Pros and Cons of Amithlon type systems

[Franko]

@ CommodoreJohn

There was some stuff about it in the old magazines before they all disappeared at the start of the century, it was basically just another emulator to run on x86 hardware but if I recall correctly at the time the prices you'd have to pay to get all the kit together and up and running put it into the world of La, La Land...

Don't even think it could handle the custom chipset emulation very well so almost all games & demos were a no go on it. Always seemed to me from what I read about it, a pretty pointless exercise to tell the truth...

[Franko]

I skipped over Amithons heyday and got into it later, but I'm very interested in it.

Would you still use something similar?

What would a modern version need to change?

In answer to your questions, I can only say this...

Would you still use something similar... No, simply because I don't see these "alternative" OS's on x86 hardware or whatever being anything to do with the real Amiga experience...

To me if I really wanted to run modern day software then I could just buy such software for my iMacs or buy a PC, either way it would be a lot cheaper than paying for a custom made Amiga like OS and hardware that will most likely not match the equivalent of a modern day PC...

As to "What would a modern version need to change?"... again I just don't see why folk would want an Amiga on x86 hardware with all the problems & flaws it would involve and never achieving anywhere close to being like using a real Amiga...

The NatAmi with it's extra ports & gfx modes to me is the only real hope we have of ever achieving an Amiga that new stuff can be written for, to bring it that bit closer to "modern day computing" while being the most backward compatible system possible at the same time...

[Franko]

The last time I ran Amithlon, it ran circles around any emulator on the same hardware. I loved it!

But what did it emulate if it couldn't handle the custom chipsets properly... :confused:

[Franko]

A shit load! Pretty much anything AHI and RTG friendly. Quake for instance absolutely flew on my old Amithlon machine. And considering that there are unofficial updates for it, I have considered building another machine just for it until AROS gets its ass out of the Alpha stage.

That's hardly a sh!t load...

Thing is like CommodoreJohn said there isn't much info to be found on the net about it, last stuff I ever read about it was around 2003 on the monthly CD Magazine "100% Amiga", But it's was mostly stuff about it being in trouble and heading for the realms of the land that time forgot...

Anywhere on the net where folk can find more info about it and see just how far it was developed before it disappeared..

[Franko]

Seems from what people have been saying here and from the links XDelusion gave that Amithlon was somewhere along the right tracks when it comes to Amiga emulators (all be it running only "System Friendly software)...

Been digging around the old CD magazine "100% Amiga" and there are quite a few interesting reviews/ news items about Amithlon on them, sadly though it seems to have gone (like most things Amiga) belly up...  which leaves me wondering just what Amithlon could have become had it not been struck down by the Amiga curse...

A couple of news items on Amithlon from 100%Amiga CD Magazine (Jan/Feb 2003)

[Franko]

Bernie got so screwed in that situation.

It's a shame, he's an awesome developer and has great ideas.  Plus he's just too nice to have that happen to him.  Where is karma when you need it?

Sadly it seems to be the norm for anyone trying to develop either software or hardware in Amigaland...

Sometimes wonder why there has been so much of this type of behaviour in the Amiga's history, is it greed or just plain pettiness or do Amiga developers just not like to see someone else producing something better than their own project... shame really...

[Franko]

These old 100% Amiga CD's are a treasure trove of interesting old news snippets...

[Franko]

Take a look at: http://www.garycvl.f2s.com/amithlon.html

Thank's for that...

Just had a quick look and I'll read it all later. Been quite interesting finding out about Amithlon (especially some of the stuff on the old 100% Amiga Cds)...

From what I've learned about it so far it was a very promising system that met an untimely end...

[Franko]

My thoughts on what needs to be done.

1) Remove OS3.9 from Amithlon and replace it with 68k AROS parts.
2) Re-Compile the various parts of AROS in a piecemeal fashion using the 686-BE compiler, until there is little to none 68k code left.
3) Convince Bernie to release the code to Amithlon/Umilator or write a clone from scratch.
4) The community profits!

:eek: that's one of the very things that has made me very interested and change my view of Amithlon I had at the beginning of this thread, that fact that it runs on OS3.9...

It would be crazy to get rid of it for something that's not even finished yet...

[Franko]

Removing the original OS would be a bad idea at first.

1. Then why not just run AROS?
2. Compatibility with old apps wouldn't be good
3. You're just going the AROS route again with 3.1 on x86.

I was looking at something more like:
Take a more advanced OS that matches well, say Haiku.
Get Amithlon working on this rather than Linux.
Make use of ClassicWB or other distribution and the users own ROM.

You could start releasing right here.

Amithlon would become more of a UI than the OS, like early Windows or XWindows.
Instead of peeking through a keyhole with special x86 extensions, expose the underlying OS to AmigaOS.
Make use of AROS code to slowly integrate them better making Haiku more Amiga like and AOS more native, eventually negating the need for ROMS, etc that can't be distributed.

Part of my reasoning is that Haiku is more of a spiritual successor than most other OS's, but is far more advanced.
It has SMP, memory protection, virtual memory, datatypes, responsive UI, it's multi-media centric and has a good selection of drivers.  It also boots to a usable desktop in 8 seconds. (not counting BIOS crap that can't be helped)

Anyway, that's what has been kicking around in my head.

That's the right way to go I reckon, don't get why people would want to get rid of 3.x compatibility and go another route... :confused:

Seems from what I've learned in this short time about Amithlon it's whole purpose was to be as 3.x compatible as possible which to me is what would make it so good...

I hope you go ahead with this as I reckon your onto something here...

PS: I see the usual idiots who lurk around here but are too afraid to say anything have started a thread on PooBunny dissing your idea, gawd what a sad bun of tards some of these tubes are... :rolleyes:

PooBunny Wahoos Gibber About Amithlon

[Franko]

While we're on this subject, can someone please post a list of compattible hardware for amithlon? I tried some time ago but it didn't like any machine I tried to put it on, and I tried older era pcs (800-1500mhz)
 
I think alot like aros, you need a certain video, sound and network card to get it going easily. I have a few old pcs around and I'd be interested in giving it a go.
 
I have a couple of amithlon iso's around still.
 
Steven

Nearly-Right already posted a link a few pages back with that info...

http://www.garycvl.f2s.com/amithlon.html

[Franko]

Franko,
 
That info is for an updated kernel. First, you need to install and get the system working before you can update the kernel.
 
I'm interested in what hardware the original amithlon cd supported, which I have a copy of but no docs, or hw supported info for.
 
Steven

Click on the links on that page and it takes you to compatible motherboards etc..

Thought that was the info you were looking for... :confused:

I'm pretty sure there was quite an extensive review of the original hardware done on one of the 100%Amiga CDs I was looking through yesterday but I think they are in the old magazines format of IFF ILBM files and not the HTML type I posted earlier (which 100%Amiga changed to later)...

I'll have a look through the CDs and see if I can convert any Amithlon stuff that will allow me to post them here...

[Franko]

@ stefcep2

I agree with you that 3.9 is the slowest but curious as to why you think 3.5 is "less stable"...

I run 3.5 all the time and never have any problems with it on my Blizzard060 or 030 boards be interested to know what problems you seem to have found with 3.5...

I simply use some small scripts with 3.0 & 3.1 ROM Images and BlizKick for switching between OS 3. to 3.9 and a small script file that switches me to OS4.0 if I want to use it and it only take a quick double reset to do so...

Best way I find to do it is to have each version of Workbench stored simply in a separate drawer (ie: 3.0,  3.1,  3.5 and 3.9) and some small scripts that reset the Amiga (with BlickKick if I need to go between the 3.0 & 3.1 ROMS) and a small util I wrote that selects the chosen OS on reset by simply holding down the appropriate function key...