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Author Topic: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd party AmigaOS after OS4.0.  (Read 20152 times)

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Offline pjhutch

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2005, 12:21:06 PM »
AFAIK, Amiga Inc are concentrating on Amiga Anywhere and Hyperion are developing AmigaOS.

I would suspect, in the future, that they would converge so that AmigaOS can run Amiga Anywhere programs. We need Java etc to do that.

 

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2005, 01:10:07 PM »
Quote
To the extent Garry even said this (which I doubt), the fact remains that future revisions of Amiga OS 4 are a certainty provided there are sufficient sales of Amiga OS 4.0 for Hyperion to cover its development costs.

Ben,

Now I know, or at least give you the benefit of doubt, that you're not stupid enough to sit here trying to convince everyone that you can continue to write OS4.x (or OS4 boing bag x) on sales of approximately a thousand units (or even two thousand for that matter).  Especially since you -- or Amiga Inc -- already gave away OS4 to motherboard purchasers.

Face it.  There is no market left.  The Mac Mini killed your price point, and the Amiga PPC machine (as I said and was crucified for in 2001) has no external market left to sell to other than a couple thousand devoted fans. For all intents and purposes, it is a dead-end platform and this has been pretty well confirmed by the evasion of Garry Hare to answer the question without dancing around it.  

I wish you and the others involved the very best.  I really, sincerely do, but anyone who wants to pretend differently is just doing this as a hobby, and that's an eventual dead-end in itself.  I should know.  I've run this site as a hobby for the last 10 years.

Wayne
 

Offline klesterjr

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #46 on: March 21, 2005, 01:31:27 PM »
@Wayne

A lot more than 1000 people are "interested" in OS4 (as evidenced by 4000+ downloads of the new OS4 video in the last two days ).

Once OS4 is released, a lot of us will take a more serious look at it (most of us do NOT want to be beta-testers!).

At that point, Hyperion can get back to porting games, where there IS potential for a small profit -- and the SAME users can be marketed to again & again.

Hyperion's only real crime has been being overly optimistic about how long it would take to port an entire operating system versus porting a game.

It's a long shot, but Hyperion has been willing to take it -- forget the "Chicken Little" routine and let's see how it plays out.
 

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #47 on: March 21, 2005, 01:45:46 PM »
Quote
It's a long shot, but Hyperion has been willing to take it -- forget the "Chicken Little" routine and let's see how it plays out.
At 10 years of waiting to see how it "plays out", watching the world pass it by (as I stated would happen in 2001) and being beaten up from every angle for my trouble, I'm pretty much out of interest.  

Oh, and your comment measuring interest by the "4000 people who downloaded the video" is erroneous as well.  I have absolutely zero interest in buying OS4 or the AmigaOne and I watched it just to see what it was about.  Had to download it 3 times to get it to actually play right, and surely I'm not the only one.  Perhaps you should actually do a grep on the log to see how many individuals have watched it and I'll bet your 4000 is going to be (astonishingly enough) less than 1500 to 2000 people...  

Even granting you 2000, if each of those buys a copy of OS4.x (to go with their outdated, overpriced motherboard) (I say 4.x because 4.0 is free with the board) then that's only $100,000.  Far short of the amount it would take to hire 4 or 5 competent programmers.

Wayne
 

Offline Cymric

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #48 on: March 21, 2005, 01:53:18 PM »
Quote
Even granting you 2000, if each of those buys a copy of OS4.x (to go with their outdated, overpriced motherboard) (I say 4.x because 4.0 is free with the board) then that's only $100,000.  Far short of the amount it would take to hire 4 or 5 competent programmers.

Numbers can be so terribly cruel at times...
Some people say that cats are sneaky, evil and cruel. True, and they have many other fine qualities as well.
 

Offline Quixote

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2005, 01:54:53 PM »
Klesterjr kibitzed:
Quote
A lot more than 1000 people are "interested" in OS4 (as evidenced by 4000+ downloads of the new OS4 video in the last two days ).

Once OS4 is released, a lot of us will take a more serious look at it (most of us do NOT want to be beta-testers!).

;-) Count me among those who are very interested in AmigaOS 4, while not willing to be a beta tester.  Not that I object to playing with the OS that much sooner, it's just that I wouldn't be much help to the team....
 

Offline klesterjr

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #50 on: March 21, 2005, 02:16:05 PM »
@Wayne

I downloaded it in one go -- maybe there was something wrong with your connection?

Even so, 2000 x $100 (what Hyperion gets from each copy of OS4) is $200,000 (not $100,000) -- which is still a big loss, no question -- but that has nothing to do with what I said, now does it?

I thought my post was clear, but I guess not -- so, rather than reiterate my point, I'll just move along.

Have a nice day.  :-)
 

Offline DonnyEMU

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2005, 02:28:09 PM »
I already made my hardware exodus to the PC many years ago, it's cheap affordable, and runs all of my old stuff very very well..

As for my OS exodus.. Today I am putting a copy of AROS on one of my machines  for good and I plan to stick with that, because it's a community supported product. I am not stuck with the motives of a profit-minded CEO..

Personally though, this is my thoughts on this.. If we look at OS 3.9 and OS 4.0 they were developed by different organizations.. The strategy of having someone else develop a later  version of Amiga Inc.'s OS (which might be an OS not even related to current development and hardware) isn't unreasonable considering many companies adopt this kind of strategy.

Amiga Inc. being a viable company has every right to come up with a totally new product and go off in a different direction. It's how you stay in business. I refer to my Amiga computers that I own as Commodore-Amigas.. Because the reality of it, is they were computers made by Commodore that run an OS that was Commodore's design.

You can't blame Mr. Hare for wanting his own company and his own direction. It's a normal business motive.. Don't get stuck in 1985 folks. It's hard to let go of something you love, but sometimes you need to take a look at your spot in the world, and see if it's competitive or that it's viable today. The platform has weathered the storms and as long as people are still using it there will be a reason to talk about it and celebrate it's capabilities.

If you go to Atari.org you will notice there is a lot of people there still involved because they like that technology. They aren't bemoaning the fact that Atari label  is now with a games company and the company that made the atari ST is no more..

I think the community can learn from that example and it's still very popular websites and community supported hardware.


@pjhutch: okay silly question why does Amiga need Java.. Microsoft's .Net is proof and Amiga Anywhere is further proof that you can do all of that yourself and build your own virtual machine.. Java YUCK!

-Don

PS Did Commodore try to make money off of selling the OS other than upgrading it? NO! They sold incredible hardware for it's time and provided a decent OS for that hardware.. Did they loose money off of the OS? Most certainly.. Their situation is very unlike today. Amiga is nothing but a brand, who needs to make money? Hyperion and Eyetech, does Amiga need to make money? If someone came out with a compatible OS that ran on the A1 hardware that ran the software they wouldn't even "need" the name Amiga to get customers.. You can't call it Amiga, but can you really say AInc. has much to do with the product (besides the license) anyway?? I think Mr. Hare is very smart to bring whatever they do back "in house".. it's a company directional issue..Maybe he will in essence create a new OS for mobile computing, the internet etc. and call it the "AmigaOS" that has nothing to do with the computer that this board is all about. It's well within their rights, and that's what I took that whole conversation to mean.


Quote

smithy wrote:

I'm disappointed, angry, and bewildered... for the at least 5th year we face yet more total uncertainty.  I am fed up of all of this.  Someone needs to produce a concise statement of WTF is going here, or else this disaster is going to turn into yet another exodus of Amiga users to the Mac or Linux.

smithy
======================================
Don Burnett Developer
http://blog.donburnett.com
don@donburnett.com
======================================
 

Offline Karlos

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2005, 02:29:08 PM »
Quote

Quixote wrote:

Not that I object to playing with the OS that much sooner, it's just that I wouldn't be much help to the team....


Well, given the way work etc is going, I've been as much use as a chocolate teapot for the last few months :-(
int p; // A
 

Offline falemagn

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #53 on: March 21, 2005, 03:10:14 PM »
Quote
A lot more than 1000 people are "interested" in OS4 (as
 evidenced by 4000+ downloads of the new OS4 video in the
 last two days ).


I've downloaded that video too, but I can assure you, I will never buy an AmigaONE to run AOS4. Like me, there are so many others...


 

Offline redrumloaTopic starter

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #54 on: March 21, 2005, 03:17:31 PM »
Quote

falemagn wrote:
I've downloaded that video too, but I can assure you, I will never buy an AmigaONE to run AOS4. Like me, there are so many others...


Same here, I downloaded the video. While OS4 looks impressive, no way at all I would buy an A1 motherboard. I think you will find that with most downloaders. Interest in OS4, but zero interest in A1.
Someone has to state the obvious and that someone is me!
 

Offline bhoggett

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #55 on: March 21, 2005, 03:25:42 PM »
I am sadly neither amazed or even surprised that after what must be at least one year away from all things Amiga I return for a quick check and see that practically nothing has changed.

What a waste!   :-(
Bill Hoggett
 

Offline ikir

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #56 on: March 21, 2005, 03:34:39 PM »
Quote

falemagn wrote:
Quote
A lot more than 1000 people are "interested" in OS4 (as
 evidenced by 4000+ downloads of the new OS4 video in the
 last two days ).


I've downloaded that video too, but I can assure you, I will never buy an AmigaONE to run AOS4. Like me, there are so many others...

It is a waste! every good coder is  welcome in the OS4/A1 comunity!

For me A1 is very good (with a sil or the fix), expensive yes... but older Amigas were expensive as well. A1 is one my best buy ever.
I hope you change your mind in the future, or that another hardware solutions will be able to run OS4... so you all can join the party.
 

Offline ikir

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #57 on: March 21, 2005, 03:37:32 PM »
@Wayne
The same for the opposite. A lot of people interested in OS4 haven't dowloaded the video as well.
 

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #58 on: March 21, 2005, 03:40:51 PM »
Quote

bhoggett wrote:
I am sadly neither amazed or even surprised that after what must be at least one year away from all things Amiga I return for a quick check and see that practically nothing has changed.

What a waste!   :-(


It's like the twilight zone!
 

Offline Jose

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Re: Quick Gary Hare IRC report, no more 3rd part AmigaOS after OS4.0.
« Reply #59 from previous page: March 21, 2005, 03:48:36 PM »
@Ben

"To the extent Garry even said this (which I doubt), the fact remains that future revisions of Amiga OS 4 are a certainty provided there are sufficient sales of Amiga OS 4.0 for Hyperion to cover its development costs"


So you're continue to develop it till AmigaOS4.999999(9) ?

Few would be as satisfied as me if AmigaOS4 succeded on PPC but AInc. is killing it. What do they mean with taking development inhouse ?
And this without talking about when he mentioned "filter developers". Same as Genesi, they're just using us but at least they should have the moral of giving something back.
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