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Author Topic: Existentialist question  (Read 4555 times)

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Offline Karlos

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #14 from previous page: June 12, 2005, 03:22:58 PM »
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glitch wrote:
Wait, is there such thing as military spec viagra?  HELLO!!



Of course. It gives you a ceramic-hard purple top...
int p; // A
 

Offline Lemonty

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2005, 03:50:37 PM »
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Ooooooooh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Respect My Authority!
 

Offline BigBenAussie

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2005, 04:29:48 PM »
The Amiga was(and was designed as) a kick ass console, that Commodore decided to include a keyboard and mouse to, that ran cutting edge games for the time. The OS, although very cool, was secondary. When most people think of the Amiga they think of the cool games they played, and dabbling with cool creative graphical and musical software which often hardly touched the OS.

You also have to remember that most Amiga owners never saw a beefed up Amiga, seeing Amigas mostly as A500s, and only got as far as floppies, thus they may not have had that high an impression of the OS. We seem to have forgotten that as we've kept the faith all these years. It was mostly the incredible games and demos people remember that made computing exciting. Computing has not been exciting since. IMHO the appreciation for the OS came much later when the hardware didn't advance, and the PC took over, yet you could surprisingly still do cool stuff on the AmigaOS.

We will never have cutting edge games again as we will never have the cutting edge hardware ever again or for that matter, backing from major games companies. That is unless there is a special deal with Sony or something. I'm still excited though.

The mA1 hardware is adequate, but something like CELL on it will give it the potential to be what the Amiga was before. Kick Ass. A PPC Cell chip even on an mA1, would get the Amiga hardware into the ball park of its competitors, instead of woefully behind. The Cell chip, is a custom component, that reminds one of the Amiga Custom chips. Surely, with all the add-ons in the classic Amiga market someone could figure out a way to pop one on an A1. A stack of mA1s could become a rendering farmer's dream. With the PS3 coming out in 2006, we can't hope to have an A1 equipped with one, sooner than that. But then, I doubt OS4 will be ready by then anyway.

Amiga is very much about its community of braggarts. ;-)
We need something to brag about with religous zeal, and the A1 hardware as it stands now gives us nothing, except to say.... "see how good our OS is even though it runs on out of date hardware". Well, it's gotta be better than running Win95 on a P4.

What the Amiga isn't, is AROS or UAE. It's a combination of Amiga(Tm) hardware and Amiga(Tm) software that makes an Amiga. The Amiga is a computer in the same way a Macintosh is. If AmigaOS was an 'also ran' on PCs it would die immediately, probably through piracy. Ironically, Amiga was practically synonymous with piracy in it's heyday. We need to change that this time around and support the devs, because the Amiga is really just clinging on for dear life right now.

Ok. Going back to my happy place now.
 

Offline ottomobiehl

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2005, 09:33:43 PM »
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Y'all (note second person plural) are probably sick and tired of self-important n00bs coming along every few months asking the same old tired questions...


We need all the n00bs we can get. :-D   Ask away.
 

Offline amigadave

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2005, 03:22:21 AM »
@BigBenAussie

I don't agree that Jay Miner only intended the Amiga to be a game console and that Commodore added the keyboard as an afterthought.  Jay did say on one occasion something like that he was amazed at what the Amiga community & developers had created with and/or on his Amiga.  I don't think he realized the full extent of what he had given us in the very beginning.
How are you helping the Amiga community? :)
 

Offline coldfish

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2005, 04:43:11 AM »
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What made Amiga "Amiga?" Was it hardware, software, OS, or something entirely different?


I think it was timing, Amiga stepped into the scene right when people (like me) wanted a bit more than what the 8bit systems had on offer.

Amiga delivered, and then some.  With its custom chipset it was able to leap at least a generation and a half ahead, showing us not only what the 16bit era had to offer, but also a glimpse at what the 32bit generation might hold.

I liked that you could just slot in a floppy and the machine would boot the game, no more typing in LOAD"*",8 for a start.

To be honest, most A500 owners probably never spent much time using workbench so I dont count that as a huge factor in forming Amiga impressions, if anything WB1.X was a bit bland.  Amiga was all about the eyecandy, at a time when 4bit Gfx were the norm.

For me, I doubt there will ever be that kind of perceived generational leap again.  I went from the C64 to the Amiga back when I was 16, quite simply that cant happen again.  I'm no longer that impressionalble young person for a start and I dont own a tardis.


 

Offline boing

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2005, 07:02:14 AM »

>The Amiga was(and was designed as) a kick ass console, that Commodore decided to
> include a keyboard and mouse to, that ran cutting edge games for the time. The OS,
>although very cool, was secondary.

I'm sorry this is not only incorrect, it has chronology issues.  The fact is, the Amiga was always designed to be a comprehensive full-featured system.  Both OS, interfaces and keyboard were planned  for long before CBM saved Hi-Toro (later Amiga) from Atari's loan game.  

The venture capitalists (dentists and doctors) were told they were bankrolling a games console because that's what was hot at the time.  But when you flipped the whiteboard, the rest of the diagram was there.  the team always had plans that this would be a full featured system.

>We will never have cutting edge games again as we will never have the cutting edge hardware

Negative think will get you everywhere.  And win you many friends.  ;-)

>The Cell chip, is a custom component, that reminds one of the Amiga Custom chips

Not really.  The Amiga needs to get back it's cool features, and they need to be done right.




 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2005, 01:02:25 PM »
Quote
What the Amiga isn't, is AROS or UAE.


It is for me... we can't both be right...

Offline Dan

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2005, 07:23:20 PM »
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EyeAm wrote:
Email me and I'll send you something that explains exactly what Amiga is and is about.  :-)

Let me guess 64-bit exokernel? :lol:

See what happens when ANN is down, this is going to be amusing...
Apple did it right the first time, bring back the Newton!
 

Offline Dan

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2005, 10:45:20 PM »
Quote

BigBenAussie wrote:
The Amiga was(and was designed as) a kick ass console, that Commodore decided to include a keyboard and mouse to, that ran cutting edge games for the time. The OS, although very cool, was secondary. When most people think of the Amiga they think of the cool games they played, and dabbling with cool creative graphical and musical software which often hardly touched the OS.

You also have to remember that most Amiga owners never saw a beefed up Amiga, seeing Amigas mostly as A500s, and only got as far as floppies, thus they may not have had that high an impression of the OS. We seem to have forgotten that as we've kept the faith all these years. It was mostly the incredible games and demos people remember that made computing exciting. Computing has not been exciting since.

Agreed, my "Amiga"-test would be a couple of favorite games,  DPaint, Protracker and Say. Because thats what everybody remmebers.

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IMHO the appreciation for the OS came much later when the hardware didn't advance, and the PC took over, yet you could surprisingly still do cool stuff on the AmigaOS.

MacOS X does it better, so did BeOS.
And with XP there finally is a stable Windows.
Linux-distros and BSD-variants are gratis and free.

Quote
We will never have cutting edge games again as we will never have the cutting edge hardware ever again or for that matter, backing from major games companies. That is unless there is a special deal with Sony or something.

Never is a long time.....
But whats needed is cash and nobody seems to be able to bring that home. Not since Petro retired.
Retro is in so why isn´t there an A500 DTV?
And why not do the same with the Amiga brand that Sony did with the Walkman-brand? Where is the Amiga-phone?(Preferably something better than Ngage or Gizmondo, maybe a Samsung)


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I'm still excited though.

Whatever for???

Quote
The mA1 hardware is adequate,

G3? 800Mhz? Today? To be adequate today atleast a 1Ghz+ G4 is needed not to mention that 256MB Ram is minimum today... Look at Apple, are they selling any G3s today...

Quote
but something like CELL on it will give it the potential to be what the Amiga was before. Kick Ass. A PPC Cell chip even on an mA1, would get the Amiga hardware into the ball park of its competitors, instead of woefully behind. The Cell chip, is a custom component, that reminds one of the Amiga Custom chips. Surely, with all the add-ons in the classic Amiga market someone could figure out a way to pop one on an A1. A stack of mA1s could become a rendering farmer's dream. With the PS3 coming out in 2006, we can't hope to have an A1 equipped with one, sooner than that. But then, I doubt OS4 will be ready by then anyway.

Amiga is very much about its community of braggarts. ;-)
We need something to brag about with religous zeal, and the A1 hardware as it stands now gives us nothing, except to say.... "see how good our OS is even though it runs on out of date hardware". Well, it's gotta be better than running Win95 on a P4.

Cell? Maybe...
IF we get several of them!( So what if it´s multicore, so are both Intel, AMD and Freescale CPUs gonna be in the future)
A500(custom chips), Atari Falcon(DSP) and BeBox(multi-cpu) has been the truly cool computers the last years. So what makes a computer cool(in both ways) apparently is offloading the CPU as much as possible.
One crazy idea I have had since I got my first amiga is to turn the idea of custom chips around and use the same processor for both CPU and "custom chips". Maybe thats possible with Cell?

But the way I see it the target is kids. Why are we here?
Because most of use played games and played around with Dpaint when we where between 5-16 years old.
So target the kids, our main enemy is Nintendo with Gameboy DS and the cellphones.
The second target is schools and team up with TI(they are only do worlds best calculator after all.)
So the first product should be "My first Amiga"-educational game console/computer, rugged e-book, rugged tablet, in-car enertainment system, handheld game/pda, and "My first Amiga-phone". Low-end single Cell-cpu or ARM+DSP based.
The important thing is getting the kids hooked on the Amiga-GUI and name.

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What the Amiga isn't, is AROS or UAE. It's a combination of Amiga(Tm) hardware and Amiga(Tm) software that makes an Amiga.

Funny one has the goal to imitate Amiga-hardware and the other to imitate the software(OS). It must be the (Tm);-)

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The Amiga is a computer in the same way a Macintosh is.

[/url]You mean a 3,6Ghz P4?

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If AmigaOS was an 'also ran' on PCs it would die immediately, probably through piracy. Ironically, Amiga was practically synonymous with piracy in it's heyday.

Piracy isn´t what killed Amiga, outdated hardware was.Remmeber Commodore sold hardware not software(ok, Amigavision but what else?). Has piracy killed the pc? Hell no, besides piracy is a sign of success.

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We need to change that this time around and support the devs, because the Amiga is really just clinging on for dear life right now.

"We" can´t really finance development of a kick-ass computer, looking at it from realstic p.o.v other sources of income and captial must be found.
(A totally optimist calculation: Say 5000 buyers and 1000€ in profit per board/computer thats five million Euro. Less than the large players marketing budgets..., not to mention that you start with much less to get those first 5000 buyers.)

Quote
Ok. Going back to my happy place now.

Sure, happy is good.

Apple did it right the first time, bring back the Newton!
 

Offline davide405Topic starter

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Re: Existentialist question
« Reply #24 on: June 14, 2005, 05:41:01 AM »
"'Never' and 'Forever' are neither for men.  You'll be returning again and again."

Fritz Leiber

I like to think that the combination of creative energy and hardware/software integration is not unique to any particular time/manufacturer/place.


Thanks to all (past, present, and future) for your responses to this thread.