CommodoreUSA Partners with Disney

[danwood]

So no, putting a bottom end PC into a retro case that has serious useability-issues  isn't gonna sell wll once the blitz is over.

At the risk of being overly harsh, dunno about you, but if any of my non-retro buddies walked into my place and saw a Commodore 64 sitting on my desk, they'd probably laugh and be like "you loser lol" while sitting down and playing with their iPad.

It's not a cool case design for the general public.

[danwood]

Yeahronimo and Tulip were literally at war the entire time, and I've written extensively about that history on AW.

True, the Commodore brand was jumping back and forth, but even before them Escom were selling Commodore branded PCs for a couple of years, in most of the high-street stores, they failed.  Heck, even Commodore couldn't shift Commodore branded PCs in the late 80s/early 90s, in-fact their move into PCs is often attributed as one of their financial disasters that eventually killed them.

If you couldn't market/sell Commodore PCs in 1988-1997 (when they were still a global mainstream player) I fail to see how you can in 2011, personally.

[danwood]

Do you remember how well the "New Beetle" sold when it was launched? The New Beetle had nothing to do with the original VW Bug except a vague likeness. The New Beetle was essentially a VW Golf with a 20-30% markup over the Golf.

I'm not feeling the car analogy.

[danwood]

why not, it fits perfectly... from the marketing, to the execution, right down to the price and brand awareness. You couldn't find a better example to compare with, C64x and Fiat 500 or New Beetle.

Well firstly because classic cars are actually seen as quite stylish, desirable and classy things to own, owning a computer from the 80s (or a replica) is looked at as a bit sad/nerdy and incapable today.

Some "retro" or historical/classic products age better than others, the C64 has more in common with 80s clothes/music in terms of how it's dated than a classic car.

[danwood]

Many, many reasons why the other attempts failed: lack of funding, poor planning, misguided execution, market conditions, and most importantly, they were not me, and didn't have Leo.

I understand the uber-fans feelings. I really do. What I can't wrap my head around is the extreme insanity that is verbally expressed here over this adventure. Why do they really give a rat's ass about CUSA? Why? We are doing nothing from stopping them in their current activities. Nothing at all. You are all free to buy, not buy,laugh, cry, bemoan...all you want. It has no bearing on me or my company, nor do my efforts effect anyone one of you personally. Get help...get on meds...get a life. We are not claiming to have found the cure for cancer. We are not releasing the meaning of life or world peace. We are a business, having fun. Period. If it works, great...if not. so what? No skin in the game on your part. Not any of you will suffer one iota if this attempt falls flat on it's face. At the least, there will be great cases for you to insert your antique dreams and m/b's into. Have fun..enjoy the show..and for God's sake...lighten up!!

Because the Amiga brand is something I cherish, it was a machine that literally changed my life, most of the creative things I do today, in my career and with computers were crafted and I fell in love with on the Amiga.

That little machine gave me some of the happiest and most creative years of my life, and it breaks my heart to see its name being prostituted on anything from cheap crappy PCs to knock-off Chinese iPads, and TVs you'd expect to find in supermarkets in an attempt to make a last-ditched quick buck off a name that has been devalued of all it's class/legendary status.

To use the much loved car analogy, ask a classic Ferrari fan how he'd feel about Ford Escorts selling with Testarossa badges.

[danwood]

So if the new Amigas enable you to do all of that again would you still be against it?
Because C=USA is really not into making cheap rubbish and slapping stickers... If they were I'd be the first to say "Hell no!".

Not if they're doing what I've read so far, putting generic x86 motherboards in vaguely Amiga-ish cases and calling it an Amiga.

I already have a very capable core i7 based PC for Windows 7 and Linux.  For Amiga-ness I use OS4/MorphOS and 3.9 on an A1200.  All three systems run the Amiga apps I love and want to use, all of them share the commands and file structure I expect, and are the Amiga platform in various guises.

What elements of the Amiga will CUSA Amigas bring me, apart from running the same operating systems (Linux/Windows) that I can already on my PC?  From what I see this will just be the same thing I have in my PC tower case but in a different case?

In all honesty I don't enjoy using my PC, it's just a functional tool, it's the Amiga I go to (and to a lesser extent, the Mac) when I want to enjoy using my machine.

[danwood]

I see that Barry has answered to part of what I mentioned previously with "Many, many reasons why the other attempts failed: lack of funding, poor planning, misguided execution, market conditions, and most importantly, they were not me, and didn't have Leo."

The brand recognition of which you speak existing in those days could NOT be exploited for any purpose because of the legal shenanigans. That was the only point I was trying to make about the past. If you don't fully appreciate that, talk to anyone involved with C= or Tulip during that time.
Oh...being accused of insider trading in court didn't help either. Feel free to examine the assets of Asiarim which is still the same CEO as Yeahronimo as well, etc.
If you think the Amiga "ownership" saga is a sad tale, the C= story dwarfs it by comparison. Really.

#6

Even if we accept this of the Tulip era, it still doesn't account for Escom and the original Commodore also not being able to sell Commodore branded PCs, even in the brand's heyday.  But as has been said earlier, not my money, to be honest I have little attachment to Commodore as a company, the Amiga was a platform, on the other hand, which I do.

[danwood]

There's nothing else to put in there. Custom hardware would only ensure that it's underpowered, overpriced, outdated and late to market several years. I see we're still learning lessons from the early 90s.
BTW, I love custom hardware as much as anyone else here. I just do not live in a fantasy where it will ever be a viable option with current technology. That's why it only makes sense as a hobby, a low cost hobby, preferably. So I'll get myself a classic 68K amiga and enjoy in the "customness" of the design.

Then if you want to be taken seriously as an Amiga, do what Apple have done, or what Commodore would have done.  Redevelop the Amiga OS and platform for the X86, make sure it does things the Amiga way, base it on something else if you have to, but make sure the platform holds the Amiga values, does things the Amiga way and has the spirit of the Amiga, include embedded emulation layers like Apple did with OSX to run classic apps transparently.  Innovate and carry forward the values the brand held.  Shoving an off-the-shelf PC in a custom case and shoving Ubuntu or Windows on it is not even vaguely Amiga-like.

Heck even if the original plan of putting money into AROS was carried on, I'd have been happier, but it would have taken a huge budget to get apps developed and get it to modern standards, which is probably not feasible, so don't bother.

The Amiga was a platform, not just a brand of IBM PC compatibles.  If there's no money/time to run the Amiga platform or a development of it on this machine, then you're not going to be taken for anything more than bastardizing the name for a quick buck, that's why Amiga fans take offence.

The same as Mac fans would feel if you starting selling rebadged Dells as Macs.

There was a reason we chose the Amiga over the PC/Mac in the first place, because we loved the way it did things, liked its style.

[danwood]

This is exactly what is planned. Mind you, C=USA would have NOTHING against Hyperion doing a x86 port(hell, they may even be prepared to pay for it) and selling it with C=USA Amigas. The ball is on Hyperion's court....
But for now the plan is to use Linux as a base. That could change in the future but I really don't see why is this getting so much negativity. It's pretty much the same what Gateway had in mind and it was a good plan back then and remains to this day.
.

So far all I'm hearing is something like Ubuntu with an Amiga-like skin, which is nowhere near even close.  OS 4 is fine for us hobbyists but it's not good enough to be a mainstream OS today.  

Using Linux as a core for a new OS is fine if you're being serious about developing an AmigaOS, which does things the Amiga way (C, DEVS, S etc.) is polished and has included transparent emulation layers, uses AmigaDOS commands etc. then you have my interest.

If CUSA are really developing a next gen Amiga OS which will be a platform of it's own, then of course it would have most of our support, but so far all we're hearing is it will be a generic PC in an Amiga-ish case at most with Ubuntu with an Amiga-look-a-like GNOME skin.

If it's going to be like the C64x effort, free Linux distro with VICE or similar thrown in, then that's just nowhere near good enough to warrant doing this.

[danwood]

I feel your pain; I really do. I can just imagine how you would feel if a REAL tragedy befell you. I can think of many: the death of a loved one, financial ruin, illness, too many to innumerate, and none which I would wish on my worst enemy. But what you are really describing is analogous to loosing your first love, and I am not referring to your old computer toys. Most of us have experienced the inevitable breakup of our first girlfriend or boyfriend. It was horrible...really horrible. You could never imagine yourself happy again. But guess what..time heals those wounds, and most of us move on, still remembering those moments, but still able to love again..and love another. As much, but not the same, of course.  I'm married to a shrink....and it gives me the advantage to see what maybe some of you are afraid to face. For those of you who feel so overwhelmed by all of this, talk to someone, and maybe get a handle on the problem. You may not see it, but this extreme over reacting is really not healthy, and is indicative of a somewhat aberrant behavioral problem. Send me a signed note from your therapist, and receive a free T-shirt.

What a nice patronising reply.  However it does seem that you don't understand/were not an Amiga fan from your reply, and have totally misunderstood this market.

I've lost family members and several relationships over the years, of course it's not the same on any scale.  

However my years using the Amiga were the years I first explored music making, 3d rendering, graphics, animation, video production, coding, gaming, the machine I first got on-line with, the machine that really sparked my interest in computing on a deeper level and most of the things I do for a career today started on the Amiga, it awoke my creative side in many ways, so yes I do hold the machine dear.  

It seems obvious the Amiga never touched you in such a way, hence your plan to just use it's name on any old worthless tat.

Read what other people who were passionate about the Amiga have said to try and get an understanding of what the platform means to many of us, Jim Sachs would be a good start:

"While other computers were mere appliances, the Amiga fired the imaginations of its owners."

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=54970&highlight=sachs

For me this was true, hence the reason I'm still interested in the platform 20 years on, if you're taking any passion out of the technology and it's just a brand to slap on any old computer, then of course, who gives a shit?  However to many of us here, the Amiga means more than it does to you.

[danwood]

Sorry to [snip] in order to tie these two ideas together.
But claiming the ball is on (in) Hyperion's court whilst implying there is something in the settlement that prevents such a thing from taking place is somewhat confusing.
If I'm misreading you, please clarify.

#6

As much as I enjoy using OS 4, it's not an OS that could be taken seriously as a mainstream OS without a LOT of work, same with MorphOS/AROS in their current guises.

[danwood]

for those interested in the engadget article -- and the resultant comments -- you can find it here.

-- eliyahu

Yup, a lot of them seem on the ball

"I'm guessing this is for enthusiasts only.

Its pretty much just a C-64 shell and keyboard with its innard's ripped out and replace by crappy Atom netbook components with a custom bootmenu and the option of running a C-64 emulator.

Not at all appealing. I'd be more interested in a revived Commodore Company with a brand new Amiga and modern Commodore OS. No one wants to take on Microsoft and Apple though I imagine..."

[danwood]

Here's my personal Commodore/Amiga story. If I didn't have one, I wouldn't be doing this now, would I? early 1980's...was running a large business, but didn't want to spend the $$ on a "real IBM" system ( read: could not afford). The son of one of my managers told us he would set up a C64 (toy, in my eyes), and write all the specific programs I needed. The usual, just customized for our industry; A/R, A/P, Payroll, Inv control, invoicing , w/p etc. It ran great..and had these cheap little toys installed in all 187 locations. They ran flawlessly for years...and made me a shitload of $$, even with the noisy dot matrix printers! years later, I used the Amiga w/ Newtek Video Toaster in HUNDREDS of cable company headends for their character gen and other in house productions. made a fortune on that, because the only alternative was the multi thousand $ studio equipt. that they were all using before. Long story short..i loved them then..and I still love them now. Only difference between you and me....I took my $$$ out from next to where my balls rest (my pocket) and put it into something real......and you've done what to promote and help the "cause"

You haven't done anything to promote or help the Amiga "cause" as of yet.

I also don't believe your passion for the Amiga, nobody who "loved" or cared for the Amiga as a platform would reduce it to a low-end PC in a vaguely Amiga-ish case.

Of course I look forward to being proved wrong and for you to deliver more than you have with the C64x, an atom netbook innards in an old fashioned case running Linux, but from your performance so far, my hopes aren't high.  It would seem many others in the Amiga community feel the same way, your attitude also doesn't win you many fans.

So far we've seen a low quality website with mostly stolen images from the community, trolling from you and your cohorts on various forums, such as Dammy's incessant "OS 4 users are gonna piiiissssed this month!", various name calling and venom spat around, threatening to sue OS News, intentionally trying to annoy OS 4 fans by naming some linux distro "Workbench 5" until you realised you couldn't, getting a bad rep in most of the "retro" community, and apparently releasing a netbook in an old C64 case.

Sorry but you'll have to do a hell of a lot more than that before you've convinced me you're doing anything worthwhile or valuable "for the Amiga", so far all I see are vague "threats" that you're going to basically continue to drag its name through the mud even more while claiming yourself as some kind of saviour.

Quite frankly you can piss away your money in any way you like, but personally I look forward to your pointless operation ending as soon as possible so you lot leave us all alone.  

The Amiga has been dead commercially almost 20 years, it's going to take a hell of a lot more than what you're doing to bring it back, sorry but I've seen more impressive and bigger companies come and go than you.

No I wouldn't put any of my $$$ into the Amiga or Commodore today, because the brands will not be commercially successful, they're too long dead and too retro in 2011.  I'll wait and see your sales figures, but I don't think anyone wants a PC in a 30 year old C64 case anymore than they want a blu-ray player in an early 80s VHS player case.

If you really loved the Amiga you'd at least let it die/rip with some dignity.