Why not AmigaOS4 for x86 Platforms?

[bloodline]

Waccoon wrote:

I have a plan that I really believe will work if God permits.

Given the number of bugs on Earth, I'd say God uses Windows.

:lol:

[BigBenAussie]

We don't need custom chips or great graphics chipsets or even a speedy motherboard if we get Cell tech on a PowerPC chip in an Amiga. It won't work in a PC(at least for a while), so it'll be between PPC platforms like the Amiga and Apple, and with a bit of luck we could be the first desktop system to utilise it. Cell tech is probably going to blow us away and even the latest 3d Graphics cards will have a hard time catching up. We're talking raytraced realtime graphics now.

I once said AmigaOS should be ported to XBox2....well, methinks XBox2 is in for a rather nasty surprise when PS3 featuring cell tech comes out.... Port AmigaOS to PS3 maybe...but if the cell tech is on a PPC chip...then we can get back in the game....and the rest of the A1 mobo will make no difference.

Then all we need to do is stack our uA1s and.....We'll take over the world... MWAHAHAHA!!! Wait....If my TV has a Cell PPC chip on it.....and my PDA....and my Cell/Mobile phone....and my Microwave oven......Errr...and its driven by my Amiga.....Then that's a lot of extra processing power!!! Hey, if its all connected then we very well could take over the world literally.....But maybe I shouldn't stand too close to the microwave either.

Ok. Going back to my happy place now.

[mdwh2]

Waccoon wrote:

Presumably either its low cost or small size. I didn't think anyone was excited because it's the fastest computer in existance.

In the threads about AmigaOne vs Mac Mini, speed seems to be the dominant issue.  People are willing to pay a lot for a new platform, but not at the performance the AmigaOne delivers.

Good speed for its price, which is exactly what I'm saying - and indeed anyway, I was the one saying that speed was important, in response to someone saying that it wasn't important. "People are willing to pay a lot for a new platform, but not at the performance the AmigaOne delivers" is basically exactly what I said a few posts ago when I said "Paying loads extra for a G5 which is possibly faster than any x86 might attract some people, but few want to pay loads extra for something much slower", so I do not think we are in disagreement here.

I then added that "I agree in some sense; I'm more bothered about other things that pure CPU speed." Which is true. Even if other people are bothered about having the fastest thing available irrespective of cost (and I'm not sure that interest in the Mac Mini indicates that), that doesn't affect what *I* am concerned with.

And aren't mp3 encoders/decoders etc available for AmigaOS too? That's my point.

Aren't they for 486's and SPARC and Alpha, too?  What's your point?

The original claim was that there is nothing on AmigaOS that takes advantage of fast CPUs. If encoders/decoders are an example of something that "takes advantage of fast CPUs", then these *are* available on AmigaOS. Repeating that they are available on other platforms is beside the point, as I never claimed that 486s, Sparcs etc have nothing to tax their CPUs.

[DavidF215]

mikeymike wrote:

DavidF215 wrote:
Hey, don't tempt me.  :-)  I have a few ideas that are viable. Just need: (1) a salesman who can sell anything to anybody, (2) a biz manager that can raise funds easily, (3) a good programmer or two. I can manage the rest.

"or two"?  In which decade were you thinking about releasing the x86 port?

I'm not talking about the port. If you would have read my previous post, you would know that I think an x86 port does not make business sense.

[DavidF215]

leirbag28 wrote:
@DavidF215

David, I think that would work, I have a friend who sells Video Toasters for their solutions.and there definitely is still a market for A1200. Just dont sell them as PC replacements but as dedicated machines for a certain task.................as a Character generator for instance.or as you very well said.

Yes. Exactly. The VT is a great example of my idea for Amiga. And, btw, we need something to replace the VT for A1.

[bloodline]

DavidF215 wrote:

leirbag28 wrote:
@DavidF215

David, I think that would work, I have a friend who sells Video Toasters for their solutions.and there definitely is still a market for A1200. Just dont sell them as PC replacements but as dedicated machines for a certain task.................as a Character generator for instance.or as you very well said.

Yes. Exactly. The VT is a great example of my idea for Amiga. And, btw, we need something to replace the VT for A1.

Firewire and decent software... infact WindowsXP comes with basic Movie making/edting software... Which I can use when I connect my mates camcorder via the firewire to my PC...

[leirbag28]

@bloodline

"Firewire and decent software... infact WindowsXP comes with basic Movie making/edting software... Which I can use when I connect my mates camcorder via the firewire to my PC..."
-----------------------------------------------------------------

 The same Firewire and Decent software Would work Ten times better on a New G4 A1........you seem pretty happy with your PC...............then you dont really need anything from the Amiga world.
Personally I am not satisfied and have never been with a PC...it is always dissapointing. Especially when I find my Classic 68030 Amiga Outperforming it in many ways............real real sad!  I just imagine a Modern Amiga at comparable level with a PC............it would destroy it.

Anyway, PC's are about manking money..........so you get constantly ripped off.............this is also happening in the Amiga world but 10 fold..................I dont believe in that............a New Amiga should be your All In One do it All with Super high grade chips (yet still replacable incase they die)

We are so willing to pay much more for our Amigas because of the pleasure we get from running it on Amiga......because it amazes us that despite how old it was...............it still can do many modern things...........and do it nicely in an AmigaOS way.

AmigaOS (in a modern incarnation) really is the better OS amongst Windows and MacOS.......no one can ever tell me otherwise.

[bloodline]

The same Firewire and Decent software Would work Ten times better on a New G4 A1

Clock for clock it would work much the same. Except the Athlon64 is cheaper (more bang per buck).

you seem pretty happy with your PC

With my Athlon64...? You bet, it's great!

then you dont really need anything from the Amiga world.
 

Not True! Amiga is my History, it's my world. Unfortunatly my view of the amiga future doesn't involve the AmigaONE.

My Classic Amigas, UAE and AROS give me all the Amiga joy I need.

Especially when I find my Classic 68030 Amiga Outperforming it in many ways

I can only think of one area where your Classic amiga outperforms a modern PC... in the style department...

I just imagine a Modern Amiga at comparable level with a PC............it would destroy it

Not really... It would just have less software.

a New Amiga should be your All In One do it All with Super high grade chips (yet still replacable incase they die)

Yeah, that's a good idea... in fact why not put the "Super high grade chips" on separate boards with their own support system and attach them to the CPU using a highspeed serial link... like PCI-Express socket on an HyperTransport bus... that way you can replace them if they die... hell, you could even replace them if you just wanted a faster/better version.

AmigaOS (in a modern incarnation) really is the better OS amongst Windows and MacOS.......no one can ever tell me otherwise.

Yeah, yeah, we all like AmigaOS, that's why we're here... but don't fool yourself. It's a hobby OS, fun... not better, just more fun. And strangly comforting.

[DavidF215]

@bloodline

Firewire and decent software... infact WindowsXP comes with basic Movie making/edting software... Which I can use when I connect my mates camcorder via the firewire to my PC...

I use XP and Movie Maker for editing too now. AmigaOS4 needs native Firewire support and DV software so I can have a good reason to buy an AmigaOne.

[bloodline]

DavidF215 wrote:
@bloodline

Firewire and decent software... infact WindowsXP comes with basic Movie making/edting software... Which I can use when I connect my mates camcorder via the firewire to my PC...

I use XP and Movie Maker for editing too now. AmigaOS4 needs native Firewire support and DV software so I can have a good reason to buy an AmigaOne.

Ok, I'm missing something... Why do you think the Amiga is comercialy viable?

[DonnyEMU]

BigBenAussie wrote:
We don't need custom chips or great graphics chipsets or even a speedy motherboard if we get Cell tech on a PowerPC chip in an Amiga. It won't work in a PC(at least for a while), so it'll be between PPC platforms like the Amiga and Apple, and with a bit of luck we could be the first desktop system to utilise it. Cell tech is probably going to blow us away and even the latest 3d Graphics cards will have a hard time catching up. We're talking raytraced realtime graphics now.

I once said AmigaOS should be ported to XBox2....well, methinks XBox2 is in for a rather nasty surprise when PS3 featuring cell tech comes out.... Port AmigaOS to PS3 maybe...but if the cell tech is on a PPC chip...then we can get back in the game....and the rest of the A1 mobo will make no difference.

Then all we need to do is stack our uA1s and.....We'll take over the world... MWAHAHAHA!!! Wait....If my TV has a Cell PPC chip on it.....and my PDA....and my Cell/Mobile phone....and my Microwave oven......Errr...and its driven by my Amiga.....Then that's a lot of extra processing power!!! Hey, if its all connected then we very well could take over the world literally.....But maybe I shouldn't stand too close to the microwave either.

Okay maybe I am getting a little old here, but I remember being on some board a few years ago and some dude was up on there promoting a "transputer" and how it's processing power was gonna make the Amiga the most powerful computing platform on the earth.. They ended up not having a market and their wild claims only came to fruition on the Atari ST..

Also, what happened with cellular technology on IRIX (SGI's Unix).. Well it's kinda disappeared off the radar screen..

Moral of the Story: Don't get hyped about a technology until you see it making an industry impact.. Chances are all you will be left with is hype..

Now talk about useable technology.. Does the Amiga have a PCI-Express motherboard with dual SLI graphics cards.. Probably not.. But I do hear AROS runs on it..

[bloodline]

Okay maybe I am getting a little old here, but I remember being on some board a few years ago and some dude was up on there promoting a "transputer" and how it's processing power was gonna make the Amiga the most powerful computing platform on the earth.. They ended up not having a market and their wild claims only came to fruition on the Atari ST..  

Actually the Transputer thing is a great example, which is similar to the Cell hype.

I rather like the transputer idea, but it wasa miserable failure for lots of reasons. But I've never forgoten it and neither did the Chip designers... what we are seeing now with modern CPU's are features of these old failed experiments finding a place in the computing mainstream... one idea a did love about the Transputer was the idea of lots of serial links rather than a single parallel bus... and look... we now have a hyper transport technology and PCI-Express... great stuff!!

May

[leirbag28]

@bloodline

"Yeah, yeah, we all like AmigaOS, that's why we're here... but don't fool yourself. It's a hobby OS, fun... not better, just more fun. And strangly comforting."
---------------------------------------------------------

AmigaOS just a hobby OS?  maybe............infact compared to Todays modern OS's it Totally sucks!
.........................But I am not talking about Amigas and its OS in the curent state it is.....but rather what it could be and should be if it were modernized correctly...........AmigaOS has a small footprint.............that alone will allow applications to run much faster than an equally competitive Windows or Mac machine..............this is what I am talking about.......................having the same specs and all 3 machines...yet Amiga always coming out on Top as it did back in the days of 386's and 486's..even Pentiums I and II's...............my 68030 outperformed them Real bad in many ways!

[DavidF215]

@bloodline

Ok, I'm missing something... Why do you think the Amiga is comercialy viable?

I've already mentioned some viabilities in a previous reply (page 7 or 8, I think).

@leirbag28

I agree. It's a "hobby" OS due to the lack up updates. Which leads me to ask: Why didn't Amiga, Inc update the A1200/A4000 mobo with USB/Firewall/etc and update AmigaOS with WarpOS/PPC enhancements. Get the entire platform updated and machines in production, then switch to full PPC in a later version of OS4? I'm guessing the way they did it was thought to be best.

So much potential, so little resources

[terminator]

Antiriad wrote:
I was just wondering why the AmigaOS 4.0 won't be released for x86 Platforms which make more than %90 of PCs around the world? Why do you think linux is gaining on the Windows OS?

I do not think OS 4.0 will survive for too long!!!!

Just my thoughts....

Just how long do you think it would survive in the MS sandbox?

It would be dead in minutes. Who in their right mind would waste time developing for an x86 version of OS4 when they may as well just release it for Windows.

Why would anyone buy anything for the x86 version of OS4, when they can buy almost anything at the local pc superstore, today.  Not 18 months from now.

People who keep whining on about this x86 issue just don't see the big picture.  

So an A1 costs more than a low end PC.  Well, that's the price of admission.  Don't like the price? Well, you are not obligated to buy a ticket.

[stefcep]

What exactly is great about the amiga custom chips? Slow and Low resolutions, poor sound quality, slow floppy...i think why the chips were good was because the architecture as a whole meant the chips could function independantly of the cpu, as happens with modern PC GPU's. I have an A4000 with a CV64 and a Prelude and a zorro serial and parallel port and a Zorro IDE interface and a cyberstorm 060:  i use none of the original custom chips including the 3.1 ROM and i would never go back to a vanilla A1200 except to play games.

The advantage of custom chips is more uniformity in the code that needs to be written to make the computer do something and hence more stability.  the disadvantage is obsalence and even slower hardware progress,