MiniMig with AGA

[ferrellsl]

Put me down for a board.

[ferrellsl]

Sheesh, people.  This system has been on the boards for a couple years now.  Go to the source if you really want to know more about this board.

http://www.fpgaarcade.com

[ferrellsl]

Yeah, a 68060 core and the SuperAGA chipset are now possibilities.  I suppose that you could also run a 68K Macintosh core if someone wanted to develop one.  There's already an Atari ST core and several arcade system cores.  I'd like to see the Natami core converted to run on this as well as a 68K Mac core........a very high "cool factor".

[ferrellsl]

Bump

[ferrellsl]

Yeah, imagine an A500, A1200-A4000, SuperAGA Amiga/Natami, Atari ST and a 68K Mac all in one handheld unit.  And you select which system you want at the power up menu.  Too cool!

[ferrellsl]

Oh, and don't forget all the stand-up arcade systems that it emulates too.  I hope somebody will port the Natami core to this system too.  Not sure I can afford to buy both a Natami and a Replay board.

[ferrellsl]

Sheesh, just get a modern PS2 or USB keyboard with PS2 connector and remap the keys for an Amiga.  Amigans have a way of over complicating the hell out of everything.

[ferrellsl]

@little

No need for that.  Just modify/extend the existing Minimig core to add the additional resolutions and colors.  That's how AGA was added to what was essentially an A500 softcore. That's the beauty of a softcore on the Minimig (or FPGAArcade).  Now that AGA and additional chipram are available, it won't be long before some enterprsing coder figures out how to add Super-AGA to the same core....and maybe 030 or higher CPUs.  It may require a larger FPGA, but it's possible.

[ferrellsl]

@little

No one is creating new hardware by extending the Minimig cores.  And backward compatibility is being maintained with previous real-hardware Amigas by both the Natami team and MikeJ on his FPGAArcade board.  It sounds like you may be a bit unclear as to what an FPGA really accomplishes.  The A500 core on a Minimig is simply a complete A500 recreated in software and loaded onto the FPGA chip.  New "virtual" hardware can be created as needed just by modifying the existing core and loading it onto the FPGA. Therefore everyone who owns and uses a Minimig can load the core-system of their choosing, whether it's an Atari, C64, A500, A500 AGA, etc....

And no one is concerned about x86 Aros running 68K Aros programs because x86 AROS was never intended to have binary compatibility with 68K AROS.  x86 AROS uses a variant of UAE to run classic Amiga software and it works just as well, maybe even better than WinUAE since it's integrated almost seamlessly into Wanderer/Zune (the AROS GUI shell).  The AROS devs ARE shooting for 68K AROS and classic-Amiga compatibility, which is well underway with the Kickstart replacement bounty.

And if you find that there's an application that doesn't behave well on one of the modified AGA/SuperAGA Minimig cores, then just revert back to a stock A500 softcore on your Minimig....problem solved.

As for programmers/developers being discouraged and not writing new applications for the FPGA Amigas and their proposed "extensions", well, it may be news to some, but that already happened about 10 years ago.  Viable commercial software development for the Amiga is dead.  Same can be said for next generation "real" Amiga hardware such as the X1000 and the Natami and Minimig.  The Amiga is and will remain a system for hobbyists.  No one is gonna get rich these days on ANYTHING Amiga, least of all programming for it.  But at least with a Minimig, Natami, or FGAArcade people can buy something to relive better times and still have the option to write software for a system that'll be around a lot longer than classic A1200s, A500s, etc.  Most classic Amiga users will admit that their systems are running on their last legs, held together with Scotch tape and a prayer.

[ferrellsl]

@little

And again,  I say no new hardware is being created at all by modifiying an FPGA core.  FPGA cores are software VHDL code.  There is absolutely NO hardware being created when someone modifies a core.  Please do some more study about FPGAs before you start spreading misinformation.  Creating new hardware would be adding additional ICs, capacitors, resistors, etc.  That does not happen when someone modifies a softcore.  That's why it's called a "soft" core.

No, you are confusing the goals of AROS 68K and classic Amiga.  The goal of AROS 68K is to run classic Amiga software completely unmodified.  The target program will look and operate identically on an Amiga that's running AROS 68K or OS3.X.  In fact, it will be running on identical hardware. Instead of OS 3.X on your Amiga, you simply choose to run Aros 68K instead.  Or if you have an FPGA based Amiga, you can do the same there as well.  Run AROS, or run OS3.X or less.  The software application is still using Amiga hardware, but you can opt for an FPGA Amiga as well.

And I haven't seen nor heard of anyone here asking a programmer to make a 24-bit game for a classic Amiga.....No one here will disagree with you that asking such a thing is madness.  Gunnar is actually making one for the Natami though, now that you mention it.

And who is developing ANY 24-bit screen mode games for classic Amigas anyway? (Answer:  Nobody)  And why would they?  There's simply no market for it, and the CPU horsepower for such a game on a classic Amiga doesn't exist.  So your argument makes no sense.  So the FPGA devs are supposed to keep their next generation Amiga hardware and softcores stunted/handicapped for software that doesn't even exist?  The entire point of next generation hardware is to move forward with greater capabilities while retaining the ability to run older classic software if you choose to do so.

[ferrellsl]

@little

As I said earlier, please educate yourself further as to the difference between hardware and software.  A "softcore" is software code loaded into a FPGA.  It's called "soft" for a reason.  The FPGA discussed in the context of this thread IS the hardware.  It IS the new computer in its entirety, minus the softcore, as far as Natami and Minimig go anyway.  Adding new screen modes to an Amiga softcore on a Minimig or Natami does not involve adding ANY new hardware components at all, no ICs, no resistors, no boards, etc....your link to an Atari hardware page has nothing to do with anything here.  That is simply a new hardware video card made to be inserted into an existing Atari.  It just happens to use an FPGA chip to emulate the ICs and other components normally found on mass produced video cards.  Developers and hobbyists use FPGA chips for a variety of reasons.  The Natami developers chose an FPGA because obtaining real Motorola 68060 chips was too expensive and impractical.  It also gives them the ability to create "new" or enhanced CPUs in software...as well as new video and audio capabilities without having to constantly design and redesign new hardware whenever a change or extension is made.

Where have I said that AROS 68K won't support AGA?  It'll support AGA, SuperAGA and other modes/extensions as they are developed.

Huh??  AROS 68K will have all kinds of enhancements available to it as long as you run it on next generation hardware such as a Natami, Minimig or FPGAArcade board.  It also will run just fine on a classic Amiga.

Neat trick.  Post us a video of you running a 24-bit color freeware game on your classic Amiga.  I'm sure the resolution is crappy and the frame-rate abysmal. I can take my old software or your freeware game and it'll run better on the next gen FPGA based systems. That's the point of next generation hardware.  Even better trick, show us a list of developers who are currently writing 24-bit color games for classic Amigas.

[ferrellsl]

@chaoslord

OK, so I was mistaken about the Minimig, but I'm 100% correct about the Natami and other FPGA based solutions.  Adding new screenmodes and other capabilities is a matter of updating the softcore, no hardware mods necessary.  That's exactly how Yaqube was able to increase the maximum available chipram on a Minimig from 2 MB to around 50.

As for my remarks about the lack of game development for classic Amigas, I don't care if classic game developers feel loved or not.  (Strike out that last sentence.  I DO think I love you!!) My point is that there's almost zero demand for classic games and almost zero amount of accompanying classic development.  No development that anyone could make a living from anyway.  If you still develop classic software for little or no money, I laud your efforts.  You are to be commended.  It's really too bad.  I hope that next gen hardware such as the Natami and FPGAArcade will spur development a little, but I have to be realistic.  The Amiga has long since passed the point of no return from being a hobby OS.  And it's great to relive the Amiga's glory years whether I use WinUAE, a real classic or an FPGA based system.  I don't think any other computer users from our era can even relate, except maybe the Atari fans.....maybe they can relate just a little bit even if their hardware was/is inferior to the Amiga!  LOL

[ferrellsl]

xyzzy, Why do you feel the need to divert from the topic in such trolling way rather than focus on what's useful ?

He was just making a joke. Lighten up.  Just because this is an Amiga forum doesn't mean it can't be fun too!  LOL

[ferrellsl]

Assuming a cable area of 0.205 mm² (cat.5) which gives 0,188 ohm/meter and 5 V with a 5% tolerance. Ohms law U=R*I gives the maximum cable length to be 2,2 meters. Quite tight.

I hope the next board at least has space to populate it with onboard 5 V regulation.

Are you talking about the length of copper wire between the board and the AC/DC converter that plugs into the wall outlet?  Or the total combined circuit length of the board itself?  To a FPGA board-designing geek, your question is probably quite obvious, but to a novice like me, it isn't as clear.  LOL

[ferrellsl]

I just used the cat.5 as an example to demonstrate that onboard regulators have an advantage as all wires inherently will loose some voltage. The important factors is the conductor diameter and voltage tolerance.

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

And what appliances need a power cable longer than 2.2 meters anyway?  Get an extension cord!