dnetc benchmarks

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy

So I am saying MOS is good and OS4 is crap, old Apple machine is better than new X1000, because this is exactly what these threads are about.

Imho you are wrong, as all that threads about founding of truth. If used and old macs can be faster in some areas than x1000, then why not say that ? We should know truth, and i very intersting in truth.

As you can see, on some benchmarks (expectually memory ones), x1000 are cleary faster, and no one tryint to hide that details, everything just in sake of truth, to know, if it better than used macs, or not. So  users will known what they will get, and they can think what will be better for them and in terms of speed, and in terms of price.

To add, i personally was in hope, that x1000 for sure will be better in all aspects in compare with the most faster macintosh (i remember all that hype about how cool and superios new cpu in x1000 will be), but seems by some reassons the only one benefits of the x1000 : speed of RAM. In others, its about the same as macmini 1.5/powermac1.8.

Its all just forces by results that x1000 in other tests on the same level (or even slower, except RAM speed) than macs, but if that truth, then what can we do with that ?

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy

Well, to answer on questin what i will do with Truth, i can say you the whol story:

When x1000 was announcement with it madness price, i was somehow sure, that because of that price, it will kick all the maconitoshes right in the ass, and, because of that i found logical to build new platforms, in compare with make a port to good old macs.

Now, because of benchmarks, i see, that Macs are even faster in almost all the areas, except the ram speed area. So, what i will do with that truth when i know that overpriced HW which will run amigaos4, are slower than macintosh with morphos ? I will do that: when i will for real feel that i want something new and cool, i will think twice to buy a mac with morphos, or x1000 with aos4.

Sure, x1000 still interesting and fast, and it give you ability to run os4 and put radeonhd in it (let's skip all those coming soon smp , xena/xorro and co) , but in current stage, with comparing by benchmarks with tests, the price for the x1000 can be something like 1800-2000usd, and then, it can be adequate to the speed: i.e. because its new hw, because its one of fastetst with ppc cpu/os is amiga world, and because you can put any cards in it.  

PS. Did anyone want to sale x1000 mb + cpu for 1000$ ? I will be intersted in

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy

If one can afford it and want OS4 and Linux then save the cash and buy it otherwise it's just a sign that we are here to discredit a product for the hell of it.

Imho no. We all there in benchmark threads not because we want discredit or credit any kind of product. I, as end user not so care in credits or discredits. We just comparing the HW available for aos4 and for mos. There is nothing bad or wrong to say truth if something is slow, the same as there is nothing bad or wrong to say truth if something is fast.

For now its clear, that the real pluse of x1000 : the speed of working with memory. No one hide it, and everyone found it good. But in other areas its on the same level as old macs (sometime a bit better, like with case of mplayer, sometime worse, like in case with lames and dcnet benchs).

Potential users should know the truth. That all about it. Nothing about discredit or credit. Pure technical interest in case of found the truth and so everyone should know what faster, what slower, where, what pluses and minuses, to make the final and pragmatic decission when user will in interest to make a choice.

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy
Wawa just tryint to point, that we all can have such kind of problems, when we almost sure that something will be done, tons of problems and millions of factors arise which are stop the result. Because of that some of us found funny how other ones are believe that smp will be done 100%. Of course it possible in some form, of course Hyperion mostly do what they say, but in opposite, there is a lot of problems, resources, time and as well as from the past its wellknown that even good companies die after their good announcement about "one more week". I even not add about plans about workbench rewrite (in year 2006 or when it was said), about Nova, and whateve relse, what never come.

Thats why some of us call all that SMP fantasy: not because it can't be done, sure in one or in another form it can be done (everything possible, if only .. ) But be in hope that it will done, its already rulete. Maybe will, maybe not. Plans can keeps as plans, promises as only promises. Knowing also the current situation with all of this amiga stuff around, no one can expect that something radical will be done soon. Good if it, but i really doubt.

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy

than a recycled, second hand, discarded old apple product.

But you for first can't buy x1000 now (all those contacts-shmontacs, first-second bunches, preorders only via mails, etc), and for second its also will be second hand, discarded and old soon

[kas1e]

@TheDaddy

Surely it will be second hand one day but hopefully the OS4 community won't have to rely on stuff handed down the line by apple.

I do not know to be honest. Imho skipping supporting of already good hw (yes its old and second handed, but still its prove to be good, g4 and g5 are fine cpus) a bit irrational. I mean that for sure, x1000 can be solds over the true amiga fanatics, but what next ? Most ppls for sure will choice cheaper solutions if they firstly will come to amigaworld and just comparing available ways. But (imho again) hyperion kind of in interst to sold more copies of os4, and then, macs will help with it as well. Anyone who want "non second hand, brand new, uniq amigaos4 hw only" can by x1000 for 3000$, but those who want "second hand, old and discarded" macs for 300-500$, which kind of the same by speed if we check the benchmarks, can buy them. Bigger choice, more users, everyone win.  Fanatics can spend a lot of money to x1000, pragmatics or who can't or do not want to spend a lot of money, can spend less for macs.

For me its just sound irrational to not support macs, and i think, that the real purpose of not doing this, its that "morphos do it already". I even read somethere in the forums back in time, how one of brothers say "and new netbook are new ! not used mac hw! ". I.e. like it make any differences, while its wellknown that netbook are just old lime. Just kind of irrational, and sounds indeed like mac-mos-fobia.

At the moment we are safe in the knowledge that we can buy brand new OS4 machines which are well supported by their manufacturers, see ACube for example.

Acube for sure deserve a credit. They never hold the truth, they open, they fix their board if something going wrong, they write a drivers and release it without waiting for os updates, that all point to them as to adequate persons. Sadly we can't say the same about everything in amiga world

[kas1e]

Let's just be happy someone even bothers to make new hardware for the Amiga market...

That just wrong. If there is enough cheap and good old hw (like macs with g4/g5) there is no point in making new hardware unless it will be faster _a lot_ , and "a bit" more cost in compare with other solutions.  

X1000 in end of all , after 2 years of spending time and resources on it, mean about the same speed as macs, a lot higher price, no drivers for every onboard device, no support for that absolutly, and tottally unnecessary xena crap about what there was so much fuzz. Why, why all of this should be so irrational and unlogical when all is coming to aos4 and hw for it ? From one side, everyone cry we need more users and more developers, from another, such kind of strange moves in irrational directions. Only fanatics will buy overpriced hw, which by speed the same as macs, but fanatics will not help OS to grow up => no users/developers => 10 years for implementing single piece of change.

[kas1e]

When will it finally sink in to you, that neither of these are/will be/*can be* an alternative for most people, that for most people, there is *nothing* in the "OS4 world" to move on to?

There can be some "move on to", if only macs ports, then x86 migration, but for that need a lot of developers and time, but year by year user and developers base only shrink. Sometime it can looks like not all that bad, and there is some new users and devs, but in compare how many leave because of all that irrational stuff ..

This isn't a solution, it's a road to death of the OS4 platform. I guess you will notice once you get there. Or then again, maybe not...

The answer is: