Hyperion bankrupt?

[eliyahu]

@thread

magnetic brings up a good point. let's try and stay on topic. ancient history about camp wars are off-topic. and, er, so are discussions on late-model japanese sports cars.

if you guys want, you're welcome to start other threads, but let's keep this thread focused on hyperion and its current predicament, please. thanks.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

3) Meaning there can't be any paid employees at all, and nothing else that cost money. "Managing Director" this, "Director Legal" that, fulltime employed developers, etc, etc. Bull%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@! and lies!

this is both insulting and incorrect.

4) The Friedens faded out of the picture after OS4.1.2 release (court documents from Amiga Inc <-> Hyperion trials showed us that Hyperion owned them something in the line of two millions if memory serves me right), as did many (all?) others, replaced by "ssolie" who *never* was a real employee (but fancy made up titles)...

this is both insulting and incorrect.

Why does he, who has had full insight in Hyperion dealings, feel the need to "fend off any calls to his liability" from official and non official organizations, one might wonder? Why is he so eager to have sufficient legal proof that he is no longer a partner and no longer liable?

and this is just plain trolling. the rest of your post is fine, though. :hammer:

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Remember, all we're doing is speculating. Let's save the definitive statements for later, shall we?

absolutely. there are certain people here who want to see hyperion fail, so they do everything to make it appear they have done. there are certain people here who want to see hyperion succeed, so they do everything to make it appear this is just a minor blip.

either way -- the only people who actually know anything for certain are the belgian courts, the receiver, mr. hermans and mr. de groote, and whomever filed the claim in the first place. everybody else is just guessing based on scant evidence. i highly suggest we wait and see what happens, both with hyperion and AOS4 development.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

sorry but it sounds like the most dumb excuse one could come up with. im pretty sure the bankruptcy procedure doesnt just get started with a single bill paid a bit too late, as it seems to be suggested here and mindlessly repeated forever. the problems and the behaviour must have been notorious and therefore even if complete liquidation could be avoided this time it suggests it can happen again any other day soon. it definitely is an indication that the company is in very poor state. that means that any (further) investments will likely be lost. and i am not only speaking of money but also of feelings and contributions.

yeah, i thought the same initially, but then i looked into it with an attorney friend of mine. turns out that ben's story might not be so fishy after all. if he uses an agent for regulatory purposes -- someone who receives official mail, handles tax matters, etc. -- then it's possible that the notice was sent to said address and someone forgot to forward it along. yeah, i know that sounds a little unlikely, but it's possible.

as for being declared insolvent, that's a default judgement. if a creditor steps forward saying that they've submitted a bill a certain number of times, and there's no response, the court starts an inquiry. and if no response is given they can be declared insolvent and bankruptcy proceedings start. but they can still stand up after the fact (at least until the final report is issued) and say, no, we are alive and we can pay the bill, and then everything is overturned.

so it does seem like something from bizarro world, but ben may not be pulling our leg after all. a scenario like this is indeed possible. anyhoo -- the final report is due out in mid-march. so if it's real that hyperion is insolvent we'll know then. and if not, we should know prior to that. the one thing they can't overturn, though, is the potential loss of business this has all caused or the potential damage to their partners. so if it is indeed an issue of someone not forwarding official mail to ben, that 'oversight' has been a damn costly one.

personally since i don't have any money invested with them, i'm not bothered one way or another except that if it is true, then that's very sad for those involved and i feel bad for them. i'd also be worried about where AOS development would go from there, but only the future will tell. this is just a hobby for me, so i'm not terribly worked up about it. i'd recommend that to others, by the way.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

you have no money invested in them? i thought you have a 3000$  computer dedicated to run system they provide? well, if this is nothing,  then i envy you.

no, i don't have a $3000 system dedicated to  running AOS. but even if i did it's not an 'investment,' it's a purchase  of a consumable item. i also have blackberries, two cars, and some  lovely new dishes. they're not an investment either.  

this dosnt mean, it is likely. look, a secretary that doesnt  immediately froward the most significant writing, one that contains the  company to be or not to be clause, to his boss must be either nuts or  ill willed. a boss that hires such an employee must be at least very  naive, sorry. it is really telling about the degraded state of affairs.

it  certainly doesn't speak well for the agent, no. i'd expect they've been  sacked after this -- again, assuming the story is true, which i tend to  think it is.

and especially seeing the issue is serious, one of they first  steps towards the community, if they care for them and their loyalty at  all, would be to issue official explanation note on the subject, rather  than let their followers repeat out of context what they posted or said  somewhere in the hidden.

absolutely! you couldn't be more correct here.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Well, that is one opinion.

Even if all this negativism is true (which IMHO it is speculative at best), the Amiga in concept and form has survived.

[New dishes are great too; milch fleisch parve pesach, its all good]

agreed. oh, and they're for shabbos, so fleisch.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Less and less people buy into OS4 and when asked for reasons why they blame it on the other NG OS'es

name five.

in year 2015 people can't justify 3000 euros for average computer hardware so the user base can only shrink. It has became a rich mans hobby.

at least 200 people disagree. and the X1000 isn't 3000EUR. oh, and for the record, i bought my first system for less than $600. my next machine was only $400. that may be expensive in your eyes, but it wasn't in mine. please don't take your feelings, project them on everyone else, and then draw false conclusions.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

it is a hobby for all of us and people spend lots of money on hobbies, it is a matter of interest and available resources. I "overjumped" the PPC time so for me PPC is just another platform and has no special meaning. Others prefer AmigaOS or MorphOS just because of that so we will always have different views on it.

exactly. it's just a hobby, and we each have our own ways to enjoy it. well said.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

O_o  Seriously?   And yet you don't see the problem here?   I'm sorry but how likely do you think someone is to develop new software for a user base of 200?

i was just talking about X1000 users, which is what the post i was replying referred. the AOS4 user base is larger, but of course you're right. it is unlikely for most of the outside world to care about a user base of only a few thousand. which is why, i think anyway, A-EON is working on developing as many amiga software titles as possible -- to get the much larger base of people from the 68k days back on-board. just a guess, though.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

question so what is the official news?  

is A-eon buying Hyperion?

no.

and as for OS4.1,  is Final release (THE FINAL END)?

no.

I'm very confused.

after the determined FUD campaign by a few folks around the forums, i'm not surprised. so let my try and help: hyperion is not genuinely bankrupt, but there was an initial decree due to a variety of circumstances (you can find the details from ben hermans over on AWN). they will be demonstrating solvency to the belgian courts to overturn the initial decree in the coming weeks. AOS4 development continues. AOS 4.2 is still under active development.

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Excuse for what? I need no excuse I'm done with it been done with it since 2005

and lecturing us on why ever since. :lol:

-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Seems silly but would you like links?  

my bluff has been called! :lol:

it's ok. i'll take your word for it, although if you have any examples handy, that'd be great. i honestly had a hard time believing people would be so childish as to drop something they liked because someone else said something they didn't like. oh well. to each their own.


-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

They Are Bankrupt: legally, factually, in a business sense: business operations are suspended and they have been declared bankrupt.

They are attempting to appeal against the ruling, we'll see how that goes.

Stop lying. Stop trying to warp reality: Hyperion are bankrupt. Any fool with an internet connection can prove it with current legal documents.

easy there, big fella. i'm not trying to warp anything at all. i'm just repeating my understanding of things: according to a friend of mine who actually is an attorney in france (and is familiar with how things work in belgium), the declaration does not mean the company is actually insolvent. a final report has to be issued first. but even if that wasn't the case, if i'm incorrect on the facts, then i stand corrected.


let's see how this turns out, shall we? if it turns out that in mid-march the final court decision is that hyperion is insolvent, by all means say 'i told you so.' i'm not taking any of this seriously, and i highly suggest others don't either.


-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

Sorry dude, just makes me react to see people not only accepting and repeating Ben's assertions, but actually embellishing and rephrasing it as the de facto state of affairs when this is in opposition to the legal reality.

Again, apologies for the strong language.

no problem. i didn't believe ben, either, by the way. that's why i asked. my understanding was that basically the trustee at this point can plan to do whatever they please with the assets, but if other creditors file against planned actions or the directors themselves demonstrate solvency, then things change. plus the directors can appeal directly to the court to overturn the decree prior to the issuance of the final report. but they had better hurry because the trustee can start running things if they really wanted to.

gotta say the 'dog ate my homework thing' from ben sounded absurd, but it's possible. unlikely and demonstrative of a terrible third-party administrative agent, but possible. anyway -- i'm curious to see how things end up. depending on who the 'creditors' are, hey, a bankruptcy might be a force for good, as evert has stated over on AWN. we'll see.


-- eliyahu

[eliyahu]

@eliyahu
in that case why are you constantly calling people trolls and spreading fud for what you admit yourself?

i didn't call anyone a troll. if anyone was trolling, they'd be contacted via PM.


-- eliyahu