DCE Blizzard accelerators and clock batteries

[PG]

Hmm, please dont make this another "im mad at DCE so i have to spread dirt" thread.
Ok, i havent got a DCE board near me so i had to look at a picture of it.
I noticed a difference between the Phase5 and DCE version, the DCE has a diode instead of (what i think it is) the charging resistor.
(Near the 150 pin connector, between the battery and the crystal.)
It would be perfectly ok to use a CR2032 if you just modify the board, and im sure DCE also did it.
I dont understand why you got the idea to replace a CR2032 with a VL2020 in the first place..?
I do respect that people are angry at DCE but personally i have never had ANY problem with their products.

"Could it be that Blizzards auto sense which type of battery is used and according to type recharge or not recharge it?"

No, if a CR2032 is used, you should replace it with a CR2032.

[PG]

Framiga wrote:
"Hmm, please dont make this another "im mad at DCE so i have to spread dirt" thread."

why not? its against the Geneve Convention?

What i mean is that i dont want any more false rumours, making Blizzard 1260 owners nervous and changing battery to wrong type and maybe destroying their card while doing so.
No offence,if youre angry with DCE of course tell us about it, no problem.
Im just tired of rumours that are not true...
Some other "facts" that are floating around:

1.DCE made Blizzard 1260 has no 68020 fallback mode: not true...
2.DCE made turbocards are badly soldered: well i have had both a Phase 5 and a DCE 1260.
The DCE made was much better soldered.
3.Phase5 Blizzard 1260 are of higher quality than the DCE 1260: i had no problem with my DCE card, my Phase5 failed and i had to change cpu.

[PG]

Ok, after some reading i understand more why many people are so angry with DCE...

[PG]

"The VL2020 type can be recharged. Who wants to keep putting batteries into their Amiga trapdoor every 3-6 months and then into landfill?"

Yes, VL2020 is a rechargable battery, but you cant just replace a CR2032 with VL2020 if the board is designed for a CR2032.
And, a CR2032 will last much longer than 3-6 months, that is a fact.

[PG]

To be honest it confuses me to.
Are you sure about this, how have you measured the loading current?
Normally, you CAN (if you know what you are doing) replace a rechargable battery (for example a VL2020) with a NON-rechargable but then you have to find and replace the charging resistor with a diode.
So you only have current flowing in one direction and no loading current.

[PG]

What is the difference between a soldered CR2032 and a soldered rechargeable battery?
Havent you seen the leaking (rechargable) batterys on Amiga 4000 and Apollo 1240, they are soldered arent they?
Even a rechargable battery (VL2020 included) wont last forever.
I dont think the consumer is in a much worse position with a CR2032 than with a VL2020.

[PG]

Hyperspeed wrote:
The only place where non-rechargeable batteries are soldered permanently is novelty monkeys from a kids' shop!

Well, your obviously not an expert in electronics.
Here is another novelty monkey for you.. ;-)

http://amiga.resource.cx/photos/photo.pl?id=t1230

Even early 90's 386s had rechargeable batteries and yes, the A4000 ones leak - because they're 14 years old and the size of house!

:-D

If you didnt knew it, most modern PC:s use CR2032 as backup battery.

Apollo cards were never up to the standard of Phase 5 cards, they made a 75Mhz '060 board with no FPU.It got 10% less score than the 50Mhz Phase 5 '1260 in Amiga Format.

Phase5 AND DCE Blizzard 1260 cards has the same problem.
Ever tried to clock a Blizzard 1260 in 75Mhz?

[PG]

So, you DO have a modern PC..?
Have you replaced your CR2032 with a rechargable battery yet?.. ;-)

(After all, that was what this thread was all about, to begin with)

Quote:
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by PG:
Phase5 AND DCE Blizzard 1260 cards has the same problem.
Ever tried to clock a Blizzard 1260 in 75Mhz?


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No, because Phase5 used the XC68060RC50A which has a full FPU and MMU.

So did ACT with their A1260 50 Mhz version.

It is however widely in use at 66Mhz and far more reliable.

So you say, and you know what you are talking about from your own experience?

I always remember the Amiga Format reviews of the Blizzard cards and they were basically like Ferrari to the Apollo/Magnum boards (the Ladas).

You shouldnt believe everything you read, you know.
Sure there are people that will agree with you, but also others that are very happy with their Apollo:s.
I agree with you to the point that i also think the Blizzard is a better card in many ways, for example its memory design.
The Apollo is however slightly faster.

[PG]

x56h34 wrote:
I didn't use any equipment to measure if the VL2020 is receiving charge when installed on the B1260, however this particular battery has been sitting new and unused in my storage for a few years and during that time it would be pretty much safe to assume that the battery has been discharged due to lack of usage, so as soon as I've installed it and let it recharge for a few hours, powered off and powered back on my A1200, the time was correct, so it would be safe to assume that it is recharging.

Ok, thanks for explaining that, i think the puzzle is solved..:-)
You know, even if your battery has been in storage in many years, it should still be 2-3v.
That is why your time is correct and it doesnt prove that the battery is recharging, i think its not.

In any case, I've spoken to a friend of mine who used to be an Amiga repairman back in the day, and he says that Blizzards most probably have an RTC clock chip on-board which is autosensing the battery type.

No offence, I dont want to miscredit your friend but i say thats impossible.

This could be proven by reading the chip's model # and looking up the specs through Google, but unfortunatelly the chip itself is covered by the battery, and I don't want to desolder it just to be able to read the chip's model number. :-)

As i said before i dont have a DCE 1260 near me but i checked the Phase5 version and the chip is a M6242B from OKI.
I checked the data sheet (just to be sure..:-) and it doesnt have any such feature.
Im pretty sure the DCE version has the same chip.

Anyway, I guess I'll see how the card behaves in regards to keeping the time correctly for the next few months and in case it completely loses time at some point, I'll assume that the VL2020 is recharging.

:-)

I think it could take some time before your VL2020 drops below 2V (M6242B wants at least 2V battery backup)
but when it does i suggest you replace the battery with a CR2032.

[PG]

x56h34 wrote:
Hehe, it's a tough call to make without proper equipment to prove facts. :-)

I have the opposite, proper equipment but not a DCE card..;-)

By looking at the pictures of Phase 5 B1260 rev II and DCE B1260 cards, they look identical, other than the battery.

I guess I could always install a socketed CR2032, should my VL2020 turn out to not recharge. :-D

It is a really good idea if you want to be able to change battery, without having to desolder it.
But, i think there might be a height problem, if you want to use your card in a desktop A1200.
I would take the easy way out and just solder in a new CR2032, it will last for years.

I'm just wondering in case you are right about the clock chip not being auto-sensing of the type of battery, then which component is responsible for not letting the battery receive charge (in case of DCE B1260)? You can take a look at the picture of DCE B1260 found on the Big Book of Amiga Hardware site, and check here for a picture of Phase 5 rev II card.

Yes, if you look closely at the picture you will find that the DCE card has a diode instead of the 330 ohm resistor that the Phase5 version has.
Look below the battery, to the left.
There might be other changes to, so please dont just change the diode to a resistor on your card.
If you do so, you take the risk of damaging your card.