Toshiba boffins prep laptop fuel cell

[The_Editor]

Taken from "The Reg[/i]"


Toshiba boffins prep laptop fuel cell
By Tony Smith
Posted: 05/03/2003 at 11:55 GMT


Toshiba has figured out how to power a portable computer using fuel cell technology without the need for a power unit larger than the PC itself.

Toshiba's small form factor direct methanol fuel cell (aka DMFC) can operate for five hours, generating between 12W and 20W of power and is electrically compatible with existing Lithium-Ion rechargeable batteries. It's not yet the size of a typical notebook battery, but Tosh is working on it.

The fuel cell generates electricity as a by-product of a chemical reaction involving dilute methanol. Methanol can be produced easily and in vast quantities, so the fuel cell is widely seen as a very inexpensive alternative to batteries. And by generating electricity directly, it's arguably a greener technology too.

The principle behind fuel cells has been understood for some time. The problem has been generating sufficient energy to power what you want to power, and to do so with a unit that's conveniently sized for the application.




Would be cool to have an Amiga powered by fuel cell technology  !!

The Reg

AHA.......... I've sussed out the delays with A1 & Os4 !!   :-D  :-D

[Nick]

Cool. I like this sort of stuff. I`m guessing its the same kind of fuel cell as the electric cars. This could be cool, but how long do standard batteries last in laptops?

[lorddef]

I might make a fuel cell for my a1200, now where did I put that old 2-stroke and Fiesta alternator  :-D

[KennyR]

One of the biggest problems with fuel cells is price. To get reactions to happen at that scale (you're actually burning the fuel), you need a catalyst - namely platinum and rhodium. Platinum is worth more than gold, and rhodium is the most expensive metal on today's market.

Although the design of the catalysts use as little of these precious metals as possible, they do use them, and it's likely it would cost less for many lead-acid/nickel-cadmium batteries than it would for one fuel cell. While the fuel cell would be a lot cheaper in the long run, the short run would make the price-obsessed world market ignore them. This is the first big hurdle fuel cell technology has to face.

And we all know that people are price obsessed, don't we? (/me points finger accusingly at x86 crowd)

[The_Editor]

Very True !!

[CaptainFrank]

> but how long do standard batteries last in laptops?

Two maybe Three hours, if your lucky.

regards,


Frank.

[bloodline]

KennyR wrote:
One of the biggest problems with fuel cells is price. To get reactions to happen at that scale (you're actually burning the fuel), you need a catalyst - namely platinum and rhodium. Platinum is worth more than gold, and rhodium is the most expensive metal on today's market.

Although the design of the catalysts use as little of these precious metals as possible, they do use them, and it's likely it would cost less for many lead-acid/nickel-cadmium batteries than it would for one fuel cell. While the fuel cell would be a lot cheaper in the long run, the short run would make the price-obsessed world market ignore them. This is the first big hurdle fuel cell technology has to face.

And we all know that people are price obsessed, don't we? (/me points finger accusingly at x86 crowd)

Given that I have designed and build several Fuel cells (I'm a Chemist you see), I would like to point out that the catalyst in a fuel cell is actually Nickel!

In a hydrogen oxygen  (Bacon) fuel cell, the nickel catalyst is all you need.
When using Methanol, you need a regenerator, where I used Steam as the catalyst to change the Methanol into hydrgen and Carbon dioxide.
I'm not sure how these portable fuel cells regenerate hydrogen from Methanol, it's possible that platinum might be a suitable catalyst, but I syspect that a Steel catalyst might be suitable.

Although I managed to get about 1 volt per cell the current was tiny, I guess the high price of these cell is due to the very complex manufacturing process needed to get a high surface area, and thus a high current. I also had the problem that the electrolyte was poisoned by the water produced in the reaction (I believe the CO2 poisoned my Nickel too...  :-? )

[KennyR]

Given that I have designed and build several Fuel cells (I'm a Chemist you see), I would like to point out that the catalyst in a fuel cell is actually Nickel!

I'm a chemist too, and though I've never built a fuel cell myself I can say with 90% certainty that commerical direct-methanol fuel cells use platinum as a catalyst. Nickel is too reactive with hydrogen, too inefficient at usable portable-device temperatures (50-130 C), and too easily poisoned to be used in a fuel cell the size of a mobile phone battery.

Here's a nice paper on how modern direct-methanol fuel cells work:

http://www.ott.doe.gov/pdfs/16-gottesfeld.pdf

[bloodline]

Good point, I had to run mine at about 80C before the output was significant.

I never had any problems with nickel and te hydrogen, though I do think mine was poinsed by the CO2 (never got around to testing that hypothesis though).

But I have read that Steel is a good catalyst for generating hydrogen from Methanol. It is true that I've not look into it for about 6 years, I'll bet technology has move on slightly  :-D
Actually I have been wondering what electrolyte they used I ws suing 8 molar Potasium hydroxide, and that stuff was evil!!!! It even disolved the epoxy glue I used to hold my Cell together, actually that was quite funny  :-P

cheers for the link, I'll enjoy reading that. :-)

[BADHead]

How about a Nuclear fuel cell it would power
a laptop for centurys and comes with a free
Lead case   :-D

[bloodline]

Free cancer, and free sterilisation too.

Also it would have to come with a free Truck to carry it  :-D

[Nick]

Yeah, but trucks are portable arn`t they :-D

[Valan]

What about the weight?
Will they be lighter or about the same as batteries today?

Valan

[KennyR]

What about the weight?
Will they be lighter or about the same as batteries today?

The intention is to make them the same size and weight as laptop batteries. At first they may be a bit heavier, but as they get better designs they'll get lighter.

[Dan]

How about a Nuclear fuel cell it would power
Lead case

Well aren´t there some kind of cesium batterys for pacemakers or something, i read about it a year ago or so.
Had a battery life of 50 years but very small current and was probably very expensive too.
Still 50 years battery life in your PDA :-)