Motorollin's "Future of the Amiga" thread

[motorollin]

I don't normally involve myself with these discussions because they normally escalate in to flame wars. But after the recent posts about "OS4 should be ported to " which have resulted in discussions of the various Amiga and Amiga-like Operating Systems, I have felt compelled to express my opinion.

The first thing to note is that no matter what we all might like to think, there is no space in the desktop market for AmigaOS, no matter what hardware it runs on. This is because no matter what you tell people you can do with an Amiga, they will respond that they can do it faster, better and cheaper with an alternative platform. I'm not saying that they are necessarily correct, just that this is what they think. For this reason the vast majority of non-Amiga users will not seriously consider Amiga as an alternative OS, even if it runs on their existing hardware. Ergo porting the OS is futile if your intention is to recruit new end-users.

So Amiga software and hardware developers have to look to other markets. The corporate market is saturated with Windows, and it will stay that way. Accept it, deal with it, move on. Sorry but even Linux is not a contender in the corporate market with the possible exception of servers. Even in those environments, practically all workstations sitting on desks in companies are running a Microsoft Operating System.

What does this leave, when you consider that even video editing and music have been taken over by MS workstations? Multimedia Presentations. I strongly believe that the Amiga's software is an advantage here. A small OS which boots quickly, doesn't need to be "shut down" at the end of the day, and is easy to maintain, with MM software like Scala and Hollywood all mean that the Amiga is ideally suited to Multimedia Presentation booths and interactive displays (think Science Museum).

Of course cost is an issue. Nobody is going to spend hundreds on Classic hardware which is old and relatively hard to maintain, just to put it inside a cabinet and display a Hollywood presentation. Likewise nobody will shell out for a Pegasos, EFIKA or AmigaOne for similar reasons. The mass-production of x86 boards means this equipment is affordable, and well-supported. So x86 is the only option if Amiga (or whoever) want to get their OS out there. So there are 3 options:

1. Port MOS/OS4 to x86
2. Use OS3.x under emulation
3. Use AROS

Since 1. is never going to happen, 2. and 3. are the only options. And what's more - they're both available! so here's how I see the future of Amiga:

1. Amiga Inc put together packages of cheap x86 systems running AmigaForever KXLight or AROS, with Hollywood or Scala and touch-screen and TV/VGA support built in.
2. These packages are marketed to manufacturers of multimedia display booths and interactive displays.
3. Amiga get a name for themselves as providers of such equipment, without huge investment costs in developing hardware for OS4 or porting it to x86.
4. Once Amiga is once again a known and respected brand which can be taken seriously, AInc can reconsider their position in the market and possibly reinvest some of the money they have made in a desktop product.

Flame me!!!!! :flame: :lol:

--
moto

[Starrunner]

Motorollin

I think in the clear and concise, what you have said is prolly the best option.  

My cheesy research into alternative's to Windows has turned up all kinds of OS platforms.  They all suffer from the same eventual fate:  Most of the end user class is stuck on x86 and Windows enviroments.  Anything else is alien and foreign to them and they will not touch.  Microsoft has a stranglehold on the end user class.  I was in this frame of mind til I began reading on Vista.  The thought of Linux anything scared me to death.  

So there you go.  Microsoft has effectively won the war of the OSes and platforms to run on.

[philipj]

Good sum up thread but just an FYI:

This:

-- 2. Use OS3.x under emulation --

and this:

-- 1. Amiga Inc put together packages of cheap x86 systems running AmigaForever --

Contradicts this:

-- A small OS which boots quickly, doesn't need to be "shut down" at the end of the day, and is easy to maintain, with MM software like Scala and Hollywood all mean that the Amiga is ideally suited to Multimedia Presentation booths and interactive displays (think Science Museum). --

Not trying to be pedantic or anything.

[motorollin]

When I said "3.x under emulation" and "running AmigaForever" I was referring specifcally to KXLight, which doesn't require Windows to be running. Can you just power off KXLight, or do you have to shut it down?

--
moto

-EDITED

[philipj]

As far as I'm aware Knoppix always needs to go through the shut-down process because it releases the CD properly for you at the end of it all.

Though in theory I don't really see why you couldn't just turn-off a LiveDVD run of an OS, unless it damages the RAM or something. All speculation, I really don't know I'm certainly no technical expert.

[motorollin]

It won't damage the RAM. The only reason to shut down a Linux distro on a read-write filesystem is to make sure the filesystem is unmounted. On a read-only filesystem this doesn't matter.

--
moto

[philipj]

motorollin wrote:
It won't damage the RAM. The only reason to shut down a Linux distro on a read-write filesystem is to make sure the filesystem is unmounted. On a read-only filesystem this doesn't matter.

Thought as much about the RAM.

Hmmz, okay I'm going to say something here I'm not 100% sure about, but the Knoppix run of AmigaOS isn't strictly read-only is it? It can write to certain types of formatted partitions? Doesn't it mount these on startup?

It's been awhile since I loaded up either Knoppix or AmigaForever!

[motorollin]

philipj wrote:
Hmmz, okay I'm going to say something here I'm not 100% sure about, but the Knoppix run of AmigaOS isn't strictly read-only is it?

It boots from a CD, so it is read-only. Therefore powering off without shutting it down will not damage the filesystem. Even if you install it to hard drive, you can still specify that the filesystem should be mounted read-only. Of course this means you can't save anything, but in a kiosk this is not a problem, as the same software will run all the time. If somebody messes with the kiosk, you just reboot it and it will be back how it was before. And at the end of the day you just turn it off. Also, this leaves the potential for ongoing consultancy in building the read-only system if the customer requires changes to the content.

philipj wrote:
It can write to certain types of formatted partitions? Doesn't it mount these on startup?

It can, but this is not not necessary for it to function. If you did mount anything RW, you would have to shut down cleanly.

--
moto

[philipj]

Ah right thanks for clearing that up!

So could this mean Cloanto are the future then? 8-)

[motorollin]

I'm sure buying licenses for AmigaForever would be a cheaper option than porting OS4. Once AInc have made some money selling products based on an emulation, they can invest this money in (a) porting their next-gen OS to x86 so they can continue to supply cheap hardware with their software, or (b) in developing hardware to run OS4 and supply that instead of the x86 system.

--
moto

[TheMagicM]

who the hell is going to buy a x86 machine from Amiga inc just to get it bundled with Amiga Forever?  I certainly will not.  It will probably be overpriced junk, similiar to their previous offers.  I'm not going to contribute my money to a company thats lied and produced vapourware for the previous x years since acquiring the "amiga" name.  

To be honest, I want Amiga Inc to die and go away along with their owners.  They've done nothing to help over the years.  I do admit, I love reading Fleecy/Mcewenen (or whoever the PR/talking head is nowadays) Q/A sessions because it gives me something to laugh at when the deadline isnt met. (just like redrumola's auction of a PR pamphlet showing what goals werent met.)

Friedens, I hope they move on to greener pastures with a good motherboard that way OS4 doesnt die.

-Alex

[motorollin]

TheMagicM wrote:
who the hell is going to buy a x86 machine from Amiga inc just to get it bundled with Amiga Forever?

My point that was that it would be a whole package: hardware, OS (emulated, but still AmigaOS), drivers for touch screen etc, and the presentation software (Scala/Hollywood.....).

--
moto

[TheMagicM]

ic ic...

but the point is.. what would that offer to someone who can just buy Amiga Forever themselves and install it.  Its simple to do.. it wouldnt be worth the extra couple hundred dollars just to buy a PC from AI.

[motorollin]

It's simple if you know how to do it. A bit like building a server. But most companies don't do that do they. They buy the product in from a supplier. See my point now? :-)

--
moto


--EDIT
I should add that this is particularly true of AmigaOS which is not well known. I doubt most people running a kiosk in B&Q would know how to install Workbench, find, download and install Hollywood etc etc.

[TheMagicM]

I meant installing Amiga Forever is simple.  Anyone who knows how to click "Setup" and click on Next Next etc can do it.  If not they'll ask Cloanto or whichever internet forum.

It would be cheaper to buy a Dell PC then order Amiga Forever from Cloanto than it would be to get it as a package from AI.