PS3 security is "epic fail"

[AmigaNG]

I have to say I dont like the attitude on here, of them coders and off other sites towards Sony, they make the ps3 its their product so they get to decide what should and shouldn't be allowed on it, if you don't like it, dont support them and get your self a cheap Linux box for all your home brew you could ask for.  
 

 One the main reason I have not got a apple product, like the iphone or an ipad is because of its controlling nature and not allow flash and other things, shore I could buy their product and get it hacked to allow me to use some of this stuff, but then I'm supporting the company that I don't really agree with. Thats why I'm much more interested in company that are a lot more open like http://www.fungp.com/ and supporting them.
 

 I'm pretty sure the only reason that OtherOS was removed was due to hack made with that option being open, so they had to close it off, but once one way is found around the hack usually loads more follow so I'm not surprised its happened, I just dont agree with the way the hacker are spinning it that the only reason they did it was due to Sony pulling linux support.  
 
Still at least they got blue ray to protect it kind off, as to download 50gb games will take ages and the extra expense of blue ray still make ps3 bit of a problem for pirates, which I'm happy about.
 
 Everyone says that piracy doest do any harm to these big multimillion pound companies and they deserver it, but everyone forgets about the middle men, I mean recently where I live Blockbuster has closed down and gaming, cds and dvd sections are disappearing off the shelves, why partly because of things going digital, mp3 etc, plus online shopping but I think a bigger reason for it happing so quick is because more and more people are pirating games and movies.  
 
I also believe its why so many publisher gave up on the Amiga more quickly because piracy was pretty bad on the Amiga, I mean you had all the tools to make copies of software with every Amiga sold.

[AmigaNG]

I find it funny that people are all blaming Sony for the removal of the OtherOS feature and not the people who have clearly misused it and did more with it than they where meant too, there the people to blame for this. Sony didn't have to included otherOS as a feature at all, but most likely thought it would help research projects, military applications, schools and a few geeks to use the PS3 in a different manner and do more than just play games, I commend Sony for attempting it. But clearly the end users cant be trusted with a feature if its going be misused.  
 

 Anyone who has a fat ps3 can still I think do a complete restart to factory settings and restore the otherOS feature, you just miss out on the psn and some of the recent games that require the new firmware which I think was an acceptable compromises.   If your still not happy you should be able to get a full refund due to the change of the End user Agreement.
 

 Dont get me wrong I don't defend Sony, or any other company for its copyright protection methods, but I understand its a necessary evil for them to try and protect their work, I do think they go after the wrong people and just target general consumer with DRM, removing feature and other copyright crap that just doest work and usally result in the hack hardware or software being better than the actual product, examples:- no need to be online all the time to just play a offline game, no need for the disks to be in the drive doing nothing, no need to phone up or regs all your personal details with these companies etc.. They should really be going after the people who are uploading the stuff and breaking/hacking there products and not effecting the general users.
 
Its sad that MGM gone bust and ok a lot was down to bad management but according to a few statics the most pirated film is Quantum of Solace so thanks folks for no more bonds.  Plus a lot of cinema's where on the verge of being closed down its only thanks to the success or 3d in the cinema that a lot have stayed open. Again the middle men are affected, the big exeecs and Hollywood stars with their millions are the last to be effected just the poor sod who work in the shops, or at the cinema.

[AmigaNG]

That is I think the first time I been called a troll
:banana::banana::banana:

Now I know I'm part of the Amiga scene!

This what i think they should be doing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALZZx1xmAzg&feature=fvsr

[AmigaNG]

Well few points, firstly comparing a amiga to ps3 hacking is a little bit of a stretch, ones a computer and so is largely regarded that you should be allowed to run any software you like and ones a game console, where its largely regarded that the manufacture can dictate what is and isnt allowed on    the console.
 
Another point is on every amiga sold there should be a sticker that reads something like if broken voids the warranty, and when commodore-amiga where active they did try and prevent hacks, I believe I remember reading that they worked with Ocean to develop something you plug into your joystick port (might of been for Robocop3) that would scramble the controls if the game was a copy, but within like a week it was hacked.  
 
Plus some of the big hacks and work arounds only came about after commodore demised and it looked like companies like gateway was'nt that bothered what happened to Amiga so where necessary. Plus again this is a computer not a games console.
 
Look at the end of the day the biggest problem I have with this story is the way they are trying to spin it that they only hacked it for linux and for homebrew gaming, I'm sorry but for £300 you paid for you ps3 you could of got a bare basic pc and have a much better linux experiences, all the home-brew you want with out the risk of braking the law, braking the hardware or having to jump around hoops to get the stuff working.

All I'm trying to say is why are these people trying to write programs for the ps3 when if they came to our community they be more than welcome to do what they liked, in fact I love these coders to come on board and show us what a xmos chip on the x1000 could do,  I'm sure aeon would welcome them etc, a load of other companies would also welcome them to do what they like with thire device but no instead they go where there not welcome.

[AmigaNG]

Are you guys suggesting that people should stop tinkering with devices  

No. as I have said there are loads of companies and devices out their that want people to make interesting hack for them. X1000 and its Xmos chip for one.  Also the hacks for say Kinect type devices I don't have much of problem with as its not going to affect piracy and infact any good use for it that come about will only boost hardware sales of the devices.
 

piracy is totally irrelevant here. The point is that Sony messed up and now have to face the consequence

And what consequence are you referring to if not losing sales to piracy because of these hacks.

their oh so protected platform is now unwrapped and open, and this is not because someone did anything illegal, but because of their own incompetence.

I think forcing a closed IP system open is illegal.

I still think its all still bs that they want to just be able to explore what's possible with Ps3 hardware, that fine, get a fat ps3 restore to original firmware and have fun in the OtherOS area, why do you need to have access to the latest firmware or PSNetwork?

Plus I only just remember that PS3 has full flash support meaning you can play flash games via their browser, hardly a completely closed system.

[AmigaNG]

So you are suggesting that people should stop tinkering with devices if the manufactorer disapproves. Right?

No. did you finish reading my sentences? Microsoft  is hardly overjoyed that people are hacking its Kinect device to do weird effects with, I think thats ok, hell I have a driver on my pc that lets me use my ps3 web cam and joypad if i like. Hacking these kind of device to be used on other machine I dont really have a problem with. The problem I have with this is it clearly going to used by the majority of people to get free games.
 
 

The opening of the PS3 hardware might have many consequences that collides with Sony's business idea for the PS3. Such as third party operating systems, improved media center functionality (at last), games being developed outside Sony's ecosphere etc. just like we've seen on the other consoles that have been opened.

You got to admit though that piracy is the big one.  Plus I will say it again if you not happy by what is offered by Sony, buy an alternative product. Hell at the moment I use my ps3 as my media hub, but it just doesn't support all the media files I want it to and it web browser is pretty poor (still glad it has one) this is why I decided to build my own media center pc this year so I wont have any of these problems.
 
 

A totally irrelevant comment, noone is forcing anything and the "closed" IP system only appeared to be closed. On closer inspection it was not closed at all, perhaps it was intended to be closed, but in the end it was wide open.

Highlighted the problem for you, it was intended to be closed weather it was or not is irrelevant, sony didn't intend to let this happen. Plus still to run unapproved software you are going to have to copy Sonys key, weather you like it or not, that key is a Sony code so by copying or misusing it your are breaking the law.  
 
 

Why not? That's what one pay for, right? Now you can decide for yourself what needs you have and run whatever firmware you like, it is how it should have been from the start from a customers POV.

Well technically you get what you pay for is right, meaning if Sony sold you a fat PS3 with firmware v1 that is all your technically entitled to, Sony doesn't have to provide updates to any user who doesn't agree with any new end user agreement they make. Plus if your happy with what you paid for why do you feel the need to hack it and allow it to do more that what it said it could do, why not just buy a machine that lets you do what you want it to do. after all the "limited" features of the ps3 is all you paid for, right? why do you think you should be entitled to more than what you paid for, the main reason PS3 is cheaper than what it should be is due to the fact Sony get a nice % on anything you buy for it.If you dont agree with that system then your should be buying a computer.
 
 

I really don't understand your agenda in this discussion

Well I'm going to call it a day in this discussion because i dont want to be seen as a fan boy, or a troll or a supporter of DRM and copyright crap, I'm not at all.  
 
The main reason I posted was because I didn't like the general attitude of some people saying that:
 
Sony 100% deserves this, (they where the only game console that did allow and supported linux on it to begin with, so they dont, but thats just my view.)

That its was only done to get Linux back on it (again no one forced you to upgrade firmware, and linux if far better on other devices...like a computer would you believe! Again just my point of view)

and that it ok to pirate the games and get them for free (ok no one said that last one, but I'm pretty sure thats what a lot of people are thinking.)

[AmigaNG]

The PS3's GPU doesn't have a high enough fill-rate to emulate the PS2's GPU(!), that has been commonly documented. Therefore any PS3 without PS2 hardware onboard will never run PS2 software. (I have a launch model 60Gb PS3, PAL, which has the GPU and not the Emotion Engine CPU, and even on that, the PS2 backward compatibility is unfortunately limited.)

I know I said I wouldn't post again, but just to correct this, that this is not true, Sony did release a limited edition Metal Gear Soild 80Gb PS3 without both ps2 gpu or cpu and it allowed you to run PS2 games, I believe it was so you could run Metal Gear Soild 2 and 3 but had a lot of trouble running many other games and was dropped, I believe Sony would have to custom make the way the emulator work for each PS2 game run. However I think this same software is used to power the recent HD PS2 re-releases version of games we've seen, like Metal of Honour and God of War 1 & 2 both have come out since.

oh and on ps3 media limitation, I know I could re-transcode my files but that takes time, plus I dont like having to leave on my big power sucking pc on just to stream data to my ps3, I prefer to just have all my files I need on my console, and wifi single have never been that strong in my house, plus ny 320gb hard drive in the ps3 has nearly over 250gb just on game installs and demos I've downloaded, so I think I will just use my Ps3 as a game machine and have a dedicated computer for my media and other hobby's, with no restitutions, no work around I need to implement etc.