Pegasos to go on sale Monday / Pegasos II to ship September 2003

[Herewegoagain]

My thoughts on this are that no product should be advertised as "obsolete" or "soon to be replaced" for any reason.  It's good that they are looking forward to the next design, but that should be transparent to the end user.  When the PegasosII is nearing a presentable stage, then it should have been announced that the original Pegasos would be phased out.  That's the way a normal company would do it.  You don't stop production on something people want and not make it available for 7 months, just because you want to "up the ante" against the competition.

@senex

Unless you have some proof that they have found more bugs in Artica, etc.... please stop speculating.  (that is where the term FUD comes in).    Do you really think that Mai would have recently recieved "Ready for IBM Technology" validation of the Artica S if it was so buggy as you claim???  To quote from Mai's page:

"MAI Logic has successfully developed optimized supporting devices and reference designs for PowerPCTM microprocessor application platforms which have passed a rigorous PowerPCTM compatibility validation testing process by IBM Microelectronics labs,"said Lisa Su, Director of PowerPCTM and emerging products, IBM Microelectronics. "Solutions like MAI's 'Ready for IBM Technology' chipset and evaluation systems give developers more ways to enhance their applications, resulting in improved time to market, more cost effective designs, and improved performance products by our OEM customers."

Doesn't sound like the bug laden chip you are trying to make it out to be.  And the other thing to think about is that engineering samples of the  Artica P are listed as being available in 1Q2003.  So it's not out of the question that it could be used for the Pegasos II.

[Herewegoagain]

Anyway, we just all lack facts !  

Ppl who believe Hyperion will always be against ppl who believe guys from the MOS team...

So let's just stop being sided, and only judge from real facts.

So, can anyone prove us the articia bugs on A1's ?

No, it's not about being against someone who is "on the other side".  If you read the link on Mai's website, the Artica S has been given IBM's approval.  IBM are not on either side.  IBM has evaluated the product and said it works as should with PPC.  Doesn't mean that it is completely bug free, as nothing is ever totally bug free.  But Senex is making it sound as though the chip is still so buggy that it's completely unusable for the Pegasos or any other system.

Don't believe me or MAI's website?  Go here and look on IBM's site.
  Click here for info on Teron PX with Artica S and it's validation with IBM.

Or check IBM's site here for info on all MAI products.

Now will you say that IBM don't know enough about the chip to say it's ok?   Or are they just giving it approval based on MAI saying it is ok and works???

[Herewegoagain]

Genesi has delivered. Eyetech+Hyperion has not. As simple as that!

Both have delivered something on the hardware side.  Neither are available to the general public who wants to go buy one.  And the number of boards produced by either company is hardly an amount to boast about or reason to claim victory over the other.

Bottom line, they both are yet unavailable to the end consumer, so they are practically at the same status, regardless of who is further along in development or not.  Neither has an advantage right now, other than personal preferences.  It really IS as simple as that!

[Herewegoagain]

Well, I hope that Genesi puts an extra ROM socket on the Pegasos II.  (Are you listening Genesi??  ;-) )

There are those who will want it, and as long as you are redesigning....might as well provide for that too!

[Herewegoagain]

They could. But it doesn't make sense just to give them a CPU card so that people can feel good when you know that there could be much more speed if there was another NB. It would be unfair to all of those who want the real speed of the G4 CPU.

LOL!  It's so funny to hear all of this now.  Before this announcement the Pegasos was "all that, and a bag of chips".  Now it's dumping the current chipset because it's so buggy they cannot get the real speed of the G4 CPU!!!!  Please stop trying to make excuses for Genesi and Pegasos.  It's not the worst thing that they are redesigning it.  But please at least be willing to look at all of the companies involved Eyetech, Mai, IBM, Terrasoft, etc... and they are not having these problems that the Pegasos is having.  Just for once admit that it could inherently be a design flaw in the original Pegasos board.  It wouldn't be a crime, and certainly not the first time this sort of thing has happened.  

People on "both sides", please listen.  These boards are new and in the greater scheme of things, RELATIVELY UNTESTED in everyday use.  That's not to say completely untested, but problems will continue to arrise from both side as the user base grows.  The orignal Amiga's had issues that had to be worked on as well.  Genesi obviously see's a need to go back and redesign.  Good.  While they are at it, they will make improvements based upon what is currently available.  That makes sense.  This will likely happen in the next revision of AmigaOnes as well (it's already happened to a lesser extent).  Let's just see what the next few months hold for us all.  

This is good news in the long run.  As it ups the specs that AmigaOne systems will have to match.  Maybe the next version will use DDR and AGP4-8X and etc.  By this, Genesi are pushing Eyetech to start on the next big thing (if they haven't already).  That can only be good for us all.

[Herewegoagain]

Yes, you're right IBM is really interested in the
current situation with the MAI chipsets.

Are you trying to be sarcastic, or do you have inside info from IBM?  If IBM were so concerned and not satisfied over the quality of MAI's chips, why did the Articia S and Teron CX/PX boards just recieve "Ready for IBM Technology" validation from IBM itself?  And why are IBM listing MAI and their products on their website if it is so buggy?

[Herewegoagain]

Nobody ever said that the Mai chip was so buggy as to be unusable. By being usable in some manner, even if in a limited fashion, Mai could pass the worst piece of crap imaginable.

Not said in so few words, but read the crap Senex is spewing on about April2 and April3, the chip is so difficult to mount to the board (maybe they should let the far Eastern company do it for them since it's so hard)  I thought they were expert designers, and they complain the chip is too hard to mount to the board?

Mai's chipset passed IBM's minimum requirements, namely 32 address pins and 33Mhz local bus.

So you are saying this is all it takes to get the IBM approval?  I'll quote Lisa Su of IBM once again
.... R E A D   S L O W L Y...........

"MAI Logic has successfully developed optimized supporting devices and reference designs for PowerPCTM microprocessor application platforms which have passed a rigorous PowerPCTM compatibility validation testing process by IBM Microelectronics labs,"said Lisa Su, Director of PowerPCTM and emerging products, IBM Microelectronics.

Note the part about
"a rigorous PowerPCTM compatibility validation testing process "

That doesn't sound like IBM looked at it and said "Hmm.  32 address pins and 33MHz PCI bus" BOOM! (stamp of approval sound)

It's always easy for people on Genesi's side to trivialize other peoples accomplishments and to raise their own into such high esteem.  But then again, I think your posts speak louder than what I'm trying to say.  Anyone who looks at this whole fiasco can pretty much sum up what's going on.   Genesi should not burn so many bridges, as they may need to cross the river again some day.

[Herewegoagain]

Sorry, but the Pegasos2 is 90% complete, in
Betatest and heavily tested by the Genesi
betatesters and only needs chipset integration!

LOL!  You people just won't stop will you???  You  attack Hyperion when they say that OS 4 is well underway in beta testing, and blast them claiming it cannot be because the 68k JIT is not integrated yet.  Then you turn around and claim that the Pegasos II is already heavily tested by Genesi betatesters and only needs chipset integration!!!!  Did BB tell you this?  The chipset integration is where they had all of the problems with the original Pegasos!!!!