The legal future of "Amiga"

[orb85750]

Well, I realize that it may be looked down upon by some to care about the lawsuit, but I for one do care about the Hyperion/Amiga Inc battle because it may very well determine the future of Amiga.  Particularly, if Hyperion wins the suit, the question is whether they could legally contract out a hardware builder to put the term "AmigaOS" on the hardware itself.  If so, Hyperion would effectively become the new Amiga computer company.  Amiga Inc doesn't seem to be serious about releasing actual Amiga computers anyway.  

I don't think that an excellent OS alone can fully revive Amiga.  (e.g. Could you imagine an Apple revival simply based on an OS10 that people had to install on their own hardware?)

[orb85750]

I don't know, perhaps someone can make sense of the crap:
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August 28, 2008      118      REVISED ORDER REGARDING INITIAL DISCLOSURES, JOINT STATUS REPORT AND EARLY SETTLEMENT By stipulation of counsel, Joint Status Report due by 1/5/2009; FRCP 26f Conference Deadline is 1/5/2009; Initial Disclosure Deadline is 1/5/2009; by Judge Ricardo S. Martinez. (LW) (Entered: August 28, 2008)
September 2, 2008    119    SCHEDULING ORDER for Settlement Conference: This matter has been referred to Judge Arnold to conduct a SETTLEMENT CONFERENCE. Settlement briefs/memorandums are due in chambers on 11/13/2008 by 4:00 PM. The briefs should contain a statement of the facts, issues for trial, the law, strengths and weaknesses of the parties' case, each party's position after mediation held in this matter and a settlement figure. The briefs/memorandums should be delivered to Judge Arnold's chambers or submitted by fax to chambers at (253)882-3881. BRIEFS ARE TO BE CONFIDENTIAL AND NOT FILED WITH THE COURT OR SERVED ON OPPOSING COUNSEL. In addition to counsel, parties and representatives who have authority to settle are directed to be present in person. Settlement Conference set for 11/20/2008 at 09:00 AM in D Courtroom before Judge J. Kelley Arnold. by Judge J. Kelley Arnold. (AS) (Entered: September 2, 2008)
Docket Report Last Checked: December 1, 2008 14:58:41 PST
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which is from the URL:
http://news.justia.com/cases/featured/washington/wawdce/2:2007cv00631/143245/

-Dave

[orb85750]

I think it's clear that the lawsuit is about ownership, not just about $$.  I do think that, given the opportunity and the capital (another big question mark), Hyperion would do whatever they could to promote Amiga beyond the "hobbyist" level.  Remember when the Apple I was a hobbyist machine?  Next came the Apple II.  OK, now I'm becoming a bit far-fetched, but you get my point.  -Dave

[orb85750]

persia wrote:
Yes, it's a hobbyist OS which is why Hyperion need to win.  Hyperion folks are hobbyists, they know they aren't going to get rich but they have some fun and earn enough to survive.  The whole market is a few thousand.  Amiga Inc can't relate to this.

I disagree.  I highly doubt that Hyperion or anyone else would take on the monumental task of developing a new operating system (and being under contract to Amiga Inc) if they thought there would be recognition by only a few thousand individuals.

[orb85750]

dammy wrote:

I really don't see Hyperion winning much in this case.  At best, they keep their own code and call it HyperOS or whatever and move on.  They do not own the name "Amiga" and assorted copyrights and trademarks related to "Amiga" and no judge is going to award it to them either.  It's been estimated Hyperion (Evert) is about $2M in the hole in what is owed on OS4 to developers, I don't Evert making enough on sales to catch up to that $2M for a very long time if ever.

What I'm betting, Evert is attempting to get paid off by Amiga Inc so he can pay off his devs and then he'll move on.  With this downward spiral of the global economy, I don't think AI will pay what Evert wants and is willing to sit and wait for the trial.  If AI loses, they will appeal it and then your talking years and years as it goes through the appeals courts.

Dammy

If Hyperion's use of the term "Amiga" were so obviously illegal, then the court would have issued an injunction against the current sale of AmigaOS4 a long time ago, right?

[orb85750]

dammy wrote:
by orb85750 on 2008/12/2 17:23:00

If Hyperion's use of the term "Amiga" were so obviously illegal, then the court would have issued an injunction against the current sale of AmigaOS4 a long time ago, right?

No, AI failed to show catastrophic harm being done if Acube is selling OS4 for their SAM440.  Judge stated that things can be repaired by damages being awarded.  See the Judge's ruling.


Dammy

Please reread the document.  If Amiga Inc. becomes insolvent (and that seems to be the main bone of contention), then Hyperion is entitled to market OS4 under the AmigaOS trademark, which is exactly what they're doing now.

[orb85750]

persia wrote:
You've also got the insolvency clause.  If Amiga Inc (Amino) truly was insolvent before the transfer of assets to Amiga Inc (KMOS), then Hyperion win.  That's one of the complicating matters of the whole situation, the company that is suing Hyperion IS NOT the company that Hyperion had the contract with.

Die Hyperion really pay out US$2 Million to programmers?  There's no way they'll ever recoup that money.  That's just crazy.  Neither Hyperion nor Amiga Inc have any possibility of getting that much money from Amiga development.

I am confounded by the notion held here by many that the total potential Amiga user base cannot exceed a few thousand, especially given that it used to be millions.  If a complete, user-friendly (ready to use without assembly!) machine is produced and marketed with some modest budget by a competent company, do you still forecast an absolute ceiling of only a few thousand machines selling?

[orb85750]

persia wrote:
The problem is that this is 2008 not 1988.  OS X and Windows have a lock on the market.  Even Linux can't make it to the desktop in large numbers.

The main issues confronting any new OS are:

1) Software, can I open a .docx or .xlsx file, edit it and returned the marked up document?  Can I play the latest games?  Can I edit my photos and videos?  Can sync my phones address book with the one on my computer?  Can I play a modern game?  The answer to these for AmigaDos 4.1 is NO, for all practical purposes.  Heck I can't really even surf the web properly.

2) Bang for the Buck.  Is it affordable for me to make the switch?  Is the price performance ratio good?  Again, if the Sam card the answer is a definite NO.  The price/performance ratio is bad against Mac and horrible against PC.

3) Stability of he supply, if I'm buying something non-standard will the company be around next year?  History probably works against Amiga here.

4) Technology leap, this was Amigas original strength.  But nothing in AmigaDos says cutting edge, indeed AmigaDos 4.1 is still not up to 2008 trailing edge.

So in the end who will buy an Amiga?  Retro-Geek and hobbyists, a nice niche market but really only in the thousands of people  It isn't pessimism, that's realism.  

I may buy a SAM for play but they have to pry my MacPro from my cold dead hands.  I love 1988, but I live in 2008.  With Amiga I can relive 1988, but when there's work to do the Amiga simply can't cut it.

Last I checked, Linux was doing pretty well, with literally millions of individual users worldwide.  If Amiga OS4.x (some version) can overcome a few shortcomings, then there certainly is plenty of hope for Amiga (well, if a certain trademark holder were to step aside or go bankrupt).  Apple has effectively won its uphill battle.  Linux has effectively won its uphill battle.  So it's not clear why some other entity could not accomplish a tiny fraction of what has been accomplished in either of those cases.  

SAM is a good hobbyist option, but it's certainly not designed for the computer-literate masses (obviously).  Is it not possible to produce an OS4.x for a relatively cheap machine that is user-friendly and ready for immediate use?  Add a very cool case (apparently something that resembles the A1200!) and some compatible software (along with general compatibility of classic Amiga software) and there will be buyers if the price is decent.  Build the future from there.  Of course Amiga will never overtake Windows/Mac/Linux, but that does not mean we're limited to the few thousand current Amiga users, IMO.

[orb85750]

One final point ...OK, not final, but important:  I'm an Amiga user (fun only at this point), a Windows user (business
and fun) and a Linux user (business and scientific programming).  Don't assume that everyone commits fully to only one platform.  Such polygamy is not uncommon.