3G iPhone

[mdwh2]

I got a 3G phone years ago, no queuing required

bloodline wrote:
Well, Like the Amiga in the '80s, the iPhone brings together a lot of different pre-existing technologies into one single platform. It does so at a price and form factor that is convienient and useful for the average user.

It has a focus on multimedia in a market that has been lacking in that area for a long time.

The iPhone is the new Amiga.

Not really, it's more like a new Windows 95: Bringing together things that other products have done years before, but for some reason getting lots more hype. The only thing nifty about the Iphone that's not so common in other phones is touchscreen, but even so that's not unique (and I don't think Apple were the first with this feature, either?) Also no Amiga had a bug as fundamental as not having copy/paste.

What's odd is that a lot of features hyped about the Iphone aren't even unique to smartphones (e.g., accessing the Internet, or multimedia).

Although I might agree that it's a "new Amiga" in the sense of a "post Commodore new Amiga" rather than "groundbreaking like the A1000 was" - lacks Java, overpriced, lags behind in features like 3G...

[mdwh2]

bloodline wrote:
All the Amiga did was bring together pre-existing technologies, the amiga just had exactly what the market needed in one single package.

The Amiga was first to bring it in a single package. The Iphone wasn't. (What does it bring in a single package?) It's Windows 95 - doing what other phones have done for years (including in a single package).

Because the Phone/Mobile device market was stagnant... it has been around for about 10 years and companies had become obsessed with adding things like higher resolution cameras... without innovating or even giving the user what the user actually wants!

Not here in Europe it isn't. Phones have changed dramatically in the last 10 years, going from simple devices with only SMS and maybe WAP, to basically being mobile computing devices, with fast Internet connection, video, music, being able to run applications. That's on a bog-standard low end phone. The Iphone isn't bad, but in what sense has it revolutionised a "stagnant" market? Why do things like "high resolution cameras" get dismissed as things no one wants, but being able to play music like an Ipod gets cited as a good thing?

The Market has traditionally been aimed at boring geeks who love to sprout off numbers and specs... Apple make devices for real people.

Where do you live? The mobile market has practically reached 100%. And whilst smartphones may be more a niche market, (a) the Iphone hasn't changed this (it's still mainly geeks that seem to talk about it), and (b) smartphones are not only used by "boring geeks".

There is nothing innovative about the touchscreen (except perhaps that Apple use a capacitive screen and the others tend to use pressure sensitive screens)

But isn't multitouch the key point that's a recent development? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-touch says that the Iphone was the first phone to have multi-touch. So yes, I'll concede that this was an innovation, but it also means you can't say their interface was better with the same technology, when the technology had a fundamental distinction. And also there are other new phones that have multitouch now. As time progresses, phones become more advanced - that's always the case, there's always new phones coming out which are cutting edge the moment they are released. There's nothing special about the Iphone in the big picture.

As stated by in the Apple Technology conferences... that was a design decision... It was a feature that needed more time to develop and the decision was to leave it out of V2.0 and focus on feature that would be more useful to the general public.

The more I hear about it, the more it gets worse. Not having copy and paste is a _design decision_? How could it not have been developed properly? I don't need a phone that makes those sorts of design decisions...

Because you are a computer geek, don't understand the concept of usability. The iPhone integrates these features into a single usable package. the iPhone's internet browser is about a billion years ahead of any other mobile device!!! I don't even bother with turning real computers on any more!!!

As a computer geek, I am most certainly aware of UI concepts. It's Iphone lovers who claim it has a better UI, but are suspiciously never able to explain how it is better. Phones have been combining these features into a single usable package for years.

The Iphone's brower isn't any better than that on many smartphones - and even bog standard phones can run Opera Mini now, anyway.

[mdwh2]

bloodline wrote:
I don't know what it's like in Europe, but I assume it's like the UK...

I'm in the UK, and the market wasn't stagnant. In fact, it had already moved on whilst the Iphone plays catch up (e.g., 3G).

Phones have changed dramatically in the last 10 years, going from simple devices with only SMS and maybe WAP, to basically being mobile computing devices, with fast Internet connection, video, music, being able to run applications. That's on a bog-standard low end phone.

No, they added these features... they didn't integrate them.

The difference?

Every other phone manufacturer is now trying to make their phones more like the iPhone... We had insane demand worldwide, for the device.

In what sense are they trying to make their phone more like the Iphone? By dropping features whilst raising the price?

The iPhone has a totally new user interface. It has fully integrated network functionality into the basic functionality of the device... Apps work together, the web browser is central to the functionality to the device. The App Store and iTunes store integration are unique... and Yes, it has a built in iPod, which is the worlds most popular media player, which is a nice value add.

Same with loads of other phones - they have that, or non-Apple equivalents, along with more.

The UK... and yes the Mobile Market is 100%... there is no way for a manufacturer to get an in... without something special... which Apple have managed to do.

So now they are praised merely for not flopping? Apple have billions of dollars, they're hardly a struggling start up!

Real people are talking about the iPhone... people are saying... "I was going to get an iPod, but I might as well get an iPhone".

Evidence? Same with your people in the street comment - I might as well claim people in the street are talking about every phone apart from the Iphone.

Real people can use the iPhone, I showed my HP 4510 to my grandparents a few years ago they were just confused by it...

My mum has a phone, and has no trouble using it. That only shows that the HP 4510 was a poor phone if it couldn't be operated by someone. Or possibly, technology generally moved on in the last few years.

Yeah, and this is why neither you or I work in that industry... we don't have the vision to make the iPhone... Unlike the other Phone Manufactures, Apple never stand still, they can't afford to.

What does where we work have to do with it? I'm not claiming that _I_ can personally make phones better than Apple! But there are plenty of non-Apple companies that are in the phone industry.

No, you don't, the iPhone wasn't made for you!! It was made for real people who don't use smart phones! Apple designs it's technology for real people!

I don't use a smart phone, I use a normal phone. That has copy and paste.

But I'm glad you agree - the Iphone _isn't_ the best phone ever, because not everyone has the same needs. However, you can't claim that people who don't consider the Iphone is the best are not real people!

By that logic, the Amiga is still the best - anyone who has a problem isn't a real person...

I explained over and over again... it's a natural interface, it works the way real people work, people who don't care about computers... technology... specs...

None of these are reasons, they're just made up terms, and marketing blurb. Tell us _why_ it works in this way, or _why_ it's interface is "natural" (whatever that means)?

The iPhone doesn't even have have menus or access to the underlying file system!! Everything is designed around the user and not the underlying technology!!! You don't need to care how or why the phone works... it just does!

Same with every other phone.

This is just wrong... Not one single review of the iPhone, has ever said the Browser is no better than any other phone... in fact even the most negative iPhone reviews have said they iPhone web browser is a shining beacon in a sea of terrible browsers...

The iPhone is the most used mobile web browser, despite the iPhone not having the biggest market share!!!!

References please?

Both Win95 and the Amiga did something special, bringing together technology, in a way the market needed. That is why they were popular.

But that's what _every_ company does with every product (at least, discounting the ones that completely flop). Every bog standard phone brings together technology in a way demanded by the market.

but between the Sinclair QL nd the Apple Mac... the Amiga had nothing new.

Neither had as good graphics, AFAIK. But either way - if in order to prove the "Iphone is the new Amiga" claim, your tactic is to water down the impact of the Amiga, then that just makes the claim worthless. Just about any new product could be seen as a "new Amiga".

I have nothing but respect for Jobs being able to sell the original iMac... it was technologically retarded, PPC and MacOS 8... but he knew how to make them popular.

I entirely agree here - it's not that the products are anything special, but I agree that Apple are good at marketing.

From the other thread:

You don't get the iPhone... great... You try and do what Apple has done then.

I don't need to - loads of other phone companies already have

I do get the Iphone. I also get all the other phones

(Btw, I posted to a webforum too the other day, using my normal phone. And I did it with some copy and paste...)