I had no idea... Amigan metalheads?

[redrumloa]

re: Mudvayne

I like them too, though I actually like their newest album better than LD50.

[T_Bone]

Well, I've heard of Metallica, I don't think I've ever heard of anyone else in this thread  :lol:

[iamaboringperson]

I'm sortof a metal fan.

I much prefer Baroque however.

[Vincent]

that_punk_guy wrote:
It's nice to hear stuff from Max before he changed his entire political schtick and decided he'd make bad Christian music. In my mid-teens he was my hero. Such a disappointment. :-(

Max? Christian music?  Are you sure you're thinking of the right person there? :-P

Actually, I haven't heard any Soulfly since their first album and I only gave that a brief listen.  It was such a drastic change from Sepultura.  Is it really religious now or were you having a joke?

I remembered reading in an interview shortly after he'd split from Seps that he "wouldn't quit music until he'd found the heaviest riff  in the world"...  Then came the first Soulfly album, what a waste!

It's just a pity that Seps haven't been able to get out of Max's shadow though, they're stuff is better than Soulfly, but still not a patch on Max + Seps.

The best thing Max has done since leaving Seps was Red War with Probot.  But probably my favourite song of Seps is the cover of Orgasmatron - fantastic stuff :-D

[redrumloa]

Max? Christian music? Are you sure you're thinking of the right person there?

Hmm.. I don't think he went overly christian besides dedicating an album to God. I didn't even think about it.

Actually, I haven't heard any Soulfly since their first album and I only gave that a brief listen. It was such a drastic change from Sepultura. Is it really religious now or were you having a joke?

I guess i should step in as the resident SoulFly fan here and defend them. SoulFly is NO Sepultura, but it isn't all bad. As a matter of fact I like most if it. Songs like Bleed are extremely heavy and Sepultura-ish (Well take out the stupid 10 seconds of Fred Durst rapping that is..ooh god what was Max thinking). I have all 3 of their albums and overall it is very heavy. It's not completely heavy though, there are some melodies thrown in and musically it goes all over the spectrum. However Max's voice is still Max, and the overall them is still heavy metal, very heavy. I can only think of one song that is so bad I have to turn it off. "In Memory of" is terrible, some other member of the band rapping through the whole song.. uuuh.. Overall it's pretty good stuff.

[that_punk_guy]

redrumloa wrote:

Max? Christian music? Are you sure you're thinking of the right person there?

Hmm.. I don't think he went overly christian besides dedicating an album to God. I didn't even think about it.

"Pressure building on my soul, I ask God to take control."
"Give God thanks and praise!"
"Just let my soul fly free and let me be the one God wants me to be."

- 'Flyhigh'

"God knows, and you will too."
- 'Boom'

"And God will guide me."
- 'Back To The Primitive'.

Also, the cover image of their first record with Max as Christ the Redeemer, and the religious images all over their records.

But it's not that that bothers me. I like other bands who reference Christianity (notably Mineral.) It's not even so much that musically he's content to regurgitate Seps riffs and write incredibly inane lyrics.

Sepultura always brought a conscientious challenge to the injustices of this world and as Max says at some point on the Chaos DVD (I think it's on the second video) never fogot where they had come from. (The interviewer had said that when people escape the poverty of the third world, they tend to become blind to it and pretend it's not there.)

Now, I think that's happened. His lyrics are personal and self-centered, and when he tries to work outside of those parameters he bluffs it by paying "homage" to (ie. pissing on the memory of) Sepultura. He's not playing it straight anymore, he's not for real. He's become lazy and egotistical.

"Only I guide my Inner Self."
"Let me be the one God wants me to be."

Which lyric appeals most to you?

I guess i should step in as the resident SoulFly fan here and defend them. SoulFly is NO Sepultura, but it isn't all bad. As a matter of fact I like most if it. Songs like Bleed are extremely heavy and Sepultura-ish (Well take out the stupid 10 seconds of Fred Durst rapping that is..ooh god what was Max thinking). I have all 3 of their albums and overall it is very heavy. It's not completely heavy though, there are some melodies thrown in and musically it goes all over the spectrum. However Max's voice is still Max, and the overall them is still heavy metal, very heavy. I can only think of one song that is so bad I have to turn it off. "In Memory of" is terrible, some other member of the band rapping through the whole song.. uuuh.. Overall it's pretty good stuff.

Jim, I hope you don't take it as a personal affront when I ask this. ;-)

It seems to me a lot of the time you measure the quality of a record by how "heavy" it is, of course as a metal fan that's important, but is that really more important than the quality of the songs and the integrity of the artist?

[that_punk_guy]

Vincent wrote:
It's just a pity that Seps haven't been able to get out of Max's shadow though, they're stuff is better than Soulfly, but still not a patch on Max + Seps.

Did we ever discuss 'Roorback' when it came out? I was so excited for that, and I've listened to it about 5 times since I bought it. Um, that was May 2003. :-(

I can't get into it at all. 'Nation' is amazing though, definitely better than anything Max has mustered post-Seps.

[Vincent]

that_punk_guy wrote:
Did we ever discuss 'Roorback' when it came out? I was so excited for that, and I've listened to it about 5 times since I bought it. Um, that was May 2003. :-(

I don't think we did, I can't remember it, but that doesn't mean a thing.

I know someone who has some Soulfly albums, once he's moved house (in a week or two, from 5 mins away to just 2 secs round the corner from me) and unpacked I'll borrow them and have a listen.

[redrumloa]

Wow, where to start? You pick certain lines out disecting songs.

"God knows, and you will too."
- 'Boom'

Hardly a religous reference.

"And God will guide me."
- 'Back To The Primitive'.

That's one line from it. another is "F*** all your B***S***.". Hardly a sunday hym for church.

Also, the cover image of their first record with Max as Christ the Redeemer,

Huh? I think that's a bit of a stretch.

It seems to me a lot of the time you measure the quality of a record by how "heavy" it is

I'm a real metalhead, I like heavy. It's not the only factor, but I usually like my metal angry and f***inkg heavy.

is that really more important than the quality of the songs

The quality of the songs is what is pleasing to one's ears. As with any music you either get it or you don't get it. I've already stated I thought old Sepultura was better than Soulfly. I don't know why your so hung up on Soulfly though. Did Max kick your dog in the balls or something? :lol:

and the integrity of the artist?

First off what makes you think there is something wrong with Max's integrity? You may not like his current music, but that's a fry cry from integrity.

Secondly, I normally don't give 2 sh**s about the artists themselves. There are a few exceptions like Burzum and Metallica. They are below contempt and will not see a penny of my money. But besides that I don't care about them or their celebrity status. They make a product I like, I buy it. They make a product I don't like, I don't buy it. I live in South FL and it isn't unusual to bump into a celebrity be it movie, sports or music. I don't even give a second glance normally. They are just people like anyone else. They put their pants on one leg at a time just like anyone else.

[that_punk_guy]

Okay, you totally misunderstood my intentions, I wasn't trying to flame. You don't have to be on the offensive all the time, you know. :-)

Heh... anyway, by way of explanation:

redrumloa wrote:
That's one line from it. another is "F*** all your B***S***.". Hardly a sunday hym for church.

Okay, sure.

But that doesn't nullify the religious content.

Also, the cover image of their first record with Max as Christ the Redeemer,

Huh? I think that's a bit of a stretch.

Ummm nope, it's not even an assumption. It was intended to mirror the statue in Rio. He also name-checks it in the song 'Brasil'. ("O Cristo Redentor").

It seems to me a lot of the time you measure the quality of a record by how "heavy" it is

I'm a real metalhead, I like heavy. It's not the only factor, but I usually like my metal angry and f***inkg heavy.

is that really more important than the quality of the songs

The quality of the songs is what is pleasing to one's ears. As with any music you either get it or you don't get it. I've already stated I thought old Sepultura was better than Soulfly. I don't know why your so hung up on Soulfly though. Did Max kick your dog in the balls or something? :lol:
[/quote]

Ehhh no, I was just trying to explain the Christian thing.

and the integrity of the artist?

First off what makes you think there is something wrong with Max's integrity? You may not like his current music, but that's a fry cry from integrity.

Again you're right, but I already made that distinction in my above post. I'm not sure what else I can say about that without repeating myself. The passion isn't there so he sticks to the template to keep the money rolling in regardless. Which is fine if you want to keep buying the same record.  

Secondly, I normally don't give 2 sh**s about the artists themselves. There are a few exceptions like Burzum and Metallica. They are below contempt and will not see a penny of my money. But besides that I don't care about them or their celebrity status. They make a product I like, I buy it. They make a product I don't like, I don't buy it.

Since an artist's work is ultimately an expression of themselves, I tend to place a certain amount of importance on who's creating it. (NB: I don't mean I think they are particularly important themselves, just how they express themselves.)

Generally, you can hear it in the music. You can tell when someone's not there emotionally. If that's not important to you, then that's cool. I just think angry metal sounds angrier and better when the band is actually angry. :-)

[Turambar]

I like my metal to be good as with the rest of the music i listen to.

[Turambar]

redrumloa wrote:
They are just people like anyone else. They put their pants on one leg at a time just like anyone else.

I jump into mine in mide air does that make me speshul?

[redrumloa]

Okay, you totally misunderstood my intentions, I wasn't trying to flame. You don't have to be on the offensive all the time, you know.

I wasn't trying to be on the offensive. I am opinionated though, especially when it comes to music. You should know mw by now, my posting style can be colorful at times. If I'm going for the throat, you'll know it;-)

The passion isn't there so he sticks to the template to keep the money rolling in regardless. Which is fine if you want to keep buying the same record.

You talking about the entire stretch of SoulFly's recording history or one album? If you are talking about their last album I might agree, it was weak and repetative overall. The first 2 albums were pretty good though. (just my opinion)

Generally, you can hear it in the music. You can tell when someone's not there emotionally. If that's not important to you, then that's cool. I just think angry metal sounds angrier and better when the band is actually angry.

Umm.. Don't take this wrong but are we talking about the same Max? You don't think songs like Bleed and First Commandment and Pain are angry? You know do know what the subject matter he is singing about is right?

Down on my knees
Hands stretched to heaven above
Christ this pain is hard to live with
Don't fill my heart with love
Engulf my heart with vengence
You need to see our pain
Don't fill this heart with love


That's about his son Dana who was murdered, which is the common theme of most of Soul Fly's music. Brazil is a very violent country, besides Dana they dedicate alot of it to other murdered friends.

Oh yeah, and how can you not like this?

No!
No Worship
No Bullsh**
No Muthaf***ing Hootie & The Blowfish
No F*** around
No Trust no one
No Enemies
No Redneck sh**

Hootie & the Blowfish? :roflmao:

[Speelgoedmannetje]

that_punk_guy wrote:
I've yet to be introduced to Exodus.

Exodus, movement of Jah people!
/me sings Bob Marley

[Vincent]

redrumloa wrote:
That's about his son Dana who was murdered, which is the common theme of most of Soul Fly's music. Brazil is a very violent country, besides Dana they dedicate alot of it to other murdered friends.

Sory, but technically Dana is not Max's son.  Max has two sons - Zyon and I can't remember the other one).  Dana is Gloria's from someone else.

I've managed to borrow Soulfly's 2nd album Primitive, I'll give it a listen this weekend :-)

[redrumloa]

Vincent wrote:
Sory, but technically Dana is not Max's son.  Max has two sons - Zyon and I can't remember the other one).  Dana is Gloria's from someone else.
 

Well yeah to be technical it was his step son. Regardless Max obviously took it very hard, they must have been very close. IIRC I've seen Max refer to him as his son, which most good step parents do.