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Author Topic: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!  (Read 6550 times)

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Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« on: May 29, 2004, 02:13:11 PM »
Why do there have to be a tonne of different ways to install software on Linux?  I'm trying to install VLC (www.videolan.org) on Mandrake Linux 10 and it's being a real brainache.

Just port Amiga's Installer to Linux, get everyone to use that, provide a command line version as well to keep 'those' people happy, and all this pointless stress doesn't have to happen!
 

Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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Re: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2004, 06:00:18 PM »
Just about all of them are great when they work, it's when they don't, which is pretty often, that it becomes a real pain.

I couldn't find VLC in Mandrake 10's software install/update system.
 

Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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Re: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2004, 10:06:37 PM »
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Take a look at EasyURPMI for setting up urpmi to access the most important repositories. You'll want the "10.0 official" and the "main", "contrib", "update" and "plf" repositories as a minimum. Once you've got these set up urpmi works very nicely indeed.


Now for what I guess must be a stupid question - why isn't this done by default?

- edit - VLC still won't install.  It gets much longer through the process, dying at "some package requested could not be installed: vlc.....i386 (due to unsatisfied libdv[=>0.99]) (Y/n) Y

Bang.  Head.  Against.  Desk.

One other amusing thing about attempting to install Linux distros on my PC - I've gone through quite a few, and some of them failed on IDE detection.  When attempting again to install Mandrake I wondered whether the APIC might be having anything to do with it, so I disabled it, then IDE detection went fine.  I now do a dmesg and find that it re-enables the APIC on linux boot.  Go figure.

- edit 2 - I've written an article about my adventures with Linux so far: http://www.mikeymike.org.uk/mikes/040529.html
 

Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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Re: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2004, 09:53:20 AM »
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bhoggett wrote:
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mikeymike wrote:
Now for what I guess must be a stupid question - why isn't this done by default?

It is. By default urpmi is set up to recognise all the packages supplied on the CD/DVD distribution.

Oh, you mean why isn't it configured to download stuff off the net?

Two reasons: (a) the mirrors are not maintained by Mandrake, so they cannot be resposible for their availability and (b) not everyone lives in the same place. Pointing everyone to a set of default mirrors would make those mirrors unusable pretty sharpish, specially straight after the release of a new version.


Then ask a locale question and configure it like that.  And Linux isn't maintained by Mandrake either, so "they cannot be responsible for that either", nor is X, OpenOffice, Mozilla, etc, etc.


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- edit - VLC still won't install.  It gets much longer through the process, dying at "some package requested could not be installed: vlc.....i386 (due to unsatisfied libdv[=>0.99]) (Y/n) Y

I can't help you there, as I don't have enough info. I've just run through the same procedure and it installed version 0.7.2 from plf just fine. It first asks me to choose one of the GUI front ends (I chose kvlc) and then downloads 7 dependencies, including the front end. I can only assume that it may have failed to download one of those dependencies, but in that case you'd have had some other error messages along the way.

Ok, how did you ask it nicely to install vlc? :-)


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Bang.  Head.  Against.  Desk.

Which one won?  ;-)


Linux.  I conceded and booted back into Windows.

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One other amusing thing about attempting to install Linux distros on my PC - I've gone through quite a few, and some of them failed on IDE detection.  When attempting again to install Mandrake I wondered whether the APIC might be having anything to do with it, so I disabled it, then IDE detection went fine.  I now do a dmesg and find that it re-enables the APIC on linux boot.  Go figure.

The bare-bones kernel loaded for the installation procedure isn't the same as the full kernel installed for you to run linux. I have to admit I haven't had this problem.


Reminds me of NT4 and having to slip it the NT4 SP4 IDE driver to get it to recognise large IDE disks :-)
 

Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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Re: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2004, 01:42:23 PM »
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bhoggett wrote:
mikeymike wrote:
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Then ask a locale question and configure it like that.  And Linux isn't maintained by Mandrake either, so "they cannot be responsible for that either", nor is X, OpenOffice, Mozilla, etc, etc.

That's not the same thing. While the various applications aren't maintained by Mandrake they are packaged, tested and released by them or though them as far as the mdk rpms are concerned. So Mandrake have some control.

The mirrors are completely independent and can disappear any time and without warning or notification to Mandrake. If they were pre-configured, then Mandrake would have to field all the irate users' complaints when mirror X turns out not to work straight after they install their system.


As opposed to "all the irate users' complaints" that the system doesn't work in the first place?  Mandrake's own software update system can take care of maintaining the independent update source list.

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Ok, how did you ask it nicely to install vlc? :-)

I opened up a shell. I typed "su -" then followed it with my root password when prompted, then I typed "urpmi vlc". It came back giving me a whole list of front end packages to choose from. I chose kvlc. Then it gave me a list of packages that it needed to install to satisfy the dependencies, and asked me if that was OK. I said "y".


Hmm, I tried that, but the usual "dependency, dependency, sod off" occurred.  Next time I boot into Linux I'll paste the exact errors.

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Alternatively, you can start the software installer, search for vlc, select all the packages that have vlc 0.7.2 in them (the dependancies will be selected automatically) and install. This will install all the front-ends and plug-ins too.

If you mean the Mandrake Control Centre, VLC isn't listed in the search IIRC.

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It could be that you are missing a repository from your urpmi config, or it could be that something is conflicting. However, it's hard for me to diagnose the problem from the information you've given me.


I'll paste the urpmi config command I use next time, and try a few different options.

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Reminds me of NT4 and having to slip it the NT4 SP4 IDE driver to get it to recognise large IDE disks :-)

Except that in this case it must be something specific to your hardware, as I've never come across it. With NT4, it was not a surprising thing really when you consider the amount of time between NT4 being released and SP4 coming out.

No, it wasn't, but the business of allowing the APIC to work after the install is just over-complicating the process.  The installer should support everything possible and provide the resulting OS installation with the same capabilities.

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AmigaOS wasn't exactly devoid of hard disk size problems either as hardware advanced and the OS became more and more obsolete. Suddenly you'd need to install all sort of patches and third party filing systems just to make your hardware usable.

It would have been the same for x86 had it lingered in computer limbo for the amount of time the Amiga has, but it hasn't.  APICs are pretty standard nowadays, my motherboard is over two years old.
 

Offline mikeymikeTopic starter

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Re: port Amiga's Installer to Linux! End the pain!
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2004, 04:27:37 PM »
Apologies for my attitude.  Just that every time I think about trying to solve the software installation problem, my blood starts to boil again...

Grr.