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AuthorTopic: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000  (Read 2750 times)

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Offline WeiXing3D

OK, now that my mouse woes are gone, I would like to ask for the support of the fellow Amigans, with guidance on how to install and configure Amigakit's    
SCSI to Micro SD Interface Adapter http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1264

The technician who replaced the battery of my A3000, says that he couldn't mount the adapter. When I asked Amigakit in an message sent to support, I was told that there was no installation manual or anything else needed.

The codesrc site says that I need a mounting bracket, power and scsi cables, even a USB cable.

Can anyone shed some light of what is needed for the installation, or better yet, can someone please share some pictures showing how is installed inside the Amiga?

These are pictures of my existing configuration:


Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline Matt_H

Basically, you just replace the existing hard drive with the adapter. Power and SCSI cables all line up.

But before that, you should plug it into a PC via USB (it's port-powered) to configure it (SCSI ID and a few other settings). No USB needed for regular operation.

When mounting in the 3000, the only complicated thing is that you'll need some screws AND nuts to secure it to the drive mounting bracket. With a traditional hard drive you just need screws, but since the adapter is just a thin board there's nothing for the screws to lock onto. Hence the need for nuts. I think I ended up using a few extras to raise the board from the bracket as well.
 

Offline WeiXing3D

Quote from: Matt_H;805447
Basically, you just replace the existing hard drive with the adapter. Power and SCSI cables all line up.

But before that, you should plug it into a PC via USB (it's port-powered) to configure it (SCSI ID and a few other settings). No USB needed for regular operation.

When mounting in the 3000, the only complicated thing is that you'll need some screws AND nuts to secure it to the drive mounting bracket. With a traditional hard drive you just need screws, but since the adapter is just a thin board there's nothing for the screws to lock onto. Hence the need for nuts. I think I ended up using a few extras to raise the board from the bracket as well.

EDITED QUESTIONS:: @Matt_H - After reading your post again, I realized what you are saying about the installation of the adapter. I will be using the same holes in which the existing HDD unit is mounted now, to fix the adapter with screw and nuts. Since I d not have a good stuck of screws and nuts and nuts, do you happen to know the size of them?

And regarding the actual use of the SD card, I want to replace my bootable HDD , the small Quantum (ID 6 in my case) in my configuration, so I guess I will have to find a way to connect both at the same time and then use some command to clone it, before physically removing the old HDD, right? Or can you or somebody else please tell me how to do this configuration part? I am wondering too if I can rather disconnect the second internal HDD "Work" (ID 3) in my case, to do the cloning first. Then when and how I change the ID's?

Thank you.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2016, 01:49:50 AM by WeiXing3D »
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline Matt_H

Unfortunately I don't have good advice on specific screws to use. The ones mounted to my 3000's old hard drive (not sure if they are original since the machine is second-hand) are too wide for the adapter. In situations like these I usually just grab a few different kinds from the hardware store - they're cheap enough that I'm willing to sacrifice a few cents on some superfluous ones (can't remember exactly what I bought in this case). Also: while the original drive used 4 mounting holes, the adapter only needs 2.

I ended up backing up the whole drive to another Amiga, prepping and copying to the adapter/SD card using that same other Amiga, and then just plugging it into the 3000. But you've got the right idea:
- disconnect your secondary drive,
- plug in the adapter,
- prep that new SD drive (make sure to set the "bootable" flag on the boot partition!),
- copy everything to the new SD drive,
- then replace your boot drive with the adapter and reconnect your secondary drive.

Before/during this process you'll want to make sure the SCSI ID of the adapter is set to not conflict with either of your existing drives - that's what the USB port (and associated configuration utility) is for. (see here)

I do wish these adapters had jumpers to set the SCSI ID - having to connect to another system to change the ID is a bit frustrating.

Now, if you want to get really fancy, these adapters actually allow you to emulate multiple SCSI devices. For instance: you've got a 16GB SD card and don't want to deal with all of the >4GB issues on a default OS2.x or 3.x system. The config utility can have the adapter present that one 16GB card as four 4GB devices using four different SCSI IDs (say, 0-3). You can also "hide" data beyond a certain point, i.e., presenting one 16GB card as one 4GB card.

If you want to get rid of your secondary hard drive, you could either copy/move its contents to another partition that you create on the SD card with HDToolbox, or you could copy/move its contents to another virtual device that you create with the USB config utility.
 

Offline WeiXing3D

@Matt_H
You are right when you say this: "I do wish these adapters had jumpers to set the SCSI ID - having to connect to another system to change the ID is a bit frustrating."

In this case, I will have to prep the adapter in a PC, connect and leave loosen the adapter with the card inside the A3000, clone HDDs, remove adapter again, put Work HDD back in place, transfer info from existing Work HDD to new Work partition in SD card, remove both physical HDDs, put adapter back in place where the old bootable HDD was and fasten adapter to plate somehow. All this for something that in an A1200, is walk in the park using an IDE card.
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline Motormouth

Also be careful about allowing the SCSI2SD adapter to touch metal brackets.  Some of them have metal line and components that are exposed and can short damaging them.  I suggest using washers to keep all but the mounting hole from touching metal of the A3000 HD mounting bracket.
 

Offline lost_loven

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=80655&highlight=scsi2sd

look closer to the bottom of the thread on first page.. I used some mother board mounts and screws with the hard drive bracket.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 01:17:48 AM by lost_loven »
A3000D 2 meg chip, 4 meg fast,128 meg zorram! 16 gig scsi2sd, 3.1 ROM, A3640, Indivision ECS, X-surf-100. Rapid Road usb, Amd scsi chip, Buster11. FTP service now with my Ethernet WD2TB Live Book, haha love it !
hp lappy.

http://www.youtube.com/user/lost666loven?feature=mhum
 

Offline desantii

This is how I attached in an A2000
Amiga 1200/030 50mhz, 64mb ram

Amiga 2000, 030 25mhz, 7mb ram, A2320,  SCSI2CD
 
Amiga 3000/030 25mhz, CF SCSI card

Amiga 4000/ 040 33mhz 274mb ram
 

Offline desantii

One more picture
Amiga 1200/030 50mhz, 64mb ram

Amiga 2000, 030 25mhz, 7mb ram, A2320,  SCSI2CD
 
Amiga 3000/030 25mhz, CF SCSI card

Amiga 4000/ 040 33mhz 274mb ram
 

Offline WeiXing3D

Quote from: lost_loven;805498
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=80655&highlight=scsi2sd

look closer to the bottom of the thread on first page.. I used some mother board mounts and screws with the hard drive bracket.

I read the whole thread in EAB. Awesome.

I'm sharing the same pains you did at the beginning of your project. But now, your writings have helped me a lot.

I still have these questions:

1. I have already updated the firmware of the codec card using the utility, but what else I need to do while connected to my PC, before installing in the 3000?

2. Since I have to internal, physical HDDs inside the 3000, Can I disconnect the one labeled and being used as "Work" to do the partitioning, formating and cloning of my "Workbench" (Quantum 49 MB HDD).

3. I have Workbench 3.9 installed in the machine. Can you please share details of what parameters to use when partitioning a 16 GB card just like yours?

I have never partitioned an actual HDD in a real Amiga before, so if you could please guide me through what I need to do within HDToolBox?

5. Is there any way, and is it recommended, to prepare the SD card, say in WinUAE, so just to connect and clone the HDDs?

NEW ADDITION TO THIS EDIT: I just checked to different original CDs with OS3.9, and I can't see the SFS file system tool, and I am not sure how to check if my installation has it already. If I don't have it in my L: folder, where can I find the tools/files that I will need, and where to install them?


Sorry of this bombardment of questions, but I nee so much help in this my first hardware project. :confused:
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 05:05:45 PM by WeiXing3D »
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline WeiXing3D

Re: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2016, 04:48:05 PM »
Quote from: desantii;805499
This is how I attached in an A2000


@desanti - Thank you for sharing those pictures. Is there a specific size for those risers/screws?
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline matt3k

Re: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2016, 05:37:20 PM »
Anyone try PFS on these yet?
 

Offline WeiXing3D

Re: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2016, 11:04:14 PM »
I don't know if I'm the only one struggling to set up the SCSI2SD micro adapter, but today, I believe that I have made good progress in my quest.

Someone in the Commodore Amiga Group in Amiga directed my attention to this tutorial to use MorphOS, which in my case I use, to prepare an Amiag HDD for use in a real Amiga: http://library.morph.zone/Preparing_an_Amiga_Hard_Drive

I partitioned and formatted a 8GB micro SD, by creating 3 partitions: Workbench 3.9 (i used the label WB39 to avoid conflicts later during the actual installation), "Work," and "Games."

Question: Do I have to change the device numer using the SCSI2SD utility.exe now, or I can do that later from the A3000?

This is my SCSI configuration:
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.
 

Offline lost_loven

Re: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2016, 11:05:35 PM »
Quote from: WeiXing3D;805525
I read the whole thread in EAB. Awesome.

I'm sharing the same pains you did at the beginning of your project. But now, your writings have helped me a lot.

I still have these questions:

1. I have already updated the firmware of the codec card using the utility, but what else I need to do while connected to my PC, before installing in the 3000?

2. Since I have to internal, physical HDDs inside the 3000, Can I disconnect the one labeled and being used as "Work" to do the partitioning, formating and cloning of my "Workbench" (Quantum 49 MB HDD).

*
3. I have Workbench 3.9 installed in the machine. Can you please share details of what parameters to use when partitioning a 16 GB card just like yours?

I have never partitioned an actual HDD in a real Amiga before, so if you could please guide me through what I need to do within HDToolBox?

5. Is there any way, and is it recommended, to prepare the SD card, say in WinUAE, so just to connect and clone the HDDs?

NEW ADDITION TO THIS EDIT: I just checked to different original CDs with OS3.9, and I can't see the SFS file system tool, and I am not sure how to check if my installation has it already. If I don't have it in my L: folder, where can I find the tools/files that I will need, and where to install them?


Sorry of this bombardment of questions, but I nee so much help in this my first hardware project. :confused:

*Welcome, and it was a pain at first with no DOCS!

1. I didn't do much, just connected it and it powered with the usb, updated firmware, set my size under device 1 i set it to scsi id 4. Left it all as one disk size. I think I enabled scsi 2 mode under general also..( Cant remember sorry) I will pull the card out and snap pics of settings if like. My actual Hard drive was scsi id 5 and cdrom was id 6

2. I put the Scsi2sd card at the end of the scsi chain on the internal scsi since it is self terminating.  I do have a External cdrom that is terminated that that other side of the chain. My harddrive that I copied from I booted it and from that and went into HDInstTools 6.9 and clicked on partition drive. From there I set my drive sizes on the 16 gig card into 4 partions. (hd0,dh1,dh2, and dh3) Dont forget Dh0 make bootable.
On the main screen of HDinstTools on file system I use ffs 43.20 which works fine for me.
From there save exit reboot and depending on the how you have your scsi chain set with your drives you may have to enter the early start up and select your old drive to boot off. Once in Workbench I selected my drives and quick format on them all. Dont do regular. it will make a muck of things from what i read. (never tried, always did quick).
from there I loaded Opus (or what ever you like to use DM2 etc) and copied everything over to the drive. This might take longer than doing it on winuae but I like doing things native on the system.  
Once it was all copied I shut down, disconnected the old hard drive and rebooted and worked fine.  Well as fine as it would be when i figured it all out lol.
 
3. I didnt install 3.9 . no use for me as all i do is putz around utils, games etc.

4. see 2

5. see 2.

6. I haven't tried SFS . not really think its worth the hassle or is needed for what i do TBH.  I just use the classic Workbench by bloodwych



hope this helps alittle.

edit here pics of some settings on amiga side ..

[ATTACH]4853[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4854[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4855[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4856[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4857[/ATTACH]
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 11:49:21 PM by lost_loven »
A3000D 2 meg chip, 4 meg fast,128 meg zorram! 16 gig scsi2sd, 3.1 ROM, A3640, Indivision ECS, X-surf-100. Rapid Road usb, Amd scsi chip, Buster11. FTP service now with my Ethernet WD2TB Live Book, haha love it !
hp lappy.

http://www.youtube.com/user/lost666loven?feature=mhum
 

Offline WeiXing3D

Re: Help with installation of Amigakit's SCSI2SD micro SD adapter in A3000
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2016, 02:04:48 AM »
Quote from: lost_loven;805544
*Welcome, and it was a pain at first with no DOCS!

1. I didn't do much, just connected it and it powered with the usb, updated firmware, set my size under device 1 i set it to scsi id 4. Left it all as one disk size. I think I enabled scsi 2 mode under general also..( Cant remember sorry) I will pull the card out and snap pics of settings if like. My actual Hard drive was scsi id 5 and cdrom was id 6

2. I put the Scsi2sd card at the end of the scsi chain on the internal scsi since it is self terminating.  I do have a External cdrom that is terminated that that other side of the chain. My harddrive that I copied from I booted it and from that and went into HDInstTools 6.9 and clicked on partition drive. From there I set my drive sizes on the 16 gig card into 4 partions. (hd0,dh1,dh2, and dh3) Dont forget Dh0 make bootable.
On the main screen of HDinstTools on file system I use ffs 43.20 which works fine for me.
From there save exit reboot and depending on the how you have your scsi chain set with your drives you may have to enter the early start up and select your old drive to boot off. Once in Workbench I selected my drives and quick format on them all. Dont do regular. it will make a muck of things from what i read. (never tried, always did quick).
from there I loaded Opus (or what ever you like to use DM2 etc) and copied everything over to the drive. This might take longer than doing it on winuae but I like doing things native on the system.  
Once it was all copied I shut down, disconnected the old hard drive and rebooted and worked fine.  Well as fine as it would be when i figured it all out lol.
 
3. I didnt install 3.9 . no use for me as all i do is putz around utils, games etc.

4. see 2

5. see 2.

6. I haven't tried SFS . not really think its worth the hassle or is needed for what i do TBH.  I just use the classic Workbench by bloodwych



hope this helps alittle.

edit here pics of some settings on amiga side ..

[ATTACH]4853[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4854[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4855[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4856[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]4857[/ATTACH]


Thanks a lot. I am now getting a more clearer picture and gaining confidence.

Can I still use a 16 GB card using FFS as the file system?
Amiga 1200 fully loaded by Aclii.
AmigaONE X5000 with OS4.1 FE
FPGA Arcade board in miniITX case with AmigaOS3.9 and WB 3.1.
MorphOS 3.9 in Mac Mini G4 1.5GHz, PowerBook & Power Mac G5
Acer Aspire One with AROS Icaros Desktop 2.1.1 &
MiST FPGA Minimig Amiga AGA Workbench 3.9 PFS3 configuration.