MorphOS 2.0 Released

[Crumb]

The EFIKA runs circles around the best, top of the line Amiga. You want a compact OS like AmigaOS, well its arrived.

Sorry for nitpicking... but a CSPPC with Deneb is both more expensive and faster on IO operations :-) USB2 is much faster and HD is much faster too. gfx operations and number crunching is weaker on classics.

Of course, for the price of such an equipment you could buy a complete Peg2/G4 with MorphOS2.0 that would run rings over both computers :-D

[motorollin]

It all comes down to the hobby factor. For some, building the machine, setting up the OS and tinkering with no real goal in mind is the purpose of the machine itself. For others, their computer is a tool, so a computer with little use would be considered superfluous.

I am somewhere between the two. I know that anything I can do on my A4000 I could do better on my MacBook, either using OS X apps or using UAE. But I like to have the real thing to tinker with from time to time, even though I know it's not cost-effective or time-efficient.

I *had* a PegII, but I realised that I had spent a lot of money on it only to find I did nothing with it that I couldn't already to with my A4000, so I sold it. The EFIKA would be a nice, (relatively) cheap way to tinker with MOS so would fill both needs. Also, I have always wanted to build a custom case with a small motherboard, so I might as well make it an Amiga-like machine :-)

--
moto

[TheMagicM]

@crumb:

Sorry for nitpicking... but a CSPPC with Deneb is both more expensive and faster on IO operations  USB2 is much faster and HD is much faster too. gfx operations and number crunching is weaker on classics.

USB2 is faster on Amiga w/a CSPPC & Deneb. correct.  Overall, if I were to happen to render something..who would get it done quicker..PPC Amiga or EFIKA?  

All I need is my vid card..should have ordered it w/2nd day shipping.

[bloodline]

motorollin wrote:

I *had* a PegII, but I realised that I had spent a lot of money on it only to find I did nothing with it that I couldn't already to with my A4000, so I sold it. The EFIKA would be a nice, (relatively) cheap way to tinker with MOS so would fill both needs. Also, I have always wanted to build a custom case with a small motherboard, so I might as well make it an Amiga-like machine :-)

Ahh, now this I understand... I did much the same... though I bought a 800Mhz VIA Mini-ITX and run AROS on it...

[ffastback]

bloodline wrote:

No, but I am unnecessarily and unintentionally winding people up... No one here is really give good answers (probably because the purchase of such  a system is irrational) it is probably best for me to quieten down.

What part of the term "hobby" do you not understand?  English is presumably your first language yes?  If it is it seems hard to believe you are not just stirring up cr*p for fun (for yourself).   :madashell:

[motorollin]

ffastback wrote:
What part of the term "hobby" do you not understand?  English is presumably your first language yes?  If it is it seems hard to believe you are not just stirring up cr*p for fun (for yourself).   :madashell:

No, he's just trying to understand the appeal and purpose of the machine, which is fair enough. Better that than consider it pointless and keep that opinion to oneself rather than explore it and possibly learn something.

--
moto

[Firedawg]

No, he's just trying to understand the appeal and purpose of the machine, which is fair enough. Better that than consider it pointless and keep that opinion to oneself rather than explore it and possibly learn something.

Well said motorollin, I  believe most of us run our classic systems for the novelty and retro experience.  Now, I said most for I believe that there are few of us that use these systems everyday in their work and play. When we spend our hard earned money we consider the return on the experience for owning these machines.

The Efika for me is a hobby system that I hope will get some   backing with either some future open source or commercial developing (i.e. MosphOS 2.0).  

Man, that MOS2 screen look sweet :-D  

Mike

 

[stefcep2]

ffastback wrote:
@stefcep2


I can see to an extent where you are coming from but no one attacked him for not supporting the MOS developers.  The point was that he was saying it was overpriced next to OSX and he wanted a justification of why.  
 :-)

Ok understood.  MOS a niche product, it will always cost more than mass-produce products like OS X, that make up the money by volume.  It seemed the thread was going down the common argument whenever there is a commercial Amiga release that everyone should support it regardless if its any good or useful, for fear of the developer quitting. MOS sounds like an interesting and fun product, a hobbyist OS and everyone is right to decide if they want to pay the price to play.

I waited and waited for a ppc AmigaOS but kinda had jack of it all when nothing happened for ages.

As things stand now, my next project will be a HTPC using mediaportal, which I don't need but i like the idea of recording and scheduling digital Tv, playing dvd's, and most imprtantly emulating console games such as for PSone, N64,NES,SNES, Genesis and of course Amiga on my 42 inch plasma, using a a remote control, and wireless controllers.  Each to his own.

[ffastback]

motorollin wrote:

No, he's just trying to understand the appeal and purpose of the machine, which is fair enough. Better that than consider it pointless and keep that opinion to oneself rather than explore it and possibly learn something.

--
moto

I'm sorry moto but I must respectfully disagree.  He throws around labels like "apologists" and "zealots" way too easily, which is insulting.    He is unaccepting that any OS can be about a hobby.  Yet ironically he has AROS as a part of his sig and bought a machine to run it.  He demeans the efforts of the creator of Skyos saying it "is nothing".  Yet for all we know that developer maybe simply gets a kick out of the mental exercise involved.  Maybe if he were to calm down on the demeaning labels I could take him more seriously.  But the way he has taken the conversation in my view, it would be the same as if I were to start off a conversation with him by saying, hey bloodline why do you have a $25 haircut with that sprig of hair in front of your face?  The MacOSX haircutting company offers a buzzcut that you won't have to get redone for months and won't ever block your vision for only $5!  Now if he answers "well, first I like it, second the haircutter I use is someone I like supporting they are a local shop and MacOSX haircutting is a big chain, etc, etc, etc.  Now if I want to know more should I a)stay very civil while sincerely seeking to learn more or b) start throwing around labels and take on an air of superiority?  

[ffastback]

stefcep2 wrote:


As things stand now, my next project will be a HTPC using mediaportal, which I don't need but i like the idea of recording and scheduling digital Tv, playing dvd's, and most imprtantly emulating console games such as for PSone, N64,NES,SNES, Genesis and of course Amiga on my 42 inch plasma, using a a remote control, and wireless controllers.  Each to his own.

Sounds cool.  :-)

[motorollin]

@ffastback
Bloodline is an AROS developer, so I think it's reasonable for him to buy a machine on which to run it. All of his questions regarding MOS were from an end-user perspective: "What can I actually *do* with this OS". I think they're reasonable questions.

Any problems you have with the way he presented his argument are not really anything to do with me.

--
moto

[ffastback]

motorollin wrote:
@ffastback
Bloodline is an AROS developer

This just throws me for a further loop.  If thats the case then wanting a justification of comparing value for the consumer dollar of MorphOS vs. Apple OSX as he did seems like an odd comparison for him to want to demand.  And to put an OS like SkyOS down as "nothing" when it runs Firefox but AROS dosen't also seems very odd.  Do I get more for an $100 Efika and $179 MorphOS or more by donating $279 towards an AROS bounty?  Which is the better ROI as a consumer / end-user?

Any problems you have with the way he presented his argument are not really anything to do with me.

Just offered my opinion back in relation to the one you presented to me on the subject.   :-D

[motorollin]

Whatever. I really can't be bothered to argue about this.

[TheMagicM]

ffastback has a valid point.

If bloodline is throwing MOS under the bus yet he's an AROS developer...sounds like a little bit of jealousy methinks.  I agree also w/his point.. spending $279 for MOS+ EFIKA, what will the equivalent get me for AROS?  

Whatever bloodline's points are against MOS, insert AROS into those sentences/questions and see what answers you come up with.

[bloodline]

TheMagicM wrote:
ffastback has a valid point.

Now here I have to object, ffastback does not have a valid point. He has not formed a valid argument.

He is ignoring the point I was trying to make, and simply taking personal objection to my question.

If bloodline is throwing MOS under the bus yet he's an AROS developer...sounds like a little bit of jealousy methinks.

Not at all. MOS has better developed GFX and audio drivers. MOS is prettier than AROS and can run OS legal 68K apps (which AROS would also be able to do on a Big Endian CPU). I also prefer the Two level structure of MOS, with the Quark micro-kernel under the AmigaOS compatible environment on top (much like AROS hosted).

AROS has benefited greatly from a close relationship with MOS.

I agree also w/his point.. spending $279 for MOS+ EFIKA, what will the equivalent get me for AROS?  

Look at it the other way around... How much would you have to spend to get a functionally equivalent (or at least as close as possible) AROS based system?

Whatever bloodline's points are against MOS, insert AROS into those sentences/questions and see what answers you come up with.

Since my only negative criticism of MOS is with respect to the high price (with respect to usefulness), not technical criticisms... I would like to think the answers you come up with would reflect my own.

[bloodline]

ffastback wrote:

motorollin wrote:

No, he's just trying to understand the appeal and purpose of the machine, which is fair enough. Better that than consider it pointless and keep that opinion to oneself rather than explore it and possibly learn something.

--
moto

I'm sorry moto but I must respectfully disagree.  He throws around labels like "apologists" and "zealots" way too easily, which is insulting.    

Do you consider yourself either of these types of people?

He is unaccepting that any OS can be about a hobby.  

Not at all, I run many many Operating Systems... It is to some degree a hobby.

Yet ironically he has AROS as a part of his sig and bought a machine to run it.

Not ironic at all. I bought a very cheap tiny board because I wanted to build a small form factor machine... which I could then use to play with various Operating Systems of my choice... there are plenty of Hobby operating system to download and run on it.

My personal favorite, for various reasons, happens to be AROS.

He demeans the efforts of the creator of Skyos saying it "is nothing".  Yet for all we know that developer maybe simply gets a kick out of the mental exercise involved.  

SkyOS only costs €29, but I wouldn't find it either interesting or useful anymore... I used to play with it when it was free.

Maybe if he were to calm down on the demeaning labels I could take him more seriously.  

Then feel free to use whichever labels you wish.

But the way he has taken the conversation in my view, it would be the same as if I were to start off a conversation with him by saying, hey bloodline why do you have a $25 haircut with that sprig of hair in front of your face?  

Actually, I didn't charge myself anything or the time taken to run the clippers around the back and sides of my head... I'm clearly missing a trick here.

-Edit- The sprig, as cool as it is, was actually my hair falling in front of my face during the image capture... a few milliseconds later the rest of my fringe followed suit.

The MacOSX haircutting company offers a buzzcut that you won't have to get redone for months and won't ever block your vision for only $5!  Now if he answers "well, first I like it, second the haircutter I use is someone I like supporting they are a local shop and MacOSX haircutting is a big chain, etc, etc, etc.  

Not really a good metaphor... but made me laugh.

Now if I want to know more should I a)stay very civil while sincerely seeking to learn more or b) start throwing around labels and take on an air of superiority?  

My obsessive nature will lead me to be horribly pedantic, but I stick by my choice of words. I have tried to express my points clearly and without ambiguity.