Hyperion bankrupt?

[Niding]

Im sure "true" can be changed for "familiar OS based on nostalgica"

Just like me, I stick to AOS 3.x on my A1200 for no other reason its the OS I used in the 90s.
I have no rational reason for not switching to AROS, its just lazyness and nostalgica Id say (on my own part).

[wawrzon]

And what is the amiga marked today. ?

depends how you twist he meaning of "amiga". still if you allow amigaone hardware then you must allow aros and morphos as well along the fpga projects, which btw, do not claim the name.

I believe in the users and I dont think this computer will ever die.

im with you on that.

[Heiroglyph]

So, finally, what is Amiga and what isn't? It is the same freaking oldtimer it was 20 years ago. That stuff can be modernized, slightly, for the joy of it. That is, actually, a small niche market in the same sense rebuilding old cars is a small niche market. Trying to change this definition means just ignoring the situation.

I feel the same way, it's a hobby and there is a little money to be made in the market, but don't expect to get rich from it or take over the world.

I've never understood why the push to develop exclusively on PPC when there are still users clamoring for 68k upgrades and bug fixes.

I understand that there's a market for a next gen Amiga. I get that. But why kill off the existing market? Why double-down on yet another failing CPU after the writing was on the wall (over 10 years ago)?

I'd pay for an updated 680x0 OS, yet that's not an option. They had an existing customer base, but ignored it in favor of moving them out of "old classic cars" and into cars designed for use ten years ago instead.

The business model makes no sense in that context, does it?

There has been a market here all along, but it's not the market they want, so they left the money on the table.

[guest11527]

And why is that. ?

Because if Amiga had adapted to its market, it would have been something different already 20 years ago from what you know now from a 20 year old Amiga.

Amiga have had one problem from day one, and that is incompetent people running the company. The technical people was more like wizards but those who was to sell it, directors/ceo, etc was complete idiots. All they wanted was fast pay back and when that did not happen they did bled the company dry until it was dead.

I don't think it is quite that simple. CBM was becoming big with a simple concept: Sell technology as cheap as possible. What finally broke their neck is that competing technology became available for much better prices (the PC) and they have not had the money - due to their strategy - to invest it into the product. That is, CBM made the failure not to adapt to the changing conditions in the computer market, and they tried to continue with a concept that no longer worked. At a certain time, the chances for custom hardware were simply over, and IBM (back then) could sell "professional" machines just by their brand name. CBM never established a professional brand.

Ironically, I see the same here today again: The market is migrating away from desktop PCs, to wearables and smartphones, and still some folks believe the Os experience alone is good enough to sell non-compatible hardware. Amiga is a vintage market, not a frontier market as it used to be. That's a completely different situation.

Now 28 years after cbm closed the doors there is amazingly still users who still are using this computer in fact maybe the best computer ever made on zero budget.

"Using" and "using" are two completely different things here. 20 years ago, people "used" the Amiga to solve their problems, i.e. gaming, a bit of programming, a bit of word processing, a hobby product for everyone. "Using" nowadays is rather a vintage experience of its own. If I want to play a recent game, I get a game console or a PC. If I want to play a *vintage game*, I get an Amiga. That's an important difference.

And what is the amiga marked today. ?
It is two parts. The first is a company who makes linux/clones with a amiga layer and they call it amigaone. And these are so expensive and so faraway from what amiga was.

Yes, but what's the use case and which needs does this machine address? It is not computing power (it is slow compared to a PC), it is not game or software experience (as there is almost no original software), it is not vintage (it is relatively new, with a new Os) so what is it? I don't get it, seriously.

Part two: Take any other computer and tell me what other users starts to make a clone (fpga) and operating system. So this is the future for amiga platform since there is no vision for those who holds the rights. SO our only future is you and me the users to pick up what commodore did'nt want or could do.

I believe in the users and I dont think this computer will ever die.

The problem with "users" is that it is a heterogeneous group, a group that will not define (by itself) a common direction or strategy for a product, like a company could. Besides, the users have no "assets" in the sense that there is a common pool for software, hardware or knowledge. It is fragmented.

There are companies out there that could, and that define strategies or visions. However, strategies or visions I fail to understand.

[wawrzon]

Im sure "true" can be changed for "familiar OS based on nostalgica"

Just like me, I stick to AOS 3.x on my A1200 for no other reason its the OS I used in the 90s.
I have no rational reason for not switching to AROS, its just lazyness and nostalgica Id say (on my own part).

well, i must give you that, you actually have a reason not to switch to aros on amiga hardware currently as it is still less responsible than the genuine os. and it lacks some soft and hardware support. therefore i run hd-rec still under 3.9. aros is though potentially a good and compatible os replacement/improvement and one that reacts to users most, closest to crowd funding initiative, so if the user base actually builds up some tension, it may have some effect it wouldnt have elsewhere.

[Boot_WB]

None of the above. It is kind of silly trying to revive a ~20 year old system by trying to implement a lookalike on a similarly dead hardware platform. Take AmigaOs as it is: An operating system oldtimer that requires - like an old car - quite a bit of maintenance to keep it running, and that is fun to ride with on weekends just for the matter of itself. Everything else is, IMHO, just ignoring the facts.

Heh, should have added 'other' at least.

 I find it "fascinating" that some parties consider this platform economically viable beyond that and consider the old 68K hardware a competitor, but maybe that's only me.

Not sure anyone 'competes' with 68k (aka The Amiga), people use what they use, not much market to compete in beyond that i suspect. As you say, you can make a nice living restoring classic cars, but it's a similarly small market that is limited by demand.

[Djole]

I'd pay for an updated 680x0 OS, yet that's not an option. They had an existing customer base, but ignored it in favor of moving them out of "old classic cars" and into cars designed for use ten years ago instead.

The business model makes no sense in that context, does it?

There has been a market here all along, but it's not the market they want, so they left the money on the table.

I would also pay for an "official" update of 68k OS3.9. It has the largest user base and could be made very usable on fast FPGA accelerators that are around the corner.

[wawrzon]

I would also pay for an "official" update of 68k OS3.9. It has the largest user base and could be made very usable on fast FPGA accelerators that are around the corner.

pay whom and for what is the question.

[Djole]

pay whom and for what is the question.

I wouldn't care much who made it, whoever has the rights to do so. There is much room for improvement in 68k OS3.9. OS 3.9 (and 3.5) was made after Commodore and most of users consider them as official update for AmigaOS do why not make 3.9.1.

[Heiroglyph]

I wouldn't care much who made it, whoever has the rights to do so. There is much room for improvement in 68k OS3.9. OS 3.9 (and 3.5) was made after Commodore and most of users consider them as official update for AmigaOS do why not make 3.9.1.

How about a ROM that can find a CDRom to boot so I can ditch my slowly decaying boot floppies?

An OS that has Thors updates to layers?
All those improvements that are in OS4 only that just need to be compiled for 68k?
Picasso96 officially built in with the improvements in OS4?

There are a ton of things that could be done without a huge investment if someone had the rights to do so.

[wawrzon]

I wouldn't care much who made it,

i would, because of track of record, expected support, that kind of things, also the circumstances should be fair. so far yu have your unofficial boing bags you can enjoy. i think ist as far as it gets within limits, im not sure what else to demand, than that the community takes their issues in their own hands, like that:

most of users consider them as official update for AmigaOS do why not make 3.9.1.

so, its there, just in form of patches and not as official as few would like. consider this an obstacle thrown in your way. whose fault is this?

[wawrzon]

How about a ROM that can find a CDRom to boot so I can ditch my slowly decaying boot floppies?

An OS that has Thors updates to layers?
All those improvements that are in OS4 only that just need to be compiled for 68k?
Picasso96 officially built in with the improvements in OS4?

There are a ton of things that could be done without a huge investment if someone had the rights to do so.

aros kick can boot from had or cd. otherwise i would be grateful to have this all improvements without being forced to use reimplemented wheel. we can complain in the open, but what does that change?

[Heiroglyph]

so, its there, just in form of patches and not as official as few would like. consider this an obstacle thrown in your way. whose fault is this?

My original point was that there were avenues to making a little money that have been written off.

It just seems incomprehensible that 68k users were only seen as a pool of users to court as opposed to addressing their needs.

It's like making them come to you vs. going to them.

[wawrzon]

My original point was that there were avenues to making a little money that have been written off.

It just seems incomprehensible that 68k users were only seen as a pool of users to court as opposed to addressing their needs.

It's like making them come to you vs. going to them.

to be blunt, the amiga users were seen as a pool to recruit os4 users or get lost.

[OlafS3]

How about a ROM that can find a CDRom to boot so I can ditch my slowly decaying boot floppies?

An OS that has Thors updates to layers?
All those improvements that are in OS4 only that just need to be compiled for 68k?
Picasso96 officially built in with the improvements in OS4?

There are a ton of things that could be done without a huge investment if someone had the rights to do so.

I read a discussion where someone asked one of the Friedens to compile Warp3D for 68k. The answer was: "I could but I do not. Buy AmigaOS then you have it". That is the attitude. They see the 68k community as a ressource for potential buyers of their expensive hardware/OS packs. If you want a 68k OS that can replace Amiga OS in future then support AROS.

[amigakit]

@Olafs3

A-EON owns Warp3D now.  I know upgrading it for 68k would be something of interest. All of A-EON's new software technologies developed will be back ported to AmigaOS 3 if the hardware can support it.