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Offline VincentTopic starter

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Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« on: June 09, 2006, 04:14:06 PM »
Yes, I'm a sadist :-D

I've just spent 1 hour installing Vista Beta 2 on a second HD on this PC (the HD is on a removable rack).

I'm actually impressed that it's running reasonably well on this AMD Sempron 2600+, 1Gb ram, GeForce FX5200, 30Gb HD.

I thought the GeForce would be the killer, okay it is running slowly because of all the glam, but I'll be turning that off shortly.

Still a bit resource hungry (12 instances of svchost, wtf's up with that?), but all in all it's not too bad.

It's just as fast (slow?) as XP when loading.

It's going to take quite a while to get used to the changes to My Computer though (just called Computer now), the layout is different.

Overall first impressions are good, once I've got used to a few things I might actually be impressed with m$ for the first time in my life :lol:

IE7 and WMP11 are included in the installation.

I'm *really* impressed with IE7.  The changes are quite drastic, and it actually seems to be a little bit faster than Opera 9.x (the last beta release) :-o

I'll still install Opera on here aswell though :-)

WMP11, I've never been impressed with WMP and that still stands today.  It's bloated and very GUI heavy (wants to load thumbnails for everything).  But seen as I never use it I'll never see the improvements/disasters that it has.  And I won't be trying it out either.

All in all this has been an hour well spent.

I'm installing the Public Beta of Office 2007 as we speak.  I actually had this installed on a spare XP HD and I was impressed with the new Ribbon instead of the toolbar.  Again, a bit GUI heavy, but it's very easy to use.

Anybody else tried Vista or Office 2007 yet?

Subtle hint - I'm hoping people don't post with the usual m$ sucks stuff :-)
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"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

Offline Amigaz

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2006, 04:17:45 PM »
Tried it here too, the latest build
Very nice indeed.
I quit using it because not much software/games etc worked.
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Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2006, 04:22:44 PM »
That's why I've installed it on a removable HD.

If I fancy a look or testing something I'll boot up Vista or Linux, if I want to do something more I'll boot up XP normally.

It's handy having a few spare HD's and a removable rack :-D

I'm posting this on Opera 8.54 and IE7 is slightly faster.  Maybe only a second, but it's still noticable.
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"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2006, 04:53:32 PM »
Quote
Yes, I'm a sadist


Why?  Who are you forcing to use Vista against their will? ;-)
 

Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2006, 05:19:03 PM »
:lol:

I meant masochist.
Xbox360
"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

Offline adolescent

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2006, 06:09:25 PM »
Sadist is correct... you're inflicting pain on your computer.  :-P
Time to move on.  Bye Amiga.org.  :(
 

Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2006, 07:34:32 PM »
Quote

adolescent wrote:
Sadist is correct... you're inflicting pain on your computer.  :-P

:lol:


Okay, I'm annoyed that there's no menu in any of the My Computer windows.  That means I can't find the Options to show all folders etc.

I know there should be more files than I can see, but I can't find a way to see them.
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"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2006, 09:48:31 PM »
Quote

Vincent wrote:
Okay, I'm annoyed that there's no menu in any of the My Computer windows.  That means I can't find the Options to show all folders etc.

I know there should be more files than I can see, but I can't find a way to see them.

Problem solved.

You have to go into the Control Panel and use Folder Options there.  The Folder Options are the same as in XP, except in Vista there's a "Always show Classic menus" option.

Very nice, now I have the File, Edit, View menus.  Makes things a whole lot easier.

Another problem reared it's head though.  I couldn't see what was inside the Documents and Settings folder.  I had to fuss about with the security settings for 5 minutes before I could see what was in them.  There seems to be 2 levels of security per user.

--edit--

btw, the "Performance Rating" is:

2.9 - AMD Sempron 2600+
2.9 - 1.00GB ram
3.2 - Primary HD - 13.58GB Free (27.95GB Total) (*1)
2.4 - NVIDIA GeForce FX5200 (*2)
2.4 - 128MB Graphics Memory
2 - Overall

(*1) - 2.19GB for Prog Files (Half Life, Blue Shift, Office 2007, Opera, Winamp and a few others), 7.04GB for Vista itself (not including Docs and Settings) and 3.10GB for the old XP install (that was renamed Windows.old during installation).

(*2) - Using Vista's own drivers, the proper NVIDIA ones don't recognise Vista as Windows.
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"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

Offline Gojirax

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2006, 02:46:22 AM »
Try it on a more modern video card. Something from the 6500(Can't recall what NVidia uses for their better models, but if it's FX or MX use that one) series forward. Or for ATi something Radeon 9800 Pro and up.

The 3D desktop is amazing, but won't work without a newer card.

I like the fact that you can put keywords in a files description and that the OS is database driven and the user profile is a service now. It makes it a much more scalable and eventually more responsive system.

I look forward to it.
 

Offline Wayne

Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2006, 09:11:22 AM »
Hi vincent,

what do you means when you say that IE7 is faster than opera 8?
on which side is faster? on cache or on loading images?
 
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Offline Waccoon

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2006, 09:15:18 AM »
Since I still use Win2K and don't follow Vista too closely, I have to ask...

How does folder navigation compare to older versions of Windows?  Can you add classic or custom buttons?  I find it awkward not having buttons like "Stop" and "Home" in the web browser (Safari on the Mac drives me crazy), and "Up" in Explorer.

Also, do file requesters finally allow you to define your own favorite folders?  I find it odd that MagicRequester on the Amiga allowed me to do this, but Windows still doesn't.

Navigation and hotkey shortcuts are very important to me.  The Mac is geared too much to people who don't do serious work, and Apple has intentionally cut out the "useless" buttons.  I'm worried that Windows is going in the same direction.
 

Offline ptek

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2006, 11:37:12 AM »
Just to words about this Vista thing :

It sucks

A 2600Ghz CPU, 1Gb ram and it's slow ?!

Good greef!

In fact, i'm surprised to see so many people liking it or at least taking it easly...

I'll keep with win2000 for minimum resources comsumption and XP (SP1 of course!) for the more powerful PCs.

Using winuae for great games :D
(winuae sometimes blow up when running serious workbench utilities :pissed:  )
Onions have layers ...
 

Offline ptek

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2006, 11:48:53 AM »
Quote
Also, do file requesters finally allow you to define your own favorite folders? I find it odd that MagicRequester on the Amiga allowed me to do this, but Windows still doesn't.


Well, simply because MagicRequester was made by someone who brought what users wanted unlike M$ who delivers what they want...

In the case of Vista : selling new PC hardware.

Who needs a new OS every 2 years ?
Who needs a "new" hibernation variantion ? Well it's faster in theory, but only matters if you use your PC as a multimedia centre.
Who needs a fancy 3D task switcher ?
Who needs a start menu that opens more quickly ?
Who believes in better security when the product cames from M$ ?

Who needs to sell hardware ? The industry, at our cost !


Don't go with the flock unless you really need to run that program who eventually will only run on Vista ...

If win2000 or XP (or linux, or MacOS, or even AmigaOS!) does the job, stick to it if you have no reason to charge. Remember that then you will have to spend more money buying RAM and eventually a new mboard with a faster CPU...

Just my humble advice.
But I think all of you know this, so stop reading :)
Onions have layers ...
 

Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #13 on: June 10, 2006, 12:43:11 PM »
Quote

ptek wrote:
A 2600Ghz CPU, 1Gb ram and it's slow ?!

Actually, the AMD Sempron 2600+ runs at 1.8GHz, not 2.6 (which is what I think you meant).

AMD haven't used proper GHz numbers in the names of their chips for a while now.

@Waccoon
I'll be having another look at Vista this afternoon, mainly to try out the new explorer shell.

@laser
I tested a few pages and found...

Using IE7 and Opera for the first time to load up the same page, IE7 was slightly quicker.  The same with revisiting a page.  But Opera does go "Back" slightly quicker than IE7, although IE7 has made a drastic improvement with that.
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"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel
 

Offline VincentTopic starter

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Re: Windows Vista Beta 2 public release
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2006, 04:03:09 PM »
Quote

Waccoon wrote:
How does folder navigation compare to older versions of Windows?  Can you add classic or custom buttons?

Unfortunately you can't really do anything with the toolbars in the explorer shell.  Which is a bit of a c***, I liked having  things like folder options on the toolbar.  You can add the normal file menus though (as I mentioned earlier) and they do appear the same as the menus in 2k and XP.

You still have the back, forward, address bar and search bar, but there's no "up" like before.  But that's not really missing as they've improved the address bar.

The address bar now looks like:

> Computer > Local Disk (C:) > Windows >

The arrows are clickable and give you relative folders to what the arrow is for.

Example:  if you click the arrow to the right of Computer you'll get a drop down menu with all your drives.  If you click the one to the right of (C:) you'll get a list of all the folders on C:.  To go up one level, just click on the name of the above folder, eg clicking Computer will take you to Computer.  Funny how it's not My Computer anymore, I wonder why ;-)

It's actually a very handy improvement.  You have more control over where you want to go, and it's a lot easier to go back to previous locations without having to hit back a few times or delete part of the path in the address bar.

Below the address bar you have another toolbar that changes depending what type of folder you're in.  A normal folder (eg Windows) has Organize, Views, Share, Burn, Previous versions and Add to Index...

Organize > New Folder, Cut, Copy, Paste, Undo, Redo, Select all, Layout, Folder Options (I wish I knew about this much earlier), Delete, Rename, Remove properties, Properties, Close

Views > Extra Large Icons (big thumbnails), Large Icons (medium thumbnails), Medium Icons (small thumbnails), Small Icons, Details, Tiles (small thumbnails with name, type and size).

You still have the info pane on the left, but you have a Folders button at the bottom that shows or hides the folders pane.

Quote
I find it awkward not having buttons like "Stop" and "Home" in the web browser (Safari on the Mac drives me crazy)

IE7 has Back, Forward, Address Bar, Refresh, Stop and a search bar in the main toolbar.  Below that you have the normal IE6 menus (if you've enabled them).

Below them you have your tabs bar which has Favourites, Add to Favourites, open tabs, new tab, Home, RSS, Print, Page and Tools.

Home, RSS, Print, Page and Tools all have their own drop down arrows:

Home > (homepage), Change Homepage, Remove

RSS > gives a list of the feeds for the page you're on

Print > Print, Print Preview, Page Setup

Page > New Window, Cut, Copy, Paste, Save As, Send this page, edit, Zoom, Text Size, View Source, Security Report, Web Page Privacy Policy

Tools > Delete Browsing History, Diagnose Connection Problems, Blockup Popper, Phishing Filter, Manage Addons, Work Off line, Give Beta Feedback, Windows Update, Fullscreen, Toolbars, Internet Options

So, without having the menus avaliable, everything is still easily accessible.

One thing about the "classic menu"s (in both IE7 and the explorer shell), they appear below the main toolbar.  But once you start using them you don't really notice the change.

Quote
Navigation and hotkey shortcuts are very important to me.  The Mac is geared too much to people who don't do serious work, and Apple has intentionally cut out the "useless" buttons.  I'm worried that Windows is going in the same direction.

I'm not sure about shortcuts, I haven't really tried many except the usual copy (Ctr C), paste (Ctr v), Task Manager (Ctr Shft Esc), Start Menu (Ctr Esc), normal menus (Alt), program switching (Alt Tab).  What shortcuts do you use a lot and I'll check if they're still working.
Xbox360
"Oh no. Everytime you turn up something monumental and terrible happens.
I don\'t think I have the stomach for it." - Raziel