New Scandoubler/Flicker Fixer?

[Hodgkinson]

EDIT:
This site seems to have the same thing at $90
http://www.grandtec.com/videomate.htm

[alexh]

Just buy a 15" LCDTV

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Hodgkinson wrote:
EDIT:
This site seems to have the same thing at $90
http://www.grandtec.com/videomate.htm

I got something alike for 40 Euros, from E-Tech

[mintfresh]

alexh wrote:
Just buy a 15" LCDTV

How does the Amiga look on a LCD TV? I was thinking of getting one for the computer room my Amiga is in. I reasoned that since LCDs have to de-interlace an image to display it, that they wouldn't suffer from flicker with interlace modes? Also, a HD TV would be able to display all the standard Amiga Hi-Res resoultions wouldn't it?

What is the best way to connect to one of these TVs?

I'm quite interested in the LCD TV route, so any info would be great.

[skurk]

mintfresh wrote:
How does the Amiga look on a LCD TV? I was thinking of getting one for the computer room my Amiga is in. I reasoned that since LCDs have to de-interlace an image to display it, that they wouldn't suffer from flicker with interlace modes? Also, a HD TV would be able to display all the standard Amiga Hi-Res resoultions wouldn't it?

I'm using the RGB to SCART cable from Amigakit to get my A600 on a 15" LCD TV.  Lo-res and hi-res looks great, almost as on a normal monitor.  Interlaced modes flicker as they did on the 1084.  Maybe other TV's will deinterlace or "deflicker" better than mine.   And, yes, it displays all the modes correctly.

[skurk]

darkage wrote:
What about this

MC1 Amiga Computers Store

Click on New

Scroll down to "Video to VGA adaptor $99"

Some Amiga reseller is selling it, so dunno if it would be good or not?

I think it's like one of these things.  I got one off eBay a while ago, and the quality was like.. uh.. imagine connecting your Amiga to the telly using RF again.  It was OK for gaming, but far from good enough for programming.

[mintfresh]

skurk wrote:

mintfresh wrote:
How does the Amiga look on a LCD TV? I was thinking of getting one for the computer room my Amiga is in. I reasoned that since LCDs have to de-interlace an image to display it, that they wouldn't suffer from flicker with interlace modes? Also, a HD TV would be able to display all the standard Amiga Hi-Res resoultions wouldn't it?

I'm using the RGB to SCART cable from Amigakit to get my A600 on a 15" LCD TV.  Lo-res and hi-res looks great, almost as on a normal monitor.  Interlaced modes flicker as they did on the 1084.  Maybe other TV's will deinterlace or "deflicker" better than mine.   And, yes, it displays all the modes correctly.

Thanks for the advice. Its strange that it still flickers, I thought that since LCD's didn't refresh in the same way as a CRT (i.e. line by line) that interlaced modes had to be de-interlaced first.

I might have to give my Amiga a go on the downstairs TV and see how that looks.

[Damion]

mintfresh wrote:

skurk wrote:

mintfresh wrote:
How does the Amiga look on a LCD TV? I was thinking of getting one for the computer room my Amiga is in. I reasoned that since LCDs have to de-interlace an image to display it, that they wouldn't suffer from flicker with interlace modes? Also, a HD TV would be able to display all the standard Amiga Hi-Res resoultions wouldn't it?

I'm using the RGB to SCART cable from Amigakit to get my A600 on a 15" LCD TV.  Lo-res and hi-res looks great, almost as on a normal monitor.  Interlaced modes flicker as they did on the 1084.  Maybe other TV's will deinterlace or "deflicker" better than mine.   And, yes, it displays all the modes correctly.

Thanks for the advice. Its strange that it still flickers, I thought that since LCD's didn't refresh in the same way as a CRT (i.e. line by line) that interlaced modes had to be de-interlaced first.

I might have to give my Amiga a go on the downstairs TV and see how that looks.

Basically, you won't get any refresh flicker from LCDs, but interlace flicker can still be an issue. Not all LCDs de-interlace, so in theory you'd need one that displays (or "converts") everything in a progressive scan format.

I have no idea how laced modes would look... I suppose it depends on the quality of the LCD. (I figure it can't be much worse than a scandoubler and 50Hz refresh on a CRT, which trashes my eyes in a matter of minutes.) Any kind of de-interlacing will produce some amount of artifacting, though.

[alexh]

Flickering on LCDTV's in Amiga High-Res appears to be a "feature" of the deinterlacer in certain low cost LCDTV chipsets.

It's not refresh related like regular interlace flicker, it looks fine with interlaced video, actually adds a filter like effect, but it looks horrible with the Amiga.

Get your LCDTV from your local supermarket, if you are not happy with the deinterlacer, take it back, get a different model or your money back.

I've heard lots of good stories, and only one or two bad ones.

[potis21]

Yes to LCD. Even if tomorrow you could get a used FF from Ebay you could use the VGA port with it (if the LCD is equipped with one.

And BTW. if you have ECS or AGA you could mode-promote and inject the video to VGA instead of Scart.

I guess you need the extra Hi-rel laced for some serious work, else why bother removing the flicker on modes usually used by games?!?

There is another tip - if you get yourself a VGA splitter, you could feed both RGB and SCART inputs from the RGB analog channel of the amiga, something that is quite convenient, like having a multiscan monitor.

Of yourse, the success story would include a test on the site to see whether the TV can cope with the odd sync rate of 29.92KHz instead of normal 31.25 of VGA 640X480.

Amiga's ECS and AGA have the VGAONLY monitor driver that brings sync even closer to VGA than doublePal.

[bfilipe]

Hodgkinson wrote:
EDIT:
This site seems to have the same thing at $90
http://www.grandtec.com/videomate.htm/

Any S-video (or composite)to Vga adapter like this one has a bloody awful picture quality on a SVGA screen. I have one (not his brand) that I got because it was only 40€ (bought 2nd hand) and also have tried another similar model before this one (this one couldn't even sync properly the amiga image :-?  ).
You will get a much better picture quality by connecting the composite video out of your amiga to a cheap TV. And if it has a scart plug and you use the amiga to scart cable you will be much better.

Either get a true amiga scandoubler or a XRGB2 (quite good from what I've read but they don't do flicker fixing), or get a TV with a scart input (CRT, LCD doesn't matter).

[Hodgkinson]

Just to clarify...
I’m already using DblPAL with VGAOnly on my A1200, on an old colour 15" Dell monitor that happens to work rock-solid with the odd refresh rates (Have had other old monitors that simply don’t work, and others that *occasionally* work with these unusual scan rates).

I've heard a lot about running in dblPAL modes using up precious system processing power, hence the interest in a SD/FF.

Hodgkinson.

[potis21]

All the resources the DBlPAL modes consume are AGA resources, ie making refresh slower (a big pain if you are into Graphics or music editing.)

CPU Processing power (especially on an accelerated a1200) remains almost intact, that's amiga's magic.
(no IRQ to hold back the CPU until refresh and leave you with non-responsive cursor, as seen on XP.... :-D )

by the way, if you are up to the trick with LCD's bear in mind that lcd's are less tolerant to odd refresh rates than CRT's, hence my probing for "try befory buy".

[Hodgkinson]

Ah ha. Thanks for the info.

Hmmm...slow refresh? Im having to run in 4 colurs for the workbench in order to speed up *drawer window* drawering, etc, at the moment. Perhaps this slowness is due to what you said?

Apart from games, fortunatly all my main *propper* utils on the A1200 seem to work OK with the DblPAL screenmode.
Untill I do get hold of a SD/FF, anything that doesn't work under DblPAL is simply displayed on a TV hooked to the A1200 as a backup.

Hodgkinson.

[hamtronix]

If you have an A600 or A1200 just bring it with you and test it out at the store on all the display models...

[Hodgkinson]

Shop assistant:

:crazy: ?? Huh ?? Amiga ?? Huh ?? :crazy: