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Author Topic: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!  (Read 14844 times)

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Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Right I've had enough. C=USA are clearly just scammers raping the Amiga brand sticking logos on Wintel computers in a case that has sweet FA to do with Amiga case designs so help me do what they should have done!

1. I plan to have A1200 and other cases replicated too (600 1000 or 3000 also, you choose) and a bespoke "Amiga" keyboard later on.

2. I want to fit them with 100% AROS compatible x86 hardware. I want to configure them to have AROS BIOS too.

3. I want to configure them out of the box to run dual boot AROS + Windows XP & Amiga emulator (£20 Amiga Forever OCS & AGA)

4. Nostalgic homage box + poly inserts + spiral bound user manuals

5. 9 pin joystick port interface built into the case (because USB Competition Pro is terrible!)

If you are interested please voice your support in my thread now. If enough people are interested I can start this project rolling with contacts in the industry I have.

I am sorry it is x86 not PPC but I cannot finance OS4 compatible PPC motherboard development. But if you want an x86 system like this please show support. A few members talked about donations to help (100% of your donations would be subtracted from purchase price of course).
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2012, 07:59:33 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;690634
I can't help with cash, but if you can get Jens to do you a Catweasel run, you can leave the drivers to me.Including the joystick driver.

I don't understand this comment? Catweasel = FDD controller no?

Not asking for any cash at this stage btw, just gauging interest in my idea.

Even if nobody was interested I will commission 1 unit just to show C=USA what is possible with some effort :)
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 08:14:37 AM by Digiman »
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2012, 08:02:22 AM »
Quote from: Darrin;690631
I'd like an "Amiga" theme case for my FPGA Arcade.  I don't mind if it is an all-in-one, or something that resembles an A1000.

If the X1000 didn't already come in a tower case then I'd be up for an A2000 or A4000 style case for that.

There is a very nice A1000ish case out there. I am working on that and will post my results for a much more off the shelf A1000ish system once I've built mine using a very cool mouse (sadly discontinued) and slim keyboard design.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 08:21:33 AM by Digiman »
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2012, 08:12:00 AM »
Quote from: Kesa;690632
Part 1 has already been done with the x500. But to be honest i hate the idea of using AROS. I think we should concentrate on FPGA. Or simply just a barebones case unit.

http://loriano.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/a_few_example_of_how_to_customis.htm


You can butcher real Amiga keyboards via keyrah + replica cases and place Minimig/Natami in them if you wish.

For x86 we have 3 choices

1. AROS (with AROS BIOS)
2. Amithlon (legally a dead end as it is only illegally obtained now)
3. Windows XP (or 7 if you really want) with Amiga Forever.

I proposed a dual boot of the only 2/3 viable x86 solutions for Wintel x86. I am not selling my home to get into PPC and OS4 work sorry :) I said this honestly up front I can't be fairer than that really.

Think of it like the Amiga version of C64x ;)

I'm not a fan of A500's case design personally and those look more like the Sinclair PC-200 but working on something like those linked images for Atari ST community. Atari ST users are lucky because they will be able to use real floppy disks within emulated environment!
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 08:20:01 AM by Digiman »
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2012, 10:09:19 AM »
Quote from: AmigaNG;690640
I'd be interested in what you come up with. However I would advise agiest trying to sell it with Amiga written on it, as they might come after you.

Plus I'm surprised I haven't seen more mod attempts at making a Amiga fantasy like case, specially if  your just into aros or Amiga emulation scene and it just a pc your after, after all pc parts are fairly cheap and you can get some really small computers that would easily fit inside an A1200.

I wanted a htpc and decided been that it will never get made I would make myself the AmigaMcc case, turned out pretty good so glad I at least tried to have a go and it only cost me about £70 for the case and a few weekends to work on it.
http://www.vincentperkins.com/AmigaNG/build.php
More fun and more interesting project than I thought it would be.


I wouldn't be using the Amiga logo ;) The only way I could is if I sourced existing A1200 cases say (that avoids legal issue as they are legal) but this is bad for classic Amiga parts scene for repairing real Amigas.

Micro ATX is the way to for use with A500/600/1200 case + keyrah.

There is a very Mac Mini case for around €40.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2012, 10:17:49 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;690639
The Catweasel MkIV(+) has two 9-pin joystick ports in it. Plus UAE supports the Catweasel so you can read Amiga disks from within the emulated environment... but you can't boot from them as it doesn't emulate Paula driving them.


I was reluctant to use Catweasel because you can't boot real Amiga games on the PC but didn't know it had Keyrah style built in joysticks.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2012, 10:21:28 AM »
Quote from: TheDaddy;690644

Original keyboards...to be honest I prefer the new ones but it's all down to taste of course. ;)


There are some very Amiga 2000 (the best keyboard IMO) like Cherry and Apple keyboards. A1200/600/500 keyboards were not as good as 1000/2000 keyboards IMO.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2012, 10:28:19 AM »
Quote from: Kesa;690642
@The daddy.

I liked the existing wedge cases except the fact they are made of cheap plastic. How hard would it be to make a wedge case using the same dimensions only swapping the plastic for aluminium? It shoudn't be too hard to find and use original keyboards should it? Maybe you are trying too hard to re-design the wheel?


A1200/600 case is quite similar to mk2 C64 case and I did some calculations for sheet steel. The vents/slats on top would be a pain but ports and underside vents could be CNC cut before bending/pressing the panels.

A sturdy plastic case in identical white would be my choice though.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2012, 05:16:19 AM »
Some interesting ideas so far so thanks to everyone for their comments.

A couple of points I would like to say for future posts, as this is already a very complex project already and even after 4 pages there are some major distractions in the discussion which confuses the relevant messages I need to consider. So please when posting ask yourself if your comments are directly related to my project or a completely unrelated product, in which case you should probably start a new thread about it :)

OK I will try to address everyone's individual concerns or suggestions.

1. If you think of it from the point of view of I am going to do a bespoke cased system for myself and if anybody else likes it I could supply suitable case parts or certain interfaces e.g. the joystick/mouse 9pin adaptors. I am not necessarily starting a business here as such. I just KNOW that C=USA's effort is so pathetic I could do better. How much it will cost me to make one for myself I don't know but I know it IS possible to do much better.

2. The cases - there is no particularly difficult case to replicate but each case requires a lot of work by me to give to another party to produce. So for this reason I thought of what I thought was the most difficult to replicate. End of the day if we had some replica cases made up it comes down to quantity of solid orders with non-refundable deposits. So if 50 people wanted an A500 case that's fine, it's not limited to which case designs I personally like or AIO/3 box design only.

3. A few people have commented on PPC or FPGA systems. I am not going to start getting involved in purchasing such esoteric hardware but if for example the PPC boards can be accommodated in the case as far as size goes I have no problem with this.

4. The AROS thing, there has been a comment inferring I am just going to freeload off the AROS team. Firstly you don't know me so why assume the worst? Secondly it was just an idea but I did state I wanted an AROS BIOS system so obviously if AROS was to be factored into the hardware parts list I would have to forge relationships with people working on AROS. Finally if this was a business and I was selling such machines with the system pre-installed I would happily donate to AROS bounties etc, although If I was donating 10% of profits to AROS I would expect a say in for example what order new drivers are written in.

5. Case materials - I want to make a plastic cases for the AIO designs for sure. The A1000 was plastic too so see no problem with that either. Things like the A2000 style would have to be metal with a plastic front end. I don't believe you can replicate a shape with various slats and creases well using metal personally. I don't know how it will be done, the experts in the field or prototyping cases would decide exactly which process to use and which materials. 3D printing however does not produce a case you can use without a lot of labour intensive finishing so it will not be a 3D printer used. I still need to discuss this with a few companies anyway and I am nowhere near being able to comment on how this should be done yet. As soon as I contact these people they will want some technical designs to quote on too so this is a slow burn project so please bare that in mind

6. It may be that I don't use AROS anyway and just stick to Windows. It would be nice to have AROS but I am no expert on that OS at all (or anything NOT Windows based to be honest) so we shall see. The main focus is to produce something that looks nothing like what is off the shelf now (like Cybernet ZPC range etc) and something close to an original Amiga. I said quite honestly up front if this is not what you are looking for you won't be interested in what I build. However you may well ask me how did I make that case and how much would it cost to produce say 10 more for some members here.

7. Keyboards, obviously the ideal is an actual Amiga keyboard with only 10 F keys and only two keys above the cursor T block of keys in the middle. This would be nice and certainly expected on a $1500 machine but to be fair it's not like it's massively different to PC keyboards today, the Atari ST had bespoke rhomboid F keys and that I could understand but from a distance you wouldn't even know. Who knows what the future holds but like I said I am building something unique but if others want parts reproduced from any aspect of what I have done I am happy to sort that out. I have not set out to start a big business with offices etc over this. It's still just a little hobby project at this stage I hope others will find interesting.

8. The joystick adaptors, right these are something I am either going to purchase (I remember seeing them for €40 for two ports and they interface via standard USB headers) OR I will make them myself using some specialist parts and a soldering iron :) They don't need any drivers at all as they are not mapped to keys on the keyboard as Keyrah does it. As far as Windows is concerned a new joystick just got plugged into the USB port.

9. I want to put i7 based motherboards inside the machine I am building, however there are a couple of issues. The boards will no have any kind of PCI cards on them so the onboard GPU must be Nvidia or ATI and it must be of a very reasonable speed. Maybe AMD Phenom II would work out better I don't know yet. But the form factor more than likely will be Micro ATX. I don't like the way the interfaces will work out there on the back of the machine, there would be a lot of blank solid plastic apart from the 6x2 inch block of connections on the motherboard.

I think I have covered everything relevant so far, prod me if I've missed your question :)

If you think of this project first and foremost as being on to investigate the viability of making A1200-a-like (or other Amiga) cases in plastic today and nothing else you won't go far wrong.

What I will add is yes this project would be massively more simple and faster if I just used existing parts, but this is simply not sustainable, how many empty A1200 or A500 cases are around etc. I might do something like that with Keyrah as well though just for myself but I know full well that only a handful of people would be able to do that after me as the cases are hard to come by so this is of little interest to everyone.

What I am trying to find out from Amigans is what they would choose given the specs/restrictions.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2012, 05:23:03 AM by Digiman »
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2012, 10:03:14 AM »
Quote from: takemehomegrandma;690845
...but it won't be neither Commodore, nor Amiga, and especially not both! :p :python:


But then nothing else for sale today counts Commodore died in 1994 and real Amigas died with them :)

I would be happy with building myself an A1200 lookalike machine that allows me to play Amiga games with a Zipstick :lol: If nobody else would like one that's cool.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2012, 10:23:57 AM »
I was given a contact for a company that could possibly reproduce a keyboard layout identical to both C64 and Amiga. Will be interesting to get quotes.
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2012, 06:38:18 PM »
I know a lot of people, generally speaking not just Amigans, who don't like the old A500/600/1200 style of computer.

I would go one further and say given regular computer buyers/first time computer buyers only have the option of purchasing LCD monitors and an LCD monitor on top of a desktop case doesn't work either.

It's not about getting HP or Lenovo etc to make AIO keyboards again it's about nostalgia. Having a machine that looks 99% like and you can play your favourite Amiga games on or write stuff in Blitz Basic with.

I always said this is all a fact finding exercise really, because what case you try and replicate and which OS you put on their is immaterial. The same company who would be able to make you an Amiga 1200 case would also be able to make you an Amiga 1000 or 3000 case too. I don't even own an A3000 case anyway at the moment and I would need to own at least an empty A3000 case to do technical specifications for any discussions with a case manufacturer.

Also, as it is more like a kit than a car driven away from a showroom the same ethos applies regarding the most optimistic outcome of what I may be able to offer people who share a common dream with me. I may start with an A1200 case in white with a white keyboard but there is no reason why it can not end in an A3000 case with an Amiga layout keyboard too. The skills are there it's a matter of investment over return. I can't justify building myself an Amiga 1000 alon

The cases are the first step, without this all we would have is a Mac Mini case rip-off with some free case engraving like *you know who* ;)

Just going to prove you don't have to be as rich as Mr BS to not cock up the Amiga project so badly and if they wanted to could have given the same effort as the C64x
 

Offline DigimanTopic starter

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Re: Let me help fix this C=USA disaster...but you must help me too!
« Reply #12 on: April 28, 2012, 06:39:41 PM »
Quote from: paolone;690865
Is Digiman hired by or anyhow connected to Amiga Inc? Has I got a license from Amiga Inc? Is him going to sell Amiga branded computers?

The answer to all these questions is NO, so there is absolutely NO PROBLEM in being a OEM making a computer with an Amiga-like OS.


No I will be creating the "Amigar 1200" ;)