there?

[mdwh2]

leirbag28 wrote:
Whos talking about OLD custom chips? I certainly aint....im speaking of an entirely New Genration custom chipset as standard....................socketed so that they can be upgraded by the parent comapny Amiga Inc................just like the Enhanced Chipset and AGA................except they would be much more advanced................and you saving tons of cash cuz your just changing the chips......you can channel that extra cash in your pocket for the Chips................and Amiga Inc pumping more money into the 2nd set of More SUPER powered Custom Chips would justify it...............cuz every Amigan has the same machine!!!!

My computer has a "SUPER powered Custom Chip" plugged into a socket. It's called an AGP graphics card.

[MiAmigo]

I don't know about everyone else, but I don't want to run OS4, or OS3.9 on anything but a native Amiga. I also don't want to run Amiga Forever/WinUAE or any type of Amiga emulator on my PC. I also don't want to run any X86 emulators on my Amiga, nor do I want an 'Amiga' that shares any type of hardware similarity with any type of X86 PC. That goes for AmigaOne, et al. I don't mind using, as I see fit, any type of OS convention (such as right-click menus) on my Amiga, but, I just don't want to mix the two (Amiga and PC). For me, these platforms will always be kept separate - I have my reasons which will only start a fight here - and I will, in all probability never own, or use, any of the 'new' generation of Amiga 'thingies' that borrow too much from PC hardware platforms, or conventions. Going down that path (in my mind) is flirting constantly with 'watering down' what the Amiga was, and is, and what makes it special. So there! :ranting:

[leirbag28]

@aardvark

@DavidF215


Lets get together and form and Amiga based company shall we? :-D

[Karlos]

mdwh2 wrote:

So what's a "typical" Windows application that taxes the latest CPUs? I guess there's games, but I can't really think of applications (at least, ones that couldn't be similarly discounted as "not typical").

Well, this is my point. This quest for faster and faster is driven mostly by a few types of application (eg games, or to be fair, raytracers etc) whilst the vast majority of software barely makes use of a fraction of the available power.

Which is why I find it amusing that people are complaining about amiga systems running on PPC's that are literally hundreds of times faster than their 680x0 predecessors and are still complaining that they aren't as fast as the latest x86 / x64.

When we have software capable of making full use of the existing systems, with any luck faster (G5, AMD64 whatever) amiga clones will be available for those with manhood insecurities :-)

[bloodline]

Karlos wrote:

mdwh2 wrote:

So what's a "typical" Windows application that taxes the latest CPUs? I guess there's games, but I can't really think of applications (at least, ones that couldn't be similarly discounted as "not typical").

Well, this is my point. This quest for faster and faster is driven mostly by a few types of application (eg games, or to be fair, raytracers etc) whilst the vast majority of software barely makes use of a fraction of the available power.

Which is why I find it amusing that people are complaining about amiga systems running on PPC's that are literally hundreds of times faster than their 680x0 predecessors and are still complaining that they aren't as fast as the latest x86 / x64.

When we have software capable of making full use of the existing systems, with any luck faster (G5, AMD64 whatever) amiga clones will be available for those with manhood insecurities :-)

Audio/video production has benefited from all this horsepower... a few years ago, I needed a studio full of hundreds of 1000s of pounds worth of equipment to do what can be done on a Laptop now! :-D

[Bodie]

bloodline wrote:
a few years ago, I needed a studio full of hundreds of 1000s of pounds worth of equipment to do what can be done on a Laptop now! :-D

With all that horsepower at your lap, just make sure you wear some milspec protection around the jewels :-P .

[Bodie_CI5]

@ Brother Bodie

Don't forget to exhort Bloodline to not forget it be of cermaic materiel

[bloodline]

:roflmao:

[mdwh2]

Karlos wrote:
Well, this is my point. This quest for faster and faster is driven mostly by a few types of application (eg games, or to be fair, raytracers etc) whilst the vast majority of software barely makes use of a fraction of the available power.

Which is why I find it amusing that people are complaining about amiga systems running on PPC's that are literally hundreds of times faster than their 680x0 predecessors and are still complaining that they aren't as fast as the latest x86 / x64.

I agree in some sense; I'm more bothered about other things that pure CPU speed. But price is also an important factor, and x86 wins out there too (at least, in terms of PC versus proprietary box; I don't know how CPU prices compare). Paying loads extra for a G5 which is possibly faster than any x86 might attract some people, but few want to pay loads extra for something much slower. Also, having faster models available (be it G5 or x64) has the effect of making the older slower models come down in price.

And whilst "most people" might not be interested in things like 3D programs, video encoding, compiling and so on, we're not really talking about most people - the typical user who only uses the web and email is sadly unlikely to get a non-mainstream OS anytime soon.