real amiga vs winuae

[the_leander]

This I can agree with. I have several hardware amigas, one of which cannot currently be emulated by UAE due to having a PPC board.

Did you ever try Amithlon at all, if so, how did that compare to the real deal?

[the_leander]

Baby jesus?

:lol:

[the_leander]

Fact: Motorola purposely maintained backward compatibility with 68000 according to their spec.
Experience: All 68000 software (I have tried) works fine under 68020.

As has been explained to you, this is simply not the case. That you've not used any software that is that calls on a 68000 specific function not available in later models does not change this.

People offer upgrade 68020 boards for Amiga so it's not based on some inductive knowledge.

............................................________
....................................,.-‘”...................``~.,
.............................,.-”...................................“-.,
.........................,/...............................................”:,
.....................,?......................................................\,
.................../...........................................................,}
................./......................................................,:`^`..}
.............../...................................................,:”........./
..............?.....__.........................................:`.........../
............./__.(.....“~-,_..............................,:`........../
.........../(_....”~,_........“~,_....................,:`........_/
..........{.._$;_......”=,_.......“-,_.......,.-~-,},.~”;/....}
...........((.....*~_.......”=-._......“;,,./`..../”............../
...,,,___.\`~,......“~.,....................`.....}............../
............(....`=-,,.......`........................(......;_,,-”
............/.`~,......`-...............................\....../\
.............\`~.*-,.....................................|,./.....\,__
,,_..........}.>-._\...................................|..............`=~-,
.....`=~-,_\_......`\,.................................\
...................`=~-,,.\,...............................\
................................`:,,...........................`\..............__
.....................................`=-,...................,%`>--==``
........................................_\..........._,-%.......`\
...................................,<`.._|_,-&``................`\

The experience by itself doesn't allow you draw a general conclusion for everything just like running a few titles on emulator does not prove emulator is same as real amiga.

[the_leander]

It's the same for 0x86-- there's some minor differences.

Err, excuse me. Your whole point was about pure hardware compatability, this is clearly and demonstratably not so, not on x86 and not on 68k. With each significant step things were lost and added. The result is that compatability, whether you like it or not, is maintained only through software.

 But they are still considered backward compatible NOT incompatible.

Thats as may be, it doesn't change the fact that a certain amount of emulation software is required to maintain that compatability. Something that you have vehemently denied the necessity for.

  Stop with the insults-- just exposes your biased fanatical nature.

There's that word again. You seriously don't know what it means, do you?

As for insults, hah! I haven't even begun to insult you yet. Quite frankly the poor quality drivel you have been headsticking here isn't worthy of insult.

[the_leander]

I already know there are minor differences.  But the essence works on hardware level-- no library needed.  I can boot up 68020 machine right now and run 68000 code w/o any drivers.

Try doing the same with either an 040 or 060 without the requisite 040/060 library.
 

No the compatibility is there w/o software but perhaps there's some rare piece of software that needs it.  
http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/68020/

Go ahead and do the above and see how far your system gets. BTW, your brochure does not cut it as evidence.

You don't.  You are biased towards PCs as is evident throughout this thread and the other thread I particpate in.  So it's calling a spade a spade.

I am niether for nor against the PC, it's not important enough for me to have a bias about.

You haven't refuted any of my points nor even addressed most of them yet have already insulted.  Don't need much intelligence to insult people-- Perhaps I can get some kindergarten kids to reply to you.

Err, yes I have refuted your points, done so time and again, that you have chosen a path of wilful ignorance is not my or anyone elses problem. Whenever you're confronted by anyone who disagrees with you you accuse them of "bias" or you simply flat out ignore them prefering instead to repeat the same, tired BS over and over.
So go get a kid to reply, most young kids are less liable to lie or twist things to suite their purposes. I can teach a kid to provide verifiable evidense to back up their argument. Aparently this lesson is lost on you.

[the_leander]

You stand corrected right?

Karlos has covered this better then I. Getting an 040 system to boot without that lib is a pain and leaves the system fatally undermined.

Not unbootable, but far from your picture of no issues.

>Go ahead and do the above and see how far your system gets. BTW, your brochure does not cut it as evidence.

It's not "mine".  There are many links that state the same.  

Yes, and how many of them are have more then a laundry list of capabilities? It does not in any way cover specifics. Moreover - you demanded that Karlos look at the Motorola manuals, he has, have you?

>I am niether for nor against the PC, it's not important enough for me to have a bias about.

I can PROVE you are biased towards PCs from what you have written in the two threads I am subscribed to.  

Given your "proof" for everything else you've said thus far, this should be a blast.

PROTIP: You saying it repeatedly does not make it so.

>Err, yes I have refuted your points, done so time and again, that you have chosen a path of wilful ignorance is not my or anyone elses problem.

Your ignorance was just proven-- you think a library is required and it's not.  

Yes, yes it is. Running without it on an 040 system leaves you at all times a hairtrigger away from bombing out. You claim time and again software emulation is unnecessary.

You have yet to address many other points made and I won't waste my time linking to them as you are proven time and time again to blurt out blind statements like above.

Because those points have been shot down so thoroughly that it isn't funny any more. That you choose not to acknowledge that is proof of your fanaticism.

Kids can insult you better than you can insult me.

Oh noes!

[the_leander]

Notice the fatal error in the middle shot? That's right, an unhandled line F exception, which if you knew anything at all about 680x0 you'd recognise as an unimplemented instruction exception.

Directly compatible, my erse. You want to use an 040 or 060? You need the library, unless rebooting your machine is your favourite hobby.

[the_leander]

Oh here and there.

Am uploading them as and when I find an opening to use them

[the_leander]

I can read his writing as well.

Clearly you didn't, because otherwise you would have stopped embarrassing yourself.

problems with some words like biased and objectivity.

On the contrary, I along with the rest of the english speaking world have a clear understanding of what those words mean. You however have shown repeatedly that you do not.

Go read what I actually said before you reply.

I did, you stated that there was no need whatsoever for software emulation on the 68k series - thus proving its superiority to the x86 which you slammed for needing software emulation to provide 16bit compatability.

This has been demonstrated to be false.

It's easier to search online then read through the manuals again.  But definitely I remember reading object code compatibility.

And again, we have someone here who has shown that what you claim is not so. We have the manuals that explain in ball aching detail as to why you are wrong and multiple users of this side giving verifiable facts as to where those incompatabilities lay. And you've ignored it all.

Easier? I've no doubt. It also stops you from having to face reality too...

and see if you are emotional sane enough to acknowledge it.

Ah, so, if someone disagrees with you, not only are they "biased" "lacking objectivity" but are now also insane and or emotionally unstable?

And you wonder where people get the idea that you're a fanatic?

The very first point about joysticks you said my data was "utter rubbish".  

It is utter rubbish for the reasons already explained to you. You have been given a way of testing with 100% certainty one way or the other as to whether or not your claims hold water. Rather then carry out those tests, you have continued to repeat the claims without the evidence to back it up.

biased

Disagreeing with you!=bias

I can't even argue with you anymore.

And yet here you are, continuing to...

your biased views.

Disagreeing with you and presenting information to back up the opposing case!= bias.

I stated CLEARLY all of my software boots up fine without the library.  What's the fanaticism?  I also quoted links.

Anecdotal, which has already been destroyed by the demonstration given by Karlos.

thop wiv bu intholts!!

Ah, your ride has arrived:

As soon as somene replies (right or wrong) you think my views are thoroughly shot down.

Err, no. You see, everyone who has countered your claims has backed up their points with evidence. You have provided... some anecdotal evidence, a lot of unverified claims, a website that is pretty much just a brochure and well, not much else really. You've been given ample opportunties to retest your hypothesis using a valid, viable method. Tbh I think it's clear at this point that the reason you haven't is because you realise your claim is flawed but cognitive dissonance denies you the ability to back down now.

[the_leander]

I taught a few kindergarten kids to upload silly pictures recently.

Pithy.

[the_leander]

She is like a child who plays name-calling and just saying "No."

And thus, amigaksi's powers of observation are proven beyond any reasonable doubt.

You can't follow the logic, that's your problem.

This board has seen your "logic". What we have asked for (and you've failed to provide, instead prefering to slime out of points either by talking about something else entirely or by accusations of bias, lacking objectivity, emotional unsound and/or insane), is viable documantary evidence.

Something that you have singularly refused to provide.

Get a clue and speak something logical.

I also showed manuals and I also ran code that works.

You misspelled brochure and fails.

Your whole argument in a nutshell:

stop replying and proving my claim that you are biased.

And this ladies and gentlmen is what he's been reduced to: Demanding anyone who disagrees with him to be silent or face threats against their character.

"Science, or at least, good science is a free exchange of ideas, anything else is a kind of tyranny." - Stephen Fry.

So in conclusion:

[the_leander]

All you do is blurt out whatever comes up in your head without any coherent relationship to the arguments being presented.

Says the person who has not yet provided one shred of evidence to back up his claims, verses valid, technical and practical demonstrations of where you are wrong.

On every single point you have made, there have been a half dozen explanations of varying degrees of complexity explaining how far off the mark you are. You, in a display of cognitive dissonance that almost classes as art have as rebuttals provided a graphic showing signal bounce, a brochure, and the all time funny of accusing people of being biased/lacking objectivity/emotionally unstable/insane.

Your argument is just as good as the following argument against you:

And thus, leander is proven to be a monkey who randomly logged into Amiga.org by randomly pressing the correct keystrokes.

This is a strawman (like every other accusation you've leveled at others, you failed to correctly use it ^ that is a classic strawman).

See, the difference is that I can (and have) back my arguments up. And my point that you ignored, (I'm past thinking that you are actually capable of taking in anything that doesn't automatically agree with you) was that even on basic observation, you failed.

With this in mind, how can anything else you say be taken seriously when you fail to cope even with the basics?

[the_leander]

Yeah, but it seems like some people have the ignore feature built-into their heads-- they read posts and say the samething as if they read nothing.