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AuthorTopic: New iMac  (Read 652 times)

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Offline danwood

Re: New iMac
« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2014, 11:19:08 AM »
Quote from: Everblue;776154
Hmmm Classic stuff yes, but I have seen used Sam440s/460s sell for really low prices.


Yeah, I've seen A1XEs listed for around £250 recently and they've not sold even.  

Agree on Commodore gear though, that is going up in value every year.
 

Offline danwood

Re: New iMac
« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2014, 11:24:10 AM »
Quote from: Duce;776156
Guess I missed the value train last time I price checked my SAM 440ep complete machine.  Paid a grand for the mobo/ram and OS 4.1 back in 2008 and earlier this year the best offer I got on it was 200 euros if I was willing to cover shipping to England for the whole machine, including case, PSU, and the 2 SSD's and 1 SATA DVD-RW that are in it.

I resigned myself into simply using it as a doorstop a few years down the road versus taking such a financial beating on what still is a a pretty fun little machine.  Couldn't even find anyone to trade me a decent "legacy" Amiga like an A3000 or A4000 for it :/

I imagine the X1's hold their value far better, but I've seen the SAM boards at basically giveaway prices compared to what people paid for them new.

Same with my A1XE, I paid over £700 for it new, £110 for OS 4.1 and the case alone was £250.  But I've seen A1XEs listed at £200-300 and not sell so I may as well just keep it for that price I guess.

An A3000/4000 is worth a lot more than a 440 though, A4000 average price seems to be around £400-600 for a stock system, and they always sell.
 

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2014, 11:41:28 AM »
But that is because of what I said above...rarity = price increase.
There are only two "competing" Operating Systems for desktop use really: OSX and Windows so why are we comparing Amigas to Apple?

The reason why classic Amigas sell for more it's because of the nostalgia factor. When Commodore was big it had millions of Amiga 4000, 1200, 500 etc... users. People who buy them nowadays are people who know what they are and actively search for them.

Who is going to look for an A1XE or even a SAM? Only the die-hard user who knows what it is.
Also the older the hardware the more appealing it becomes.

Surely you didn't buy a SAM+OS4 as a short term investment did you? :)

People only know about PC (Windows) and Apple, that is it. The general consumer that is.
And of the two (thanks to its clever marketing/hype/advertising/design and I'll chuck in the OS as well) the iMacs retain more value but that is not to say it's down to the incredible hardware...you can get 5K displays for PCs, I even saw AmigaOS 4 running on a 4K monitor, it looked beautiful... :)
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 11:47:31 AM by TheDaddy »
 

Offline Wilse

Re: New iMac
« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2014, 11:50:25 AM »
Quote from: TheDaddy;776232
I don't understand how people can't grasp the idea that you can get better results with a PC by paying less money, a lot less.


Can you post a link to where I can get a comparable PC, including this lovely display, for "less money, a lot less"?

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #34 on: October 31, 2014, 12:23:07 PM »
No links to give you but if you're into building PCs yourself you can do it for the same, less or slightly more but with added advantages like a more powerful graphics card, this all depends on where you shop obviously.

First don't forget that Apple put huge orders in. For example millions of 27" 5k from Samsung (I think it's Samsung that makes the screens for Apple) so they can afford to "give it away" for less when you compare it to a PC builder who has to buy parts from a shop.

But let's say you wanted the Dell 5K 27" Ultrasharp screen which on its own gives the advantage of being a separate screen (not inside the machine) this is, for me, a big plus. This is about £1500. £600 for a motherboard, 8GB DDR3, i5 3.5GHz and an ATI 290x 4GB DDR5 NOT the cut down M version Apple offer on their site with 2GB, 1TB hybrid drive. £2100. This gives you the advantage of upgrading whenever you want, on the iMac you can JUST upgrade the memory yourself anything else and it's a trip to Apple. :)
 

Offline Wilse

Re: New iMac
« Reply #35 on: October 31, 2014, 02:09:16 PM »
Quote from: TheDaddy;776255
No links to give you but if you're into building PCs yourself ...


Which immediately makes this apples v oranges.

Quote
First don't forget that Apple put huge orders in...


Irrelevant to the question and even more irrelevant to your original claim.


Quote
But let's say you wanted the Dell 5K 27" Ultrasharp screen which on its own gives the advantage of being a separate screen (not inside the machine) this is, for me, a big plus. This is about £1500.


And as far as I can tell, still unavailable for purchase.

I've yet to see a comparable system for much less than the price of a new iMac (starts at £1999) but am happy to be corrected.

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #36 on: October 31, 2014, 02:56:41 PM »
>>Which immediately makes this apples v oranges.

No, Apple vs Amiga = apples vs oranges.

I never said a thing about PC manufacturers, I was talking about people who build PCs themselves and if you have that kind of cash you can spec a better PC yourself.
All I am saying is that if I were a PC manufacturer I wouldn't offer those specs as they know that PC gamers would expect to run games at 5k but those specs will not even do 4k at a decent frame rate. That is probably why no PC manufacturer is offering it. Yes if you want to look at pretty pictures, want to have a massive desktop, do DTP, surf the web, fine. But Windows users play games.

Also I like to know that if I want to put a dual (SLI) Titan or future (next 3-6 months) gen card, change the hard drive myself, install 64GB...I can... :)

The Dell 5K 27" Ultrasharp screen is going to be, other manufacturers will follow so not a huge problem. I can wait and feel no need to jump in to get an iMac... ;)
 

Offline Wilse

Re: New iMac
« Reply #37 on: October 31, 2014, 05:00:04 PM »
Quote from: TheDaddy;776274
I was talking about people who build PCs themselves and if you have that kind of cash you can spec a better PC yourself.

Point me to one with equivalent specs for a lot less money then.

One that I can buy now (so the monitor you previously mentioned won't cut it).

-EDIT-
As I already said, I've yet to see a comparable system for much less than the price of a new iMac (starts at £1999) but if you can spec one, I am happy to be corrected.

Otherwise your point is bogus.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 05:04:54 PM by Wilse »
 

Offline Duce

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Re: New iMac
« Reply #38 on: October 31, 2014, 06:21:31 PM »
You aren't going to build a comparable PC to the new iMac for the money.  No way, no how.  Not to mention there's some special interconnect logic in the new iMac's that let it perform far better than comparable off the shelf hardware.  You'd have a rough time driving even a 4K monitor on a Windows PC with an off the shelf 700 series (700m series comes in the new iMac).  I know this because I have tried, lol - which is why I went with Titan cards.

My 4K monitor alone was $700 list price.  A single 780 Ti is another $500-$600, and you'd want 2 of them on a PC to optimally run *even 4K*.  

PSU to run that?  Couple hundred bucks.  Mobo the same.  CPU, $200-$300 minimally.  A nice case to fit 2 full slot, off the shelf graphics cards in?  $150 at least.

The Dell UltraSharp 27 Ultra HD 5K Monitor lists for $2500 alone...  I'd expect it to be $2000 minimally on a good day once the thing is actually released.

"Look for the Dell UltraSharp 27 Ultra HD 5K Monitor to appear on store shelves during fourth quarter with a sticker price of (brace yourself) $2,500."

Source:  http://www.pcworld.com/article/2602870/dells-27-inch-5k-monitor-packs-almost-twice-the-pixels-of-4k-displays.html
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 06:34:16 PM by Duce »
 

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #39 on: October 31, 2014, 06:34:28 PM »
As I said, I could build you a better specced PC for £2100.

Read my post above, I am talking about PC builders not manufacturers. You can buy the iMac I won't as it can't run games at 5k resolution properly.
 

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #40 on: October 31, 2014, 06:40:06 PM »
@Duce

The iMac has an M290x inside. Can you upgrade it?
I can build you a similar specced machine with the full 290x 4GB for £2100. That is GBP not US dollars by the way...
 

Offline Duce

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Re: New iMac
« Reply #41 on: October 31, 2014, 07:00:29 PM »
With what 5k monitor for that price?

Not the Dell.  And a Windows PC would struggle to run 4k on one 290, let alone a 5K display.  I've tried doing it with 4k, hands on.  The results suck, and whatever Apple is doing with the interconnect to drive the 5K monitor, it works well.
 

Offline TheDaddy

Re: New iMac
« Reply #42 on: October 31, 2014, 07:16:17 PM »
Post #20 of this thread.

I give up...enjoy the new iMac... ;)
 

Offline Duce

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Re: New iMac
« Reply #43 on: October 31, 2014, 07:19:19 PM »
In other words, the $1000 5K monitor you had in mind doesn't exist :)

If you know of a reasonably priced one, please share - I'd love to have one, but I'm not paying $2500 for the Dell one when it hits the shelves.

I won't be buying an iMac.  I'm a PC guy waiting on components that are backordered for my new build.

The below is my build sheet, which I'd consider fairly decent for driving 4K.  $1300 more expensive than the base 27" iMac, without a monitor, but admittedly far beefier hardware.

http://i58.tinypic.com/33vyucy.jpg
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 07:26:36 PM by Duce »
 

Offline jj

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Re: New iMac
« Reply #44 on: October 31, 2014, 07:35:27 PM »
Wow can of worms. I use both PCs and macs. For audio windows does not come close. That goes for android too. But anyway was just impressed with the screen.  Would be great for audio too all that real estate
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