Do you have military grade chips in your Amiga?

[Argo]

Hey, Guys. How about keeping it on topic?

[jeffimix]

Woah dude this link toook me way too freaking long to find.

Martian Rays

I'd recommend these for you power plugs.

[DonnyEMU]

The pictures you are showing me are frauds. I still own an original A1000 with a 1985 manufacturing date..This isn't millitary spec chips, these pictures you are showing me aren't even  what the real chips look like, they are advertising fakery. I have a stack of old Amiga Worlds with that same ad. As a dealer/repair center from 85-92 I saw a lot of these machines.

For further proof: anyone care to  count the number of pins on Agnes,Denise, and Paula then count the number of pins on those chips in the AD and get back to me. It sure makes a cool looking ad though.. The plate over the chips in this ad is a simple 79 cent glue on from MOS.. I have seen the innards of plenty A1000s to know what I am looking at. Next someone is gonna tell me the 86 pin cpu bus is actually the ZORRO I expansion connector (which it's not).

You guys are scarey this post is starting to sound like something out of the X-Files. Geese guys..
-Don

[DonnyEMU]

Ceramic housing is the way most chips were made at one time, especially the kind you could by outright as chips. I have an 030/882 like that in storage myself.

[DoomMaster]

To DonnyEMU:

You are wrong!  I happen to have those military grade custom ICs in one of my Amiga 2000HDs.  I even have a military grade 68010 processor in all 3 of my Amiga 2000HD computers.  In my first Amiga 1000 computer, ALL 3 of the Amiga custom chips, both of the 8520s and the 68000 microprocessor were all military spec.  They looked just like what was pictured in those old Amiga ads.     :-D

[iamaboringperson]

@"DoomMaster"

They looked just like what was pictured in those old Amiga ads.

You are wrong! Perhaps they do look like the ones in the old Amiga ads, however they are not Mil-Spec. And your definition of Mil-Spec is completly wrong.  :-x

[tony23]

@ DoomMaster,

All I can say is...   ;-)
Here...

http://zapatopi.net/afdb.html


Oh, and if you scroll down the page there's a nice pic of Elizabeth Hurley as well !  :-)

I hope I've been of some help !  ;-)

[Tigger]

DoomMaster wrote:

You are wrong!  I happen to have those military grade custom ICs in one of my Amiga 2000HDs.  I even have a military grade 68010 processor in all 3 of my Amiga 2000HD computers.  In my first Amiga 1000 computer, ALL 3 of the Amiga custom chips, both of the 8520s and the 68000 microprocessor were all military spec.  They looked just like what was pictured in those old Amiga ads.

Lets be perfectly clear here, there are no mil-spec amiga custom chips.    The parts pictured here are ceramic, gold lead parts, but that in no way makes them mil-spec, which would require 883B (or one of its derivatives classification) and the -55C to +125C mil-temp range that is going to be an issue with Amiga Custom chips.  Also any mil-spec part is going to say it on the chip, by number, classification or alternate part number, I dont see any of that on the examples being shown here.
       -Tig
Or just in this case lets use the day signature to cut down the arguements.
       -Bill Evans
        Senior Avionics Engineer
        Government Division
        SCI Technology, Inc


   

[Jope]

Tigger wrote:
Lets be perfectly clear here, there are no mil-spec amiga custom chips.    The parts pictured here are ceramic, gold lead parts, but that in no way makes them mil-spec, which would require 883B (or one of its derivatives classification) and the -55C to +125C mil-temp range that is going to be an issue with Amiga Custom chips.  Also any mil-spec part is going to say it on the chip, by number, classification or alternate part number, I dont see any of that on the examples being shown here.
   

Exactly.. What Doommaster is saying would mean, that just about every PGA cased Intel processor made before the pentium mmx was military grade.. (the MMX was in a black fiberglass package with the die inside a small metal case on top)

How do I tell? Well they have a purple case with gold legs!

I've even got military grade chips in one of my older C-64s!

Come on, get real. Ceramic packaging was commonly used back in the day. Plastic took over because it's cheaper. It's true that ceramic packaged chips last longer, but that's only because the heat conducts away from the die better.

[danamania]

Come on, get real. Ceramic packaging was commonly used back in the day. Plastic took over because it's cheaper. It's true that ceramic packaged chips last longer, but that's only because the heat conducts away from the die better.

Just as a note on the ceramic packaging, at least that used on 030, 040 and a few 486s I've seen - it's an Alumina Ceramic, made of tiny crystals of Al2O3 - same stuff as sapphire or ruby, and near diamond's hardness. Doing a google search for "alumina ceramic" should turn up a bunch of links advertising how insanely neat it is for electronics, low thermal expansion, low wear, water resistance, biocompatibility. How cool, implanted 040s...

I want to do my entire bathroom in old 040 tiles. How neat would that be...

dana

[iamaboringperson]

I want to do my entire bathroom in old 040 tiles. How neat would that be...

At least you bathroom would be bombproof! ;-)


(I just noticed your post count was 19 - That supprised me, since I thought you had posted more than that)

[iamaboringperson]

I've noticed that more people are commenting on the ceramic packaging than the gold.

Chips can theoretically be mil-spec regardles of the packaging. Chips can also be commercial grade(or auto grade) without the packaging. We all know that.

Now, the gold pins being for mil-spec parts really makes me laugh. These days just about every thing in computers has gold pins. They are not all mil-spec.

[Floid]

DonnyEMU wrote:
The pictures you are showing me are frauds. I still own an original A1000 with a 1985 manufacturing date..This isn't millitary spec chips, these pictures you are showing me aren't even  what the real chips look like, they are advertising fakery. I have a stack of old Amiga Worlds with that same ad. As a dealer/repair center from 85-92 I saw a lot of these machines.

For further proof: anyone care to  count the number of pins on Agnes,Denise, and Paula then count the number of pins on those chips in the AD and get back to me. It sure makes a cool looking ad though.. The plate over the chips in this ad is a simple 79 cent glue on from MOS.. I have seen the innards of plenty A1000s to know what I am looking at.

http://amiga.org/gallery/images/896/1_1183.jpg
Hm, someone must've gone through some trouble, then.  48-pin DIPs in both shots.  Unless I can't count.  And you can see here that they got the 8361 (that also doesn't exist?) into a regular epoxy package.

The 'heatspreaders' are obviously just cheap caps of some sort - I've found some other pictures where they weren't on straight.  But IIRC, with this sort of package, the chip die was otherwise exposed (I dunno why; because they encased the pins in the ceramic before they dropped the chip in and connected the cat-whiskers? -- Were chip packages coming from separate plants than chips themselves? -- Or because the same package would have a use for UV EEPROM, those would need a window there anyway, and it would be cheaper to use caps than design an all-ceramic top with a hollow for the chip?  Or because engineers would enjoy the ability to pop the cap and microscope failure modes on returned units without sanding/etching off the epoxy as they do now?)... So the cap keeps you from, say, jabbing the die with your finger, or getting WD-40 all over it when you decide to clean your board.  (Or was there epoxy under there, anyway?)  Ever dissect one of those old calculators, where the LEDs were exposed dies under a plastic magnifying lens?

One assumes the miracle of 100% plastic/epoxy packaging caught on quickly when it was discovered how much easier it was to just pour goo over everything.  (Of course, bad epoxy still strikes.  All the Fujitsu drive failures of months back were eventually traced to a bad packaging used by Cirrus Logic, to whom they'd outsourced some chips.)

Now why does everyone need to bullshit over something so simple?

[whabang]

All the Fujitsu drive failures of months back were eventually traced to a bad packaging used by Cirrus Logic, to whom they'd outsourced some chips.

By the gods, I remember that! :-o
I was working in a technical support department at the time, I must have replaced thousainds of those!!! :-D

[CU_AMiGA]

Hey DoomMaster! Would you swap one of your professional Amiga 2000HD for my toy Amiga 1200T (see signature). I would love the chance to own a BIG box Amiga! :-) lol

[DoomMaster]

To CU_AMiGA:

No, I would never trade an Amiga 2000HD professional computer for an Amiga 1200.  I actually think that the Amiga 2000HD is a much nicer computer then the Amiga 1200.     :-D