Work is work - or why job application forms and CVs are bullsh!t

[mikeymike]

And if anyone would like to read something on a more positive note:

http://www.mikeymike.org.uk/mikes/desiderata.txt

[the_leander]

@ Mikeymike

That is perhaps one of the most profound yet gentle reads I have read in a VERY long time. Thankyou.

@KennyR

If I were a prospective employer who was reading what you'd said in this thread, not only would I not give you a job but I 'd slap you for being such an a$$hat.

You want a job, you play the game, you lie through your back teeth on your CV (BTW, did I mention to anyone I'm actually a Duke?) And smile like you're on tranks. You don't swear, you ask questions when unclear about something. BUT FFS MAN LEAVE THE UNIVERSITY ATTITUDE BEHIND YOU.

So its not who you are, big deal. You want food in yer belly and a roof over yer head, you work, to work, you have to get off that high horse of yours and bend and cotort until you get one, if you're lucky, you get one that A pays worth a damn, and B you enjoy.

[cecilia]

well, lets not go beating up on Kenny.
The facts of life are that none of this is fun, fair or nice.
You people should try Los Angeles, the phoney arm-pit of the universe.
there is every know prejudice there and then some.
Even after getting an emmy nomination it still took the company I was working for about a year and a half to get work.
And the first person to get employed (elsewhere) was this 23 year old kid. because he was a GUY and 23.
I've gone to interviews where I've basically been told it was a "boys club".
so, i'm OUT.

I'm not one of the beautiful people. I don't have a goatee, I don't look like a surfer, blah, blah, blah...
mind you, they don't SAY that because they are all a bunch or sniviling cowards, but I know.

There is such a thing as "The Grey List". it's mostly for directors, but anytime they think you are Too Old, forget it.
a 30 year old writer was fired because they found out how old she was and figured she was TOO old for that series!!!!

Yeah, you read right 30.
man, are they stupid!

anyway, even at my age, i still get no respect. I still get people who are quite happy to rip me off and shaft me. even while they try to figure out how to exploit MY Emmys for their own benefit. (well, they TRY, I do what I can to prevent it).

Yeah, I refuse to lie, I refuse to suck some fat pigs' dick, I refuse to steal, i refuse to be a piece of sh.it

sorry, but that's how I am and I'm not changing.
Basically it takes alot of time and effort to find people who are worthy of my abilities and talents.

Unfortunately, the superior people I knew in LA have died and I'm at a loss to know what to do at this point.

What I do know is that at least I didn't waste my life and I have nothing to be ashamed of.

[KennyR]

Ah, at least Cecilia understands what integrity is, out of the lot of you. Pride in one's own values, and complete refusal to compromise them. Some of you should learn how to be more faithful to your own beliefs and not make system whores of yourselves.

[that_punk_guy]

Uh-huh... I shouldn't have taken that job. I should have starved instead.

People in some situations just don't have the choice, much as I sympathise with you. :-(

[KennyR]

tpg wrote:
Uh-huh... I shouldn't have taken that job. I should have starved instead.

Doing work isn't the part I detest. We all have to do stuff we don't want, that's how civilisation works. But this layer of pretentiousness they have over the whole jobs industry really stifles it and makes entry really hard for the right kind of people, the kind of people I'd want working for me if I was an employer. Instead we just get people well trained in the art of glamorising every little mundane and banal thing in their lives and turning it into positive - but very false - things to say.

People in some situations just don't have the choice, much as I sympathise with you.

They do have a choice in some situations: to be more honest and to put a cap on the industry bullsh!t fountain from concerted effort. But like that's ever going to happen... :-(

KennyR wrote:
Doing work isn't the part I detest. We all have to do stuff we don't want, that's how civilisation works. But this layer of pretentiousness they have over the whole jobs industry really stifles it and makes entry really hard for the right kind of people, the kind of people I'd want working for me if I was an employer.

I maintain my case.  Until your attitude changes, you will pretty much remain unemployable.  I know.  I've been there.  I'm not saying the games are good, necessary, or even warranted, but they have the money, they have the job.  If they want you to do a song and dance to get what they have, that's entirely THEIR call.  

I realize that you're very, very young (and at least apparently naive), but you'll figure it out eventually.

[cecilia]

If you want creative workers, give them enough time to play. - John Cleese, comic actor

[T_Bone]

KennyR wrote:
Plumbing? Whatever, I'd still get the position snatched away by buzzword fiends who say they're dynamic and flexible and whatever else crap they spout on these forms. Not to mention the brazen liars who say their hobbies include parachuting, windsurfing and potholing just to look interesting.

 :lol: Too true!

Reminds me of Personal Ads. "Enjoys fine dining, walks on the beach, camping, horseback riding"

What do you actually know about someone once you filter out the trendy "spice it up" cliches everyone includes?

 

[iamaboringperson]

What do you actually know about someone once you filter out the trendy "spice it up" cliches everyone includes?

 

Speaking of cliches...

Don't say that you're a 'hard worker'. That's WAAAY over used, and an employer will certainly get sick of hearing it!

Use the term 'conciencious' instead.

:-)

[mikeymike]

Ah, at least Cecilia understands what integrity is, out of the lot of you. Pride in one's own values, and complete refusal to compromise them. Some of you should learn how to be more faithful to your own beliefs and not make system whores of yourselves.

Thanks for the insult KennyR.  Not sure what I said to deserve it.

In the meantime, I'm doing what I've wanted to do for a long time (self-employed IT techie), while searching for a job at the same time.

[iamaboringperson]

[Speelgoedmannetje]

cecilia wrote:
I've gone to interviews where I've basically been told it was a "boys club".

Such is explicitly forbidden here in NL (and most probably also in the US). You can sue them.

But KennyR, I recognise very much in the complaints of you, but my parents told me to deal with it, because they WON'T change.
I am not someone who really can represent himself. I am no way a 'beach boy'. I do not have tone of voice, I hardly have any facial expression, and I or I look ppl way too deep in the eyes, or I do not look ppl in the eyes at all.
Yet I do not worry about getting a job. Just being on the right place on the right time, having a patient and friendly attitude and focus primarily on your motivations why you chose the job should be enough.

[cecilia]

mikeymike wrote:

Ah, at least Cecilia understands what integrity is, out of the lot of you. Pride in one's own values, and complete refusal to compromise them. Some of you should learn how to be more faithful to your own beliefs and not make system whores of yourselves.

Thanks for the insult KennyR.  Not sure what I said to deserve it.

ah, well, try to forgive kenny his outburst, born of frustration and youth. I'm sure he really didn't mean you. everybody knows you are a nice guy.
 :-D

[cecilia]

Speelgoedmannetje wrote:

cecilia wrote:
I've gone to interviews where I've basically been told it was a "boys club".

Such is explicitly forbidden here in NL (and most probably also in the US). You can sue them.

I've no doubt that Europe is more civilized than Los Angeles.
However, suing everytime someone does this is only possible if (a) one has endless money and (b) endless time to waste.
plus, once someone proves themselves to be such scum, THEY don't deserve me. I don't want to work for people that don't appreciate me.

this is also where the whole stupidity of Political Correctness comes in. Afraid to "say" what they think, they dance around the issue. People in LA NEVER say "no". they just don't call you back.

they are spineless, dickless eunuchs.

Just being on the right place on the right time, having a patient and friendly attitude and focus primarily on your motivations why you chose the job should be enough.

yup! luck seems to be the only saving grace, here. it was luck that put me in contact with Tony and Frank and I just took the bull by the horns and realized I wanted to be associated with these wonderful guys. and at first I didn't know how great they were.
you have to trust your instincts.
but, often there seems no luck at all, and that's very depressing.

[the_leander]

KennyR wrote:

tpg wrote:
Uh-huh... I shouldn't have taken that job. I should have starved instead.

Doing work isn't the part I detest. We all have to do stuff we don't want, that's how civilisation works. But this layer of pretentiousness they have over the whole jobs industry really stifles it and makes entry really hard for the right kind of people, the kind of people I'd want working for me if I was an employer. Instead we just get people well trained in the art of glamorising every little mundane and banal thing in their lives and turning it into positive - but very false - things to say.

People in some situations just don't have the choice, much as I sympathise with you.

They do have a choice in some situations: to be more honest and to put a cap on the industry bullsh!t fountain from concerted effort. But like that's ever going to happen... :-(

Pride and integrety are one thing, but you seem to take to extreems. I'm sorry if I seem rather angry in my last post but I consider things like food of greater importance, especially when I consider that my son also has to eat. So you have to be "Interview Kenny" for what? half an hour.. so what! You can take pride and have integrety in yer job but you got to be more flexable in yer approach to getting the job. As for glamorising the mundane, have you ever thought that that is what keeps them going? When I was a cleaner, I know it was what kept me going. The pay and conditions were crap, but I kept going and thats how I did.

(BTW cleaning is perhaps the most soul destroying job one can embark in, you do a great job, only for the people you clean for ruin it day after day after day. But I'm proud I stuck at it for 18 months until I got my nightshift factory job, shame that didn't last heh).