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Author Topic: Genesi: "Gladiateur" website online  (Read 4137 times)

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Offline AndrewKorn

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Re: Genesi: "Gladiateur" website online
« on: October 23, 2003, 02:41:08 AM »
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I just hope that they don't do that stupid "thumbs up to live, thumbs down to die" bit that's total bunk.


Actually there's a lot of debate about this - as far as I know all the contemporary writers were simply too unspecific about this for us to be sure exactly what the ritual was. I guess they assumed their readers would all be familiar with the process.  It doesn't help that fashions changed throughout the history of gladiatorial combat either.

As you state, there are various references to the "turned thumb" as the method the crowd uses to indicate they want to see a death, but it's not clear what this means.  Other gestures are mentioned, such as pressing the thumbs together or holding the thumb in the fist, which are indications of approval. Another was to jab the thumb upwards towards the heart, to indicate death, and this may well have given rise to  the idea that thumbs up meant death.

Reversing that gesture to thumbs up for life (and by logical extension thumbs down for death) is thought to have originated with  a 19th century painter, although I can't for the life of me remember who.
 

Offline AndrewKorn

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Re: Genesi: "Gladiateur" website online
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2003, 04:04:12 AM »
That looks like the one, ta.

I also notice it shows a Thracian (probably the type of gladiator Spartacus was) having defeated a Retiarius, an unlikely scenario. Thraex were usually pitted against heavily armoured gladiators of the Hoplomachus / Myrmillo type.
 

Offline AndrewKorn

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Re: Genesi: "Gladiateur" website online
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2003, 05:52:26 AM »
@downix

Worse, they had action figures. No kidding! You could buy little ceramic models of top gladiators in action poses.

@KennyR

Nobody's really sure how much death there was - but remember that these were shows put on to prove the power and wealth of the sponsor, so in some cases a lot of people DID die, expensive or not.  

The origin of gladiatorial combat was a funereal ritual combat to the death, and the concept of sacrificial death appears to have been important throughout the history of the games. However it became an entertainment industry, and the biggest stars became just too valuable to kill - although we do hear of Emperor Commodus having the victor in a combat killed because he claimed such a good fighter would make a really great sacrifice (it was more likely jealousy - Commodus was a very nasty man). Certainly if the top gladiators often survived, there were always cheaper slaves with little popularity or expensive training who could be killed. In some of the massive spectaculars, the death toll was in 4 figures.

Fatality rates aren't known - estimates vary wildly. I think we can assume that for top gladiators it would be around  5%, while there were other gladiators who were basically trained as victims for the famous gladiators, for whom the rate might have been 50% or so. What the average was is anybody's guess.