What is the real power of Akiko chip in cd32 ?

[skolman]

c2p Gloom 1x1 256 colors

68020/14 - 61.6 ms
68020/14+fast - 54.6 ms
68020/14+akiko - 24.2 ms
68030/50+fast - 21.7 ms
68040/25+fast - 18.6 ms
68020/14+fast+akiko - 17.6 ms
68060/50+fast - 9.1 ms



My result:

A1200 BlizzardPPC + 68060/60+fast - 8.5 ms
A1200 BlizzardPPC + 68060/66+fast - 8 ms

Question, what will be the result on SX32Pro 68030/50+fast+akiko?

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

Question, what will be the result on SX32Pro 68030/50+fast+akiko?

LOL.  I think we've found @fondpondforever's new BFF.  :lol:

[kolla]

c2p Gloom 1x1 256 colors
...
Question, what will be the result on SX32Pro 68030/50+fast+akiko?

I could try that, but I am just too lazy.

[paul1981]

c2p Gloom 1x1 256 colors

68020/14 - 61.6 ms
68020/14+fast - 54.6 ms
68020/14+akiko - 24.2 ms
68030/50+fast - 21.7 ms
68040/25+fast - 18.6 ms
68020/14+fast+akiko - 17.6 ms
68060/50+fast - 9.1 ms



My result:

A1200 BlizzardPPC + 68060/60+fast - 8.5 ms
A1200 BlizzardPPC + 68060/66+fast - 8 ms

Question, what will be the result on SX32Pro 68030/50+fast+akiko?

Impressive results there for Akiko. Is there a list of games which use this chip? Maybe a short list? Anyone?

[BozzerBigD]

Ultimate Gloom is the only one of note that actually makes a good game better:

http://www.amigacd32.com/games/gamepage.php?ID=1168&submitButtonName=Submit

Description: Another update to Gloom. In fact, this is also known  as Gloom 3, as there was a Gloom Deluxe that is sort of the second  game. This version features more levels and various other improvements.  One of the few games that takes advantage of the CD32's Akiko chip to do  chunky to planar graphics conversion. This should be compatible with  any ECS or AGA Amiga, but requires at least a 68020 (it also claims to  need 4MB of RAM, but the CD32 doesn't have that much and it works  anyways, so...)

As already stated Wing Commander has the C2P Aikiko routine but an error was made in the programming so it is buggy and not up to speed. Since it was bundled in the Dangerous Streets pack that one was very important to get right and Nick Pelling screwed it up. It's awesome using WHDLoad on an accelerated AGA Amiga though.

Also:
Microcosm
Nick Faldo CD32

[BozzerBigD]

Ultimate Gloom is the only one of note that actually makes a good game better:

http://www.amigacd32.com/games/gamepage.php?ID=1168&submitButtonName=Submit

Description: Another update to Gloom. In fact, this is also known  as Gloom 3, as there was a Gloom Deluxe that is sort of the second  game. This version features more levels and various other improvements.  One of the few games that takes advantage of the CD32's Akiko chip to do  chunky to planar graphics conversion. This should be compatible with  any ECS or AGA Amiga, but requires at least a 68020 (it also claims to  need 4MB of RAM, but the CD32 doesn't have that much and it works  anyways, so...)

As already stated Wing Commander has the C2P Aikiko routine but an error was made in the programming so it is buggy and not up to speed. Since it was bundled in the Dangerous Streets pack that one was very important to get right and Nick Pelling screwed it up. It's awesome using WHDLoad on an accelerated AGA Amiga though.

Also:
Microcosm
Nick Faldo CD32

Microcosm quote from http://www.verycomputer.com/2_20dd6dd9ef039920_1.htm:
The intro for Microcosm used the chunky to planar conversion if I remember
 rightly. You got 2 versions of the intro - the CDXL style one (quarter
 screen with speech) or the chunky looking one (using Akiko) which was full
 screen but with no speech.  As far as I can remember there was never a
 game that used the Akiko chip.  
 (Now somebody's going to prove me wrong...)

[rockape]

Hi,

Yet the CD32 can play the intro video to "Microcosm" using the Akiko.


Regards, Michael

aka rockape

[stefcep2]

Those time tests tend to be better than what i'd expect from the previous discussion.  With fast ram as quick as an '040.  If that translates to real world use, akiko was a missed opportunity when the 3d graphics craze took off on the PC.

[Kremlar]

Everyone then tried to fix the aging architecture with fast ram and accelerators, that wasn't ever the Amiga way.

Yes.

[steveuk]

The Mighty power of the Akiko?
Is this for real?
A stock cd32 (2mb chip+akiko) is nearly on par performance with an 030 50mhz with fast ram??
Am reading this wrong! It seems extremely impressive?

68020/14+akiko - 24.2 ms
68030/50+fast - 21.7 ms

If this is the case, and knowing the Doom runs ok on a 030/50...
If Commodore was doing well with CD32 and be financially sound back in 1994 makes me wonder... Could of Doom be ported to CD32 when the Jaguar/32X and 3DO games were being made...
By the looks of that, even the 2mb chip CD32 stock system could of had Doom.
Could we even of had a decent CD32 version of Streetfighter 2?

68040/25+fast - 18.6 ms
68020/14+fast+akiko - 17.6 ms

Although after reading this i am concerned i have read this wrong as 68020/14+fast+akiko could no way compete with 68040/25? Forgive me if i have got this wrong.

Played Gloom Deluxe tonight on stock CD32. Pixel width 1 / Pixel height 2;
ran well in nearly full screen. Impressive.

[Hattig]

Well what this shows is that on a stock 68020 at 14MHz, too much time is spent in a software C2P routine, so much that the Akiko actually helps massively, despite being a pretty dumb chip AFAIK.

So in essence on the CD32, Akiko was meant to save money on including fast RAM in the system. A small cheap bit of silicon versus more expensive memory.

I don't even think Akiko can do DMA C2P on a range of memory. I think you have to write the chunky data into 32 32-bit registers on the system, and then read the resulting planar data back from it. I.e., it's probably a dual-ported SRAM with different bit access modes for write and read.

It's just that in code, that particular C2P operation takes too much time on a 68020. A 68060 can effectively do it transparently at memcpy speed (but hey, 68060!).

So a chunky game on CD32:

1. Render game in chunky in RAM.
2. Cycle over rendered chunky scene (might be a tile/column/row rather than full screen) in memory
2a. Write chunky memory into Akiko
2b. Read planar memory from Akiko (saves a lot of bit fiddling/shifting/rotating)
2c. Write to planar display memory (backbuffer)
3. Until scene finished. Switch backbuffer to front. Start again.

Note that DMA would have automated all of 2a,2b,2c. Maybe Akiko did have that?

Interested to see that it would mean a difference from around 12fps Gloom to around 40fps. A major difference.

[Hattig]

Well what this shows is that on a stock 68020 at 14MHz, too much time is spent in a software C2P routine, so much that the Akiko actually helps massively, despite being a pretty dumb chip AFAIK.

So in essence on the CD32, Akiko was meant to save money on including fast RAM in the system. A small cheap bit of silicon versus more expensive memory.

I don't even think Akiko can do DMA C2P on a range of memory. I think you have to write the chunky data into 32 32-bit registers on the system, and then read the resulting planar data back from it. I.e., it's probably a dual-ported SRAM with different bit access modes for write and read.

It's just that in code, that particular C2P operation takes too much time on a 68020. A 68060 can effectively do it transparently at memcpy speed (but hey, 68060!).

So a chunky game on CD32:

1. Render game in chunky in RAM.
2. Cycle over rendered chunky scene (might be a tile/column/row rather than full screen) in memory
2a. Write chunky memory into Akiko
2b. Read planar memory from Akiko (saves a lot of bit fiddling/shifting/rotating)
2c. Write to planar display memory (backbuffer)
3. Until scene finished. Switch backbuffer to front. Start again.

Note that DMA would have automated all of 2a,2b,2c. Maybe Akiko did have that?

Interested to see that it would mean a difference from around 12fps Gloom to around 40fps. A major difference.

[stefcep2]

@ hattig. You can say that again.

[paul1981]

There's a project here for someone... Doom on a stock CD32!

[saimon69]

I would like to see some mode-7 style retro games for CD32, that is what akiko was for i suppose...

[steveuk]

There's a project here for someone... Doom on a stock CD32!

working on it :laugh1: