Your Dream Place Or Country That You Would Like To Visit

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mdma wrote:

I wouldn't think so.

Even if every single last person on the Island wanted to get rid of Castro and embrace capitalism, why would they want to give up their sovereignty  and national identity to another power?  One day your Cuban, the next you are American. I don't think so.

Actually given how close the votes in Puerto Rico are, and how close the vote in Cuba was when they voted on it, I think it likely that Cuba would vote to become a state.  Economically it would be huge for them, and they would still be Cuban, much like others are New Yorkers, Floridians, Texans or Hawaiians.  Given that Cuba is the country with the largest portion of its population living outside the country, I'm not sure it would even be a close if those cubans were repatriated after Castros death.  The other worry is that Castro's death will lead to an even larger influx of Cubans to Florida if the government collapses as many think it will.  I'm not sure Cuba can afford to lose another 25% of its population to immigration to the US.
    -Bill    
   

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Liked Tanzania well enough that I am going back there in May, Ngorongoro Crater and the Serengeti are truly spectacular.  Egypt is probably going to be the trip of the year in 2006.  
     -Tig

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mdma wrote:

It's for precisely those reasons that I want to go to Cuba before Castro dies.

Why so interested in seeing a poorly run communist dictatorship with people in poverty.  Lots of more interesting countries to visit in the Caribbean.  

Maybe if US businessmen were allowed to trade with Cuba, then there wouldn't be as many Cubans swimming to Florida.

What exactly is Cuba going to sell us that is going to help Cuba's economy??   The cigars really arent that good anymore, and frankly most everything else is cheaper/better elsewhere.  

As a republican you should be disgusted that your government is restricting your freedom to trade and make money.

What if I am a democrat??  I mean should I be disgusted as well, or do I not care about things like that??   If I didnt like Carter because he got several of my friends killed, is that what made me a Republican in your mind??? No US president (Democrat or Republican) nor congress (Democrat ran or Republican ran) has seriously tried to change US Cuba policy is that a failure of both parties in your mind, or just the Republicans.  Why in your mind is the US REQUIRED to trade with Cuba?
    -Tig

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mdma wrote:

Because it is so unlike the country I or you live in. I don't know about you Tigger but I am interested in different cultures, and how other people live.

I too am interested in other cultures, and among the 47 countries I have visited, have seen all types of governments in action, personally going to cuba and helping fund a brutal dictatorship isn't what I want to do on my vacation.

What I was referring to was, in actual fact, you as an individual should be free to sell and buy from anyone you want.

I so totally disagree with that statement, I dont know how to respond.  I don't think I should be free to sell or buy from anyone I want.  As part of this mythical freedom of yours should I be able to sell and buy anything??  Can I sell/buy drugs, guns and people with this freedom???  
     -Tig
       

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mdma wrote:

Maybe, but that decision has been taken away from you anyway.  I personally am free to visit whatever country I wish to visit.  Do you agree that I have more freedom than you do?

If I wanted to go to Cuba, I could go to Cuba, Americans do it all the time, we just can't fly there directly from the US, but since there are 100's of countries you can't fly to cuba from directly thats not really an issue.   You go to Mexico or the Dominican Republic and take a puddle jumper to Cuba.  My friends who have been there tell me its pretty much like the other very poor communist countries I have been to, only poorer and on an island.  Sorry but a return to Belize, Honduras or Mexico (all of which I went to this year) all sound more fun then that.      

I so totally disagree with that statement, I dont know how to respond. I don't think I should be free to sell or buy from anyone I want. As part of this mythical freedom of yours should I be able to sell and buy anything?? Can I sell/buy drugs, guns and people with this freedom???

Yes

Cool, glad to see you family has your sale listed on Ebay, what size of Owned by Tigger T-shirt do I need to get you??  Do you come with shoes???
        -Tig

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mdma wrote:

Thus proving my point.  You have been to a communist country, I haven't and Cuba is pretty much the only one left that has nice weather. ;-)

China, Vietnam, Myyanmar (Burma) and Laos all have gorgeous weather and better scenery.  

So I see you think that restriction on trade is a good thing.  How socialist of you Tigger.  Or should I say hypocritical? Make yer mind up.

I think there are things that shouldnt be for sale (including yourself), that makes me an abolishist not a Socialist.  
    -Tig

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mdma wrote:

China is not communist, my best friend is currently living in China as a University Lecturer.  In his words "The UK is more socialist than China".  He's going to Vietnam for a week soon, so I'll let you know what he says about Vietnam when he reports back.

China most certainly is communist, anyone who doesnt understand that has limited grasp of reality.  Vietnam is too, been there, seen that.  
     -Tig  
   

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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:

Tigger wrote:
China, Vietnam, Myyanmar (Burma) and Laos all have gorgeous weather and better scenery.

You obviously never went to China, considering your opinion about the weather there...
China is BIIIIIG y'know...

You are obviously wrong, I have been to China, in fact there was a long thread on here when I got back.  China in the summer is very nice, sure its a big country, but Beijing is a spectacular capital city and Guilin is one of the prettiest places on earth.  Throw in the Terra Cotta warriors at Xian and some time on the Yangtze and thats a real vacation.   Hong Kong and Shanghai are also always worth a visit.  
    -Tig

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mdma wrote:

Helloooooooooo!?!?!?!?

My friend LIVES in the fekking country, he's not there on holiday.

China is a dictatorship, that doesn't make it communist.
It's a peoples republic only in name, as my friend said the UK is more socialist than China.

My friend is an EXTREMELY well educated man, and has several degrees and a masters to his name.  So when he tells me China isn't communist I tend to believe him, rather than some bloke on a web forum who lives up to the stereotype of the arrogant yank traveller that so shames the rest of their country.

If you friend honestly doesnt realize that China is a communist country, then he shouldn't have spent all that money on his education, most of the high school students on this site understand china is communist, why is your friend having trouble.  The chinese government themselves will tell you they are a communist government.   Noone in there right mind thinks that the UK is more socialist then China.   Anyone here besides mdma want to argue that China isn't a communist country and that UK is more socialist then China??  
    -Tig
   

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Karlos wrote:
Like capatlist countries it has free trade and individial people / buisnesses can prosper. Indeed, they are doing. Expect to be eclipsed by chinas economy in the not too distant future.

Very little free trade for a country that size, basically enough to qualify for WTO, the tightning of trade in Hong Kong since the takeover is just one of the signs of that.   As for being eclipsed by chinas economy, first of all there 9-1 sex ratio is going to become a problem before there economy gets that big, and the huge loss of there population which will be wiped out when 3 gorges collapses is going to pretty much cripple there economy.   Just remember the largest disaster of the 21st century will be the collapse of 3 gorges dam, maybe one of those followers of nostradamus who seem to hang out on Amiga websites can make a quatrane mean that.   In addition, since the original conversation was about visiting communist Cuba, I'm sorry but frankly Cuba is less communist then China, though both are communist governments.  
    -Tig

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mdma wrote:

You clearly show you have no idea what Communism is Tigger.  In Cuba, the "people"(state) own everything, hence the problem the USA has with Cuba.

Actually that has nothing to do with our issue with Cuba, ask any American who understands the Cuba issue and they will tell you the same thing.  

China on the other hand allows individual wealth and prosperity and also foreign investment and ownership of property and businesses.

Some and very limited, my company does business with China every day, I know all about what we can and cannot do there.
Most housing is still owned by the government, most businesses are still owned by the government, foreign investors by and large have minority stakes.  Its great to say you have private ownership, but if the government can and will take it away from you at will, do you really own it???  Two million people have been told to move as part of 3 Gorges, by and large there is no place for them to move, but there current homes are going to be underwater, so they have to move.

If you want to try and understand what Communism is meant to be, and why there has NEVER been a Communist state, and almost certainly NEVER will be,

Read the book, they didnt make a movie.  But thats besides the point, you said you wanted to go to a communist country, which is why you wanted to go to Cuba.  You can't hide behind there never has been a communist state when you are the one who said Cuba was one.
    -Tig

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PMC wrote:
@Tigger

According to the CIA, China is expected to eclipse the USA as the number one superpower within 15 years.  Right now, China is loaning the US billions of dollars to keep the economy afloat, and sooner or later will want to collect on that loan.  

Just where did you get the information that makes you think that the 3 gorges dam is going to collapse?  

I know all about the CIA report, and unrestrained it probably would eclipse the US economy, however there are several factors (two of which I mentioned) that the CIA didnt factor in.  The first being the huge sex schism in the country, male children outnumber female children by a factor of as high as 7 or 8 to 1 in major cities due to the 1 child rule.  Secondly the dam, 30 miles downstream from 3 gorges the chinese built a dam to work on the techniques they would use at 3 gorges, in 2000 when I sailed through that area, I got two impressions, one that the 3 gorges dam was already showing cracks and secondly that the 8(?) year older dam downstream looked like it was about to collapse.  In 2002, the downstream dam did indeed collapse, shortly after they closed the gates on 3 gorges.  But dont take my word for it, a google of Three Gorges collapse, will give you lots of professional opinions about the situation.  The filling of the reservoir will cause earthquakes in the area, and though the dam is designed to withstand up to 7.0, I'm not sure I would bet on it.  Of course I wonder what the folks up north think of the the dam the Chinese call the Canadian Dam??  But hey apparently today the Chinese announced they want to build a tunnel or bridge to Taiwan, thats an even crazier idea then 3 gorges.
    -Tig

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PMC wrote:
Calm down chaps, please!

@Tigger

According to the CIA, China is expected to eclipse the USA as the number one superpower within 15 years.  Right now, China is loaning the US billions of dollars to keep the economy afloat, and sooner or later will want to collect on that loan.  

In addition,  I think it likely that Rawski (and his friends) are more likely right about the current state of Chinas economy then the CIA.   Goldman Sachs seems to agree with me.
   -Tig