X-Copy and dongle

[KidIce]

I have a couple of original floppies that I'd like to take a backup of. These games and programs are getting old and I don't want end up with bad disks that is unusable. Some of the games include Turrican II, Pinball Dreams, Pinball Fantasies, Civilization, Deluxe Paint III and Workbench.

There is this issue about copy protection. If I understand it correctly, an Amiga disk can contain up to 80 tracks(cylinders?). The internal drive is capable of writing 80 tracks but can read up 82 tracks. It was common for game disks to place data on track 81 and 82 where it was hard for disk copier to create and exact copy. Is this correct?

I figure out that the best way to do the backup is to get an external disk drive for my A500 and use X-Copy. X-Copy seems to have been released into the public domain which is good. I've seen a dongle that can be used with an external drive when running X-Copy. I have seen schematics for this dongle and if this is needed for copying I can make my own.

Another solution would be to create disk images and transfer them to the PC for storage. However, I do not know how to create disk images or how to write them back to disk. Or if this would work on copy protected games.

Ok, that was a bit of background and what I have been able to find out so far. To sum it up, these are the questions I have:

1. What does this dongle do and is this needed for copying?

2. What version of X-Copy should I use and does this version support the dongle?

3. Will X-Copy 'defeat' the copy protection so I actually will have a perfect backup of my floppies?

4. Is there any good floppy images program that can be used to create backups on copy protected games that can later be written back to floppies?

Thank you for your help.

Almost any copier designed for copying protected disks can write to the extended tracks, and so will DMS, the old Amiga default disk imager, if your drive will. Every Amiga floppy drive I have ever had has been able to write to extended tracks, but others have reported they they cannot w/ thiers.

The problem w/ Turrican 2 is not extended tracks, but the fact that it uses long track copy protection. Long tracks have more data written to them than is normal for a standard Amiga format. This is why some cracked versions of long track protected games came on more disks than the legitimate copies.

IIRC Paula can generate 4 timing clicks, one of which can be used to read all long tracks but none of which can be used to write all of them. Certain software-only solutions had marginal success w/ long tracks (NiB comes to mind, as it could write a successful back up of Robocod which only protected the first track or two w/ long track protection) as long as their use was limited to certain "sweet" cylinders. If the entire disk was written in long tracks, however, extra hardware was always needed to generate a timing click that could write them... This is what that dongle should be for.

I have used Sybil, Super Card Ami 2 and Synchro Express. I have never used X-Copy w/ it's dongle or Maverick w/ it's "Back-up Buddy" drive so I can not attest to how well they do. If I were searching for a solution right now though, I would seek out a Synchro Express (I still have a Sybil, BTW).

A Sybil can be used to make an image of your protected disk, but the software was never fully completed and writing it back is iffy at best. You can also make an image w/ CAPS ipf imager, but you will not be able to write them back to disks later and IPF images are often FAR larger than the original disk. IPF images are usable in UAE, BTW, so they do have their value.

Hope this helps.

[KidIce]

I have a couple of original floppies that I'd like to take a backup of. These games and programs are getting old and I don't want end up with bad disks that is unusable. Some of the games include Turrican II, Pinball Dreams, Pinball Fantasies, Civilization, Deluxe Paint III and Workbench.

There is this issue about copy protection. If I understand it correctly, an Amiga disk can contain up to 80 tracks(cylinders?). The internal drive is capable of writing 80 tracks but can read up 82 tracks. It was common for game disks to place data on track 81 and 82 where it was hard for disk copier to create and exact copy. Is this correct?

I figure out that the best way to do the backup is to get an external disk drive for my A500 and use X-Copy. X-Copy seems to have been released into the public domain which is good. I've seen a dongle that can be used with an external drive when running X-Copy. I have seen schematics for this dongle and if this is needed for copying I can make my own.

Another solution would be to create disk images and transfer them to the PC for storage. However, I do not know how to create disk images or how to write them back to disk. Or if this would work on copy protected games.

Ok, that was a bit of background and what I have been able to find out so far. To sum it up, these are the questions I have:

1. What does this dongle do and is this needed for copying?

2. What version of X-Copy should I use and does this version support the dongle?

3. Will X-Copy 'defeat' the copy protection so I actually will have a perfect backup of my floppies?

4. Is there any good floppy images program that can be used to create backups on copy protected games that can later be written back to floppies?

Thank you for your help.

Almost any copier designed for copying protected disks can write to the extended tracks, and so will DMS, the old Amiga default disk imager, if your drive will. Every Amiga floppy drive I have ever had has been able to write to extended tracks, but others have reported they they cannot w/ thiers.

The problem w/ Turrican 2 is not extended tracks, but the fact that it uses long track copy protection. Long tracks have more data written to them than is normal for a standard Amiga format. This is why some cracked versions of long track protected games came on more disks than the legitimate copies.

IIRC Paula can generate 4 timing clicks, one of which can be used to read all long tracks but none of which can be used to write all of them. Certain software-only solutions had marginal success w/ long tracks (NiB comes to mind, as it could write a successful back up of Robocod which only protected the first track or two w/ long track protection) as long as their use was limited to certain "sweet" cylinders. If the entire disk was written in long tracks, however, extra hardware was always needed to generate a timing click that could write them... This is what that dongle should be for.

I have used Sybil, Super Card Ami 2 and Synchro Express. I have never used X-Copy w/ it's dongle or Maverick w/ it's "Back-up Buddy" drive so I can not attest to how well they do. If I were searching for a solution right now though, I would seek out a Synchro Express (I still have a Sybil, BTW).

A Sybil can be used to make an image of your protected disk, but the software was never fully completed and writing it back is iffy at best. You can also make an image w/ CAPS ipf imager, but you will not be able to write them back to disks later and IPF images are often FAR larger than the original disk. IPF images are usable in UAE, BTW, so they do have their value.

Hope this helps.

Edit: After looking at the Kryoflux, and if this is the brainchild of who I think it is, I would definitely search out that over any other hardware copier previously released for the Amiga.

[KidIce]

Sorry, Jim, I don't mean to pick on your product or you. But that has not been the experience I've had w/ my SYBIL.

I had a Supercard in my C=1541 and a Supercard Ami 2 on my Amiga's floppies... They worked well for me, the SYBIL? Not so much.

I do not recall how, when or whom told me that the SYBIL software was incomplete, but at the time it made sense. In my experience, it was great for reading/writing Mac DD disks, but for copy protected Amiga disks, not so much. I had complete faith in the device itself based on its design andn your history, so the fact that it wasn't working as well as advertised meshed well w/ the "immature software" info I was fed.

When I got my SYBIL for my Emplant and to archive my protected Amiga disks (and ditch my other hardware copiers)... I found it to be great for reading Mac disks, imaging Amiga disks (protected or not) but not so great at writing back a usable copy on a DD floppy or even an HD floppy w/ its HD hole covered. "Don't call me if you are not using HD disks." My "obsolete" SCA2 was better at making reliable protected Amiga back ups than my SYBIL was. Again, I knew the Sybil was superior so it had to be the software.

Do you happen to have the last release of that software? I'm pretty sure that I do not have it, and I would very much like to.

At some point Utilities Unlimited disappeared as far as I could tell and my SYBIL still could not write back many of the images I had made w/ it. I assumed that the rumors were true and that it's software was incomplete. My above statement was apparently wrong and I apologize... But I'd still like the latest version of the SYBIL software. :-)