mac and pc sucks!!!!

[Arkhan]

Amiga boards live in a sort of alternate reality world where Macs, PCs and Linux boxes have not changed in two decades.  Where people seem to attach almost magical characteristics to IBM's Power architecture.  Where a small cabal of maybe a thousand Amiga Illuminati know more than the billions of other people who use computers, especially than the computer scientists, engineers, academics, et al, who instead of worrying about measuring the bounce of a joystick are wasting their time developing complex solution to world problems.  Don't they know that they could just write that app in Amiga Basic?

Hi, we're all retro computer enthusiasts.  Have we met?

go peddle your Amiga hate somewhere else, doofy.  Let the rest of us be enthusiastic hobbyists about a 25 year old computer.  


@Hell Labs (even though hes banned, :laughing:)
You can totally get stuff in the new mac keyboards.  Been there, done that.

It helps if you actually HAVE one!

You can also totally spill Pepsi in the new Macbook's and destroy them on accident.

Nothing beats a 1300$ can of pepsi man.

[Arkhan]

@Linde

I think it's hard for people to accept that AmigaOS is really out of step with the current century and that there aren't millions of people waiting for it.  They need to chill out and just enjoy their hobby instead of being so fundamentalist.  

The Amiga is a great toy, I enjoy playing with it, but it isn't ever going to replace my MacPro as a production machine.  Nor would I want it too.  When I'm on my Amiga it's impossible to do serious work, that's a plus in my book!

You wanna talk out of step with the current century?

Macs blow a few at gaming.

Amigas do not.

What now.

[Arkhan]

Install a few video game emulators. Now the mac is superior to the Amiga again.

Still doesn't help you play modern PC games on the Mac.


Amiga_Nut: Your long winded Anti M$ post is too long to fully address, so I will just say:

If M$ is so stupid, why is it that they are everywhere?  Why is it that *my* vista laptop hasnt died, and that my 3 machines running Win7 have been on for at least a month without incident?

[Arkhan]

Another TL;DR from Amiga_Nut

I know you're anti M$ing it up if you have things like Winblows in there plain as day, and complaining about problems with an OS that are petty and whiney.

Welcome to 2010.  A place where alot of computing/OS stuff requires a powerful machine for maximum performance.  All that eye candy, and behind the scenes multitasking stuff requires power!  You keep dogging on the "experts", which implies you are an expert, so you should understand this, right?

also, welcome to, "its been like that since the get go".   Back in the day, Amiga was top-notch.  It wasn't decade old hardware trying to pump out the current needs.

Stop trying to get todays performance out of last decades hardware, lol.


Also, you dont *need* a omgexpensive computer.

two of my Windows 7 machines are like, 6 years old and they run perfectly fine.


maybe the problem isn't the OS.  PEBKAC.

[Arkhan]

We should be beyond that now.  We have 1000z CPU power, x1000 RAM, etc, etc.  Usability, responsiveness ie putting the user in charge in real time is not petty.  Simple things that by now we shouldn't even be talking about.

The new GUI does put responsiveness ahead of everything else.... Priority has been given back to the GUI so things like changing the volume during music/video playback don't lag.

etc.
etc.

The things im calling petty are "oh, my laptop overheated, its clearly Vista's fault".   Prove it.

Show me all of these unresponsive issues.  I've got 4 machines here that say everyone complaining is full of it.

Amikit's eye candy looks as good as anything out there, and runs on 50 mhz cpu with an ancient 24 bit display board. Sure its not Aero, but then there isn't a blinding fast 3d video card with 1 gig of video RAM running the display either.  With that grunt power behind it, I shouldn't even know that I'm running any eye candy by seeing my performance suffer.  And yet I do.

Amikit is also less user friendly than Windows, no offense.  It's nice and all, but there are too many steps involved to get things done.  Sure does look nice though.

What performance stuttering are we talking about anyways?  I can run games + movies + other stuff at the same time and don't see a performance problem.  This is while running windows 7 on 6-10 year old hardware too.  

yep thats MS double speak: Blame the user.

What, should the OS automatically compensate for morons? :roflmao:

You call it double speak, I call it herpaderp.

[Arkhan]

Windows 7 has done a lot to restore the public's trust in Microsoft.  It's stable and just runs.  But again you need 4 gigs and a multicore machine.  

Nah.  I got it running mint on 2gig machines.

Playing games on full blown settings no less

win7 is made of WIN!!!!

[Arkhan]

I just got to chime in...

Why is Windows useful?

Windows is usefull for me cause I get PAID to write software for it!  So long live Windows platform.

True dat.

[Arkhan]

BUT THIS IS THE POINT.  F'en 8 CORES!!!!!!!! RUNNING AT 3,200 MHZ. 16,000 MB OF RAM!!!! AN i5 IS NOW "BASIC".  TO DO WHAT? RUN A FRICKEN GUI?  Play a movie. That plays better on a $149 Bluray player from China.  Play some same old same old FPS.  That works better on a $199 XBOX?

:roflmao:   The cores aren't to "run a fricken gui".   There is more to a computer than a "fricken gui".    I'd like to see an Amiga run an SLI rig and pump out jabillions of polygons a second.

Yes it seems trivial to have a beefed up computer to run simple things, but if you notice when you are running simple things.... the CPU usage doesn't even move?

"The same old FPS".  Maybe to you, mr angry at the modern computer man.  To the rest of the gaming world, we are enjoying our state of the art mobos with tricked out video cards, tons of ram, and lightning fast games.

I think you are being very ignorant.  

Sorry when I read post like yours, and I've read many over the years, and each year the specs get higher and higher, I am convinced that people have lost perspective and have no idea what those specs actually mean.  Here's a little help: you can get the entire text plus pictures of the 32 volume Encyclopedia on ONE  0.6 GB ie 650 MB CD.

What is your point?  You can fit encyclopedias on a CD!  Cool!  You can also fit things like games, movies, music, other books.  They're great stuff man.

Specs are supposed to get higher and higher.  Duh.  If they never got any better, technology wouldn't progress.  We'd be walking around listening to vinyl records, and going MAN I WISH WE HAD BETTER TECHNOLOGY.

And you are OK with this?  Its just an OS, FFS.

I do more with my computer than study the OS.  Dunno about you.  Sounds like all you do is turn it on, stare at the fricken GUI, and then complain that your Amiga does the same thing.

The PC platform was always about:  "If it ain't running fast enough, buy something faster."  Here's a novel idea:  "Write decent code"

No amount of decent code will get Crysis to run on a PC-XT w/ an EGA card.

[Arkhan]

Except Powerpoint can go die in a fire.  I recently went back to college and lectures these days are ppt plus a printed handout of the slideshow outline :madashell:.

I despise the overuse of powerpoint.  Now excel... I couldn't have done any of my previous jobs without it.  Pivot Tables, graphs...IMHO the best thing MS has ever done is Excel.  I've tried OO's version, just isn't the same.

yeah man, my algorithms class this past semester was taught using the slideshows that came with the book.

then everyone whined AW THERES NOTES BUT NO PRINTOUT? CMON.

and he printed the slideshows out.

I tossed them in the trash, realized we were just being read to, rather than taught, and stopped going except for test days.

Got me a nice A.


Powerpoint makes teachers lazy, and students even lazier.


Good for presentations, dumb for notes.

[Arkhan]

I prefer hand written notes all over the chalkboard, that you have to manually write down.  no handouts.


It weeds out the lazy bastards in classes.

[Arkhan]

Stefcep, I think your whining about Win7 being laggy is probably delusional.  It is also in the minority.

I run win7 on a single core 2GB machine and do not experience the lag you are whining about.  That is like the ass minimum to get the thing running...

Theres like 25 icons on the desktop and a buncha quick launch stuff pinned to the start menu.

It runs WoW full blown, all of my music and programming apps run snappy as balls, and it hasnt been rebooted since the power went out 3 weeks ago.

Also, I have experienced some lag/herpderping on Amiga computers, so it isnt like they are without fault, so you can stop waiving around the "AMIGA DID IT BACK IN THE DAY" flag.


Also, until you have worked for M$, don't comment on how they code.  You don't have any idea, so making claims about it makes you look dense.

[Arkhan]

There's a message in the second sentence ..

Yes, the message is that even at the bare minimum requirements, it still provides a good experience for computing.

So what?  Evry now and then the icons need to be re-read in and re-drawn on the desktop, and the start menu always needs to be populated when you boot up.  No BIG deal, but why should it happen AT ALL?

Redrawing is normal.  If it didn't happen then GUIs would be worthless.  It would draw once and you'd never see movement again.  

Your start menu needs to be populated because.... the computer has to know what is there?  It doesnt automagically just know stuff upon booting.  It has to process these things.  with the processor.  mainly the central unit like one known as the CPU.

What's your point?  That a 1992 14 mhz machine can't?

No, my point is that the rest of the Win7 world seems to be rockin' it no problems doing tons of great stuff, and you are whining cause one time you clicked the X to close a window and it took too long.

Should it still be happening today?

Yes.  If computers were perfect, there would be no such thing as tech support or debuggers.  

What interests me is the fact that the software platforms do not do the current hardware justice.  When I took a semester in programming, my first program was to write a simple database.  A major task was to see how fast we could complete a search for a file. Over 2 weeks, just by re-writing our code we got it down better than half the time.  

So you took a semester in programming and are suddenly the expert on how OS's should function and what goes on with them?

Now in the modern world, if it doesn't run fast enough, you get faster/bigger capacity/extra CPU/GPU cores.  And this works, and as its so cheap, who cares.  But it also means your hardware isn't being used to its full potential.  And then your once-new hardware will soon enough feel slower, so its replaced.  And this second lot is also not being used to its full potential  After several generations of this cycle, how much has the software hobbled the hardware?  What more *could* your hardware be doing?  
.

Its been like this since computers were made.  Its not like it just happened a year or two ago.

Pushing the technology to the limit is what brings about the need and desire for new technology.

[Arkhan]

WTF?  This is the desktop we are talking about here. How about just drawing an icon when the program is added and deleting it when the program is removed?  Other OS's seem to do fine without re-drawing the whole fricken thing even when nothing is added or removed.  In XP, the World's most used OS this can even results in generic icons replacing the originals

You know every time you do something the screen redraws stuff?
You just don't see it because it happens mighty fast?  Unless you think the GUI has 2049204980 layers and thats how you can open hundreds of windows and still be able to see what's behind them.

Look up clipping.  Maybe a semester of things like that will make you the master of GUIs also.

Right.  How about indexing that as you go along, storing that in 500 byte file at the last shutdown, and all being ready to go when you next boot up,taking a microsecond to load at the next boot?  And for all the Win 7 talk, XP is still by far the most used OS on the planet.  Try launching from the start menu in a fully populated PC and see how long XP takes to draw its menus and icons

Lol, I think you're the only person whose 7 box can't handle the start menu.  Like I said, 4 fully loaded Win7 machines over here don't exhibit these issues.  They're just as snappy, if not snappier than XP.

And, XP is still the most widely used because it's been in use for what a decade now?  Windows 7 hasn't been commercially out for a year yet really...

Give it some time and it will replace XP on all fronts.

No, the point thats eluded you is I only NEEDED ONE SEMESTER to know that your computer could be made to do things twice as fast if you did your job as a programmer right.  There is a discrepancy between the hardware capability and the end product.

The point didn't elude me, because it doesn't exist.  I like how you keep saying you are saying things that elude the rest of us, and that we don't get things.  

Sorry, one semester of programming is not going to make you an expert on anything.  People like you are the people I laugh at in school.  "I GOT MY PROJECTS TO WORK THEREFORE I AM AN EXPERT.".   Putsy university assignments teach you the bare ass basics of everything.  If you think you could now walk into M$, sit down and optimize all of their OS stuff, then you are a complete goon.

I took two semesters of operating systems courses.  I have a CS degree, and soon to be a masters.  Still, I'm not going to pretend I know enough quite yet to make judgements on an a company with an OS that has been around since I was still wearing diapers.  There is crap going on in Windows that would make me pee my pants trying to work with it.  

It takes way more than a semester of jerking off to actually know/understand these complex/advanced/intricate/massive projects like full blown commercial OS's.

Yep, your modern day OS is pushing your hardware to the limit, but too much of that is not doing anything useful.

My level 80 warrior is pretty useful.  He likes Windows 7 quite alot.

[Arkhan]

Well not updating your computer for 10 years will bring up these sorts of issues. Then again I'd expect that from someone determined to harangue anyone daring to step outside of their 80's timewarp.

It's just a jump to the left!

AND THEN A STEP TO THE RIGHT!

Also LOL@ your single semester of programming experience.

His textbook of choice:

[Arkhan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia9DDJF4Kk8

I did not make this.  

I did however, laugh at it.