SAM 460 poor performance, high price

[AmigaNG]

Its funny moaning about the high prices, their be a lot of people out side of the Amiga community that would say paying 111Euro for an out dated limited AmigaOS inspire OS such as MorphOS for outdated mac hardware is madness. Its all a matter of perspective and what you want/enjoy. Hell Linux users must think everyones mad paying for anything!
 

 Out of the next gen systems I have used, I've enjoyed AmigaOS4 the most, so I plan to support it, either getting a Sam460 or if I can afford it an AmigaONE X1000, no one is forcing me to buy these products it be nice if they would be available cheaper but they are not (weather they can be or not is another debate), they simple not, I have accepted that and still going to invest in something I hopefully enjoy, I know a lot of my friends and family think I'm mad, but its simple what I enjoy.
 

 PS: No one mentioned the second hand market, you can find a few AmigaONE and Sam system their now for around £600 and the price is only likely to come down more as we get more and better  hardware so I do think /would like to think some users go that root to just try out the OS.

[AmigaNG]

Here's another reason why supporting "old" Macs is a good thing: You can download MorphOS ISO image for free and try it on supported system. You're likely to find PowerPC Macs everywhere, maybe a family member or a friend has one. Just pop in the CD-R and boot the system and you're running MorphOS live CD.

OS4 users are not that lucky. There's no easy way to test OS4 before you buy.

I disagree, there are enough user group meeting or Amiga shows you can go and visit to test the systems, ask the question and get advice etc, all for free (minus the travel time/cost)  that how I got to the decision that OS4 was more for me, I do admit cheap and easily available hardware  is always going to be better (that why I also like Aros, plus I dont have to buy anything!). But I think going that root would be a mistake at least at the moment, they might as give it try and see if there is a market big enough and willing enough to invest more money for custom made hardware, I think if its not and the AmigaONE project fails then they should go the Mac root as quick as possible.

[AmigaNG]

MorphOS (111.11 EUR vs. 74 EUR for Win7 OEM): check!

Or you could say

MorphOS (111.11 EUR vs. Free for Ubuntu Linux) thats a 111 times markup value. :eek:

But like you and I have said we all have our own thoughts on how much we should spend on what is after all a hobby.

[AmigaNG]

It failed eight years ago.

Actually Eyetech where doing ok with sales of the Amigaone it was more their hardware problems and suppliers that was their undoing. Plus Acube must of sold enough Sam board to warrant developing 440 flex and 460 systems.

Plus Hyperion and A-eon I sure must know the Os4 users number must think their is enough demand for a new high end system.

Plus if they get the AmigaONE X1000 out and sell the planned first batch of 250 machine they are building (im sure I read that some where) at let say £2,000 that's £500,000.00 a half a million pound turn over, I would not consider that a fail. I think that number of units is just about doable judging by the amount of interest in it. what can I say other than....i believe.

[AmigaNG]

Please tell me what Amiga show or user group I may attend to see a modern OS4 box less than 1,800 miles from my house? I am in Fort Lauderdale, FL (USA).
 
-Edit-
BTW, please don't say AmiWest as it would be 3,100 miles away.

Acording to http://map.minimig.net/?filter=sam
There are two user Xilinder, Jim McKenzie in florida, why not try and track them down and just ask if you can try, I never said this is the perfect way of doing it. Plus you can also buy it and sell it on if its not for you, unlike most hardware, AMiga hardware does keep its value quite well, you most likely won't lose more than £100 to see if you like it. Which is most likely less that it would cost you get your hand on a second hand mac to try MorphOS out on.

update
Acually yerh forgot about how cheap emacs and ppc mac do go for now. But  still you could get a second hand AmigaOne or Sam to try out and sell  it on with out losing anything or even if you get lucky make a profit!       I just  saying worst case scenario I would of thought would be maybe a £100 lost.

[AmigaNG]

Don't tell that to redrumloa, he's already proven you wrong!

Acually yerh forgot about how cheap emacs and ppc mac do go for now. But still you could get a second hand AmigaOne or Sam to try out and sell it on with out losing anything or even if you get lucky make a profit!Just  saying worst case scenario I would of thought would be maybe a £100 lost.

[AmigaNG]

By June 2010 they were already £167,785.00 down. With no money coming in for another 6 months hasn't improved the situation. I very much doubt 250 units at price £2,000 will cover it.

Ok well lets say total development cost is £200,000. Then they need to make £800 profit on each machine sold if they only sell 250. So if the cost of making the machine doesn't go over £1,200 they can do it, ok I know that's a bit of a stretch, as the beta boards cost that much, but who to say they are not making a bit of profit on them? Adding the extas like the case, drives etc and building it would cost no more than £300 I would off thought, so lets say £1,500 is the total cost of each X1000 so they make £500 on each system at £2,000 so they would need to sell 400 machines to break even. (well their are around 2,000+ OS4 users? + Xmos users + linux PPC fans) so maybe they could still sell that many at that price.

I suppose then adding tax and shipping the £2,000 price point is looking very unlikely but I'm sure they have someone better than me working out the money side, I just hope they can get it to around that price as I dont think it will be as successful as they hope if it much more than that, I think it  would be a shame for not just AmigaOS4 but for all users.

[AmigaNG]

They were? Didnt Alan Redhouse say they were making loss with their AmigaOne? Even when sold at some $1000 price. I have never seen proof Eyetech was doing ok.

"2) How many AmigaOne boards have been sold so far and what is your  opinion on the demand for the current boards and upcoming Micro1A  boards?
Alan: From the publicly available figures it seems  that we have delivered more AmigaOne boards than any other 'open' (ie  not IBM or Apple) PPC-based standard PC form factor board supplier. And  in terms of real sales for real money (which in my view is the ultimate  measure of success anyone can give boards away) we really seem to have no significant competition to date"

FROM= http://amigaworld.net/modules/features/index.php?op=r&cat_id=3&rev_id=41&sort_by

[AmigaNG]

If it was such a great success why didn't Eyetech handle warranties (which were supposedly covered by the profit margin, and was given as reason for the high price!) and why did Eyetech fail? Trying to blame it on MAI doesn't explain it. They were told numerous times that the MAI chipsets were defect.

If it was such a fail, why did they continue to develop a new model, like I said it was mostly likely the level of claims on hardware problems/issue that got made they most likly thought to just pull the plug before they loss all their profits, sad but most likely true.

[AmigaNG]

Why did you even bring up Eyetech in this thread anyway?

I sorry I did bring up Eyetech now, I was only replying  to nicholas statement that the AmigaOne project failed 8 years ago, my reply was “Actually Eyetech where doing ok with sales of the Amigaone it was more their hardware problems and suppliers that was their undoing.”
 
 I still stand by that statement, if the boards had no issues then more users like myself might of got them, but I was strongly (as where many others) put off by the fact that both the hardware and software was buggy. Plus suppliers issues is also true and the fact that Amiga Inc looked like they where going to screw them over all made the amigaone project fail 8 years ago. This all I was trying to get across. Now lets get the thread back on topic.

[AmigaNG]

A question for u OS4 die hards, when is too much too much? 1000 dollar motherboard 1 GHz motherboard, 2000 dollar 2 GHz motherboard, would you pay 3000 dollars for a 3 GHz mobo?

Never thought about it like that before $1 per mhz. at least I know where my money going

But all seriousness, I can only speak for myself, I'm not daft I have questioned the price of Amigaos4 and it hardware its a shame but this is what is cost to get more customized, industry or specialised hardware what ever you want to call it, now should they port OS4 to cheap ppc hardware like Macs, well they could do that, but how much of a future would that gives us, its not massively helped MorphOS improve its market share. And once they do get the AmigaOS4 on all the PPC mac hardware there is, where do we go from then?

I see the only real future for OS4 and morphOS to either make their own hardware or port the OS to a different cheaper processor and try and compete their, but little point in doing that as we already have Aros doing x86 and ARM processors soon.

At the end of the day I like OS4 it not cheap, and the AmigaONE X1000 maybe too much for me to justify I think my limit is around £1,500 to £2,000 mark, now its looking less and less likely that even this price is going to be achievable but if it is too much at least there is an alternative for me to join in OS4 world thanks to the sams boards [/FONT]

[AmigaNG]

@Iggy

  I completely agree.  Sadly some people, who clearly have no interest in OS4 and never will be interested in it, seem to feel the need to take every opportunity to create threads for the sole purpose of bashing OS4 and/or OS4 hardware.

  I, for one, have every intention of buying a Sam460 and stupids threads like this are not going to change my mind.  The only thing these threads accomplish is to annoy people and make enemies.  It's time to give it a rest and let things be the way they are.

+1

This is why I recently asked the question if these people want to see the AmigaONE X1000 project to fail with clearly so many people dont like the root Hyperion have decided to go with OS4, I'm glad most dont want it to just fail even if its completely stupid idea from their point of view.  But when you get threads like these I cant help but feel that deep down they would like OS4 to flop to allow MorphOS or what ever they support to become the main stream ng amiga which I think is a shame as I think any camp/developer/manufacture (like acube and aeon) that is willing to still try and support the Amiga community (any part of the community) deserver a bit more respect and not the bashing some people give out (even C=USA too a point.)