A4000D & IDE CDROM install

[TheMagicM]

Michael_D /all: thanks for the replies..  I'll also remember about that short cd drive thing.. I have a few laying around so maybe I'll get lucky and have one.

[EzdineG]

Jope: Are you sure about this?

I am 100% sure about this.  It is the way the 4000D I'm using right now is configured, works 100%.

Jope: In my opinion this is not so - you will be able to use a real SCSI CD-ROM in the way you describe, but ATAPI drives might not work properly without IDE-Fix.

IDEFix is not necessary.  The scsi.device driver intended for the 4000D IDE controller works fine with ATAPI CD Roms.  I used it to create an emergency disk to 3.9 from 3.1.  I used it to install 3.9 and every application since.  It has no issues reading any DVD Rom I feed it, either.

[darksun9210]

the max speed an amiga using the standard IDE port can read CDs is the same as for hard disks. about 2.5Mb/s.

you can put a 52x drive in there if you want. i did that once, but it took so long to spin up i got annoyed with it and went back to a 32x drive i had laying around. much more responsive as it didn't have to spin up to crazy speeds just to read the odd tiny file here and there.

1x CD drive = 150Kb/s (happens to be spinning at 150rpm)
so a 16x drive can xfer at ~2.4Mb/s.
any more than that and your CD drive is going to be waiting around for the IDE interface to catch up.

thinking about it tho, if you have a faster drive in there, then when doing multiple seeks on the disc, it shouldn't take as long to get to the bit of disc it wants. kinda like why hard disks go up to 15000rpm.
but if it is constantly spinning up and then spinning down and won't read anything untill its spun up to full 52x, it gets a little irritating  :-)

[TjLaZer]

@EzdineG

I have never been able to get a ATAPI CD-ROM to work in my Amiga 4000s without 1) IDEFIX or 2) AmigaOS 3.5+  Actually to install AmigaOS 3.5 I had to use IDEFIX!

How did you do it???

[TjLaZer]

@TheMagicM

How did you end up getting that Amiga 4000 desktop computer?  Is it a nice setup?  I see you are looking for a 4000 keyboard, try software hut I bought my spare one there for $85 a few years ago brand new.  They might still have em.

I never had any trouble with an Atapi-CDrom using the
standard IDE port. I use an 56x CDrom in my A4000D
and it doesn't take much time to spin up. I Don't use
IDEFix either. No problem!

 :-D

[EzdineG]

k-disk wrote:
I never had any trouble with an Atapi-CDrom using the
standard IDE port. I use an 56x CDrom in my A4000D
and it doesn't take much time to spin up. I Don't use
IDEFix either. No problem!

 :-D

Thanks, I knew I couldn't be alone.  

I've a Maxtor 40GB 680L0 and Pioneer DVD rom as master/slave working together in harmony.  System boots to 3.9 BB2 from powerup in about 10 seconds :-D

[EzdineG]

TjLaZer wrote:
@EzdineG

I have never been able to get a ATAPI CD-ROM to work in my Amiga 4000s without 1) IDEFIX or 2) AmigaOS 3.5+  Actually to install AmigaOS 3.5 I had to use IDEFIX!

How did you do it???

Just as I described earlier.  The only oddity was jumpering the CDROM and Maxtor to cooperate.  I eventually found a combination that worked though.  After the OS3.9 install I went back and installed CacheCDFS, gave it the same device ID and removed the previous cd handler.

Adrian

[TjLaZer]

So you used scsi.device and the CD0: DOS driver and it just worked???  Hmm weird.  The only way I got a IDE CD-ROM to work was atapi.device.

[EzdineG]

TjLaZer wrote:
So you used scsi.device and the CD0: DOS driver and it just worked???  Hmm weird.  The only way I got a IDE CD-ROM to work was atari.device.

Yes.  Are we talking about Amigas?  :-D

[TheMagicM]

TjLazer: I bought one from a dude advertising on the AW then one from a guy in germany.

[TjLaZer]

@EzdineG

Well I hate to tell you this but you are the exception here.  The majority of Amiga 4000 users have not been able to mount a IDE ATAPI CD-ROM drive under AmigaDOS 3.0/3.1 without atapi.device or other 3rd party programs.  Glad to know it can be done though!  Oh did I try back in the day!!

[EzdineG]

TheMagicM wrote:
ezdine: well both of your systems are awesome!
I'll give it a shot and let you'all know how it works when the systems get here.

Thanks!  Love those 4000D's I do  8-)

[Jope]

EzdineG wrote:

TjLaZer wrote:
So you used scsi.device and the CD0: DOS driver and it just worked???  Hmm weird.  The only way I got a IDE CD-ROM to work was atari.device.

Yes.  Are we talking about Amigas?  :-D

What CD-ROM mechanism did you use and what kickstart do you have?

[TjLaZer]

I tried a NEC, Sony, and Toshiba IDE ATAPI CD-ROM drives, and I have a Amiga 4000 040, Kickstart 3.1.  I had AmigaDOS 3.1 at the time.

I had to install the atapi.device and mount the CD0: with that device and it worked perfectly.  I tried AsimCDFS, AmiCDFS and CacheCDFS and unless I used atapi.device it would not work.  Am I the only one that needed it?  I remember being told by everyone on USENET that it would not work with stock scsi.device.

[EzdineG]

TjLaZer wrote:
I tried a .... I have a Amiga 4000 040, Kickstart 3.1.  I had AmigaDOS 3.1 at the time.

As did I.

I had to install the atapi.device and mount the CD0: with that device and it worked perfectly.  I tried AsimCDFS, AmiCDFS and CacheCDFS and unless I used atapi.device it would not work.  Am I the only one that needed it?  I remember being told by everyone on USENET that it would not work with stock scsi.device.

The DVD Rom is a Hitachi GD-5000 (originally thought it was a Pioneer.)  For the record, I don't even possess atapi.device, idefix97, AsimCDFS or AmiCDFS.  I went into the installation treating these devices like their SCSI equivalents in my 3000's.  I used OS 3.1 long enough to create a bootdisk with the 3.9 installer CD.  Perhaps the characteristics of my DVD Rom made it so?

Adrian