FPGA Replay Board

[Darrin]

Most people here would love to have more detailed answers from the Natami team members.  Trying to find information by sifting through the large number of threads on the Natami forums is difficult, plus it is hard to tell which posts there are made by Natami team members, or Natami fanatics making inaccurate statements based on wishful thinking.

So, feel free to hijack threads here with correct information about the Natami project any time.  I for one would like to see more frequent news updates on the Natami project that are straight from a team member.

I agree 100%.

When it comes to Natami information, it is hard to know who is actually stating it, whether it is fact or fiction or even how old it is and what board they're talking about (current or previous versions).

Please keep us updated.  

[Darrin]

On the Natami forums, the Atari Firebee team are keen on using Natami as a future Atari platform as well.  They aren't completely happy with the Firebee hardware in the long run...it seems.  But that could just be a vocal minority.  The time for competition is at an end.  Co-operation is the future, imho.

Well that would be good for the production run as the more units produced in a batch = lower cost per unit.

This is a handy feature of the FPGA as Mike will not be selling them just to the Amiga community, it will also make a great board for people developing other cores.

[Darrin]

Well the Firebee is based on a 266Mhz Coldfire cpu.  So an '060 based system feels like going backwards for them since they'd still be limited to ~100Mhz.  They also want a roadmap forward and not just replacing failing classic hardware with modestly improved new hardware.

The advantage is that they can make their own daughterboard and just use the main FPGA Arcade as the "base board".  It is the same for any design using the FPGA Arcade, they can make their own daughtboards to supply any specific features they wish to add (and put a Coldfire on their own board).

Meanwhile, this would boost sales of the base FPGA Arcade beyond what Amiga-only users would generate and reduce unit costs.

[Darrin]

A question for Mike if he happens to drop in:

Are there any plans to include a "boot loader" similar to the C-One where you can select at startup which core you want to run?

[Darrin]

who would make these cores? and could they do that with a replay board or do they need a full dev kit?

I believe some are already in the works.  There's an old thread around here somewhere...

Once I get my hands on the FPGA Arcade I intend to put together a hard file with a Classic Workbench install and then add as many emulators to that as I can find.  Some off the top of my head:

VICE:  8bit Coomodores (C64, VIC20, PET, etc)
MAME:  Arcade classics!
BBC model B:  I have the floppy somewhere, hope it works.
Spectrum:  For those who want to play C64 games only with wank graphics and crap sound.  
PC Task:  MS DOS and Windows 3.x or even Windows 95?
Shape Shifter:  I also have the MacOS7.x package that Cammy & friend assembled.

It will do until some "native" cores appear.  Can anyone think of any more?

[Darrin]

AROS is the black camp.

AROS camp watches in horror as FPGA Arcade sales take off...

[Darrin]

Is DVI behaving in the same manner as Analog VGA does so that even though it's 31kHz hor sync, it's still 50Hz vert sync ? Or does DVI simply just bash the pixels to the screen without the need of a 50Hz sync ?
 
The reason I ask is that many LCD monitors suck at displaying 50Hz analog VGA. Either they just won't operate, or they display a silly message on the screen which sometimes cannot be clicked away using the OSD on the LCD monitor.
 
Also, I was wondering if the Replay board uses more or less the same OSD layout as Minimig does, or is it more facelifted when it comes to the layout (e.g. mouse controlled etc?).
 
//Espen

A tip for people:  If you're looking for a monitor to use with the Minimig/FPGA or a normal scan doubled Amiga for PAL modes then chcek out the Viewsonic range.  I picked up a couple of 1920x1080 models with VGA & DVI inputs and they work like a charm.  In fact, my A4000 has the RTG output to the DVI in 1920x1080 for Workbench and the VGA is used for native modes via the IndivisionAGA.  The otehr identical monitor is connected to my A2000 using a Cybervision 643D and an "Amber" SDFF both to the VGA and a PC to the DVI.  Minimig looks good on it too.

[Darrin]

THank you very much for this info. I was wondering how I was gonna dig up a decent model of a monitor that I could use that will cope with the 50Hz sync.
Do you know the modem number of the one you got working ?

Espen

I'm away on a business trip at the moment so I don't have access to the two monitors to check and they'll be "discontinued" models by now anyway... ... ah, found it:

Viewsonic VA2223wm 21.5in 1920x1080 5ms DVI SPK

I bought it from Tiger Direct and they very good about putting the monitor specs on their site.

Here's a list of all of their current Viewsonic monitors:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Category/guidedSearch.asp?CatId=12&sel=Mfr;Mfr_903

Their cheapest is this one for $99 that does 50Hz with a single VGA input:
Viewsonic VA1931WA-LED 19" Widescreen LED Monitor - 720p, 1366x768, 10000000:1 Dynamic, 5ms, VGA, Anti-glare

Then there is this one (similar to what I bought) with VGA and DVI for $159:
Viewsonic VA2231wm 22" Widescreen LCD Monitor - 1080p, 1920x1080, 16:9, 1000:1, 100000:1 Dynamic, 5ms, VGA, DVI, Integrated Speakers

One word of warning, they do list 2 "square screen" models and they show 56Hz-75Hz so you'll want to avoid them for PAL modes unless you have an Indivision.

[Darrin]

Mike, did you get my email and PM?

[Darrin]

has jakub got a preorder list for his daughter board yet? and a price?

He's still working on it.  Give him a chance.  

[Darrin]

So the rumor that the requirement is 68020 or better is false.

Now someone actually tried instead of assuming it doesn't work?

I have to ask though, if your running a 680x0 machine then what advantage does AROS give you over Amikit or ClassicWorkbench installation of a "real" workbench?

[Darrin]

In defense of Darrin, that is in no way a stupid question. Why trade a know product for a product that is likely to be slower and less reliable (at least initially)/

Thank you Iggy.  That's exactly my point.  We all have Workbench and if we don't then we can get it the same way we get ADFs of games.  So why use something that almost does the same to replace something that already does what you want it to.

As you pointed out, I wasn't having a go at AROS but rather pointing out that we already have a tried and tested solution.  

[Darrin]

Maybe not the first time it was asked, but this one has been asked and answered umpteen times already. And the answer is pretty obvious too. The question is pretty much on the same level as "What is the advantage of using ReactOS over Windows?"

Yeah, the answer is obvious:  NONE.

[Darrin]

Of course, you can use KingCON and all the other fixes and workarounds instead. The fact that most people do is why a "modern" AmigaOS 3.x system is a heap of kludges and patches and commodities and replacements for OS files.  AROS provides a way out of that, and allows us to create a nice clean foundation and improve that directly instead.

My point is, that until AROS provides the same compatability as the "heap of kludges" then it continues to make sense to use the "heap of kludges" instead.

Yes, it will be nice to have an AROS install that works as a 100% compatable Workbench 3.x replacement and installs in one go instead of in various steps.  Let me know when that happens and meanwhile I look forward to seeing HDF files of AROS installs released on a regular basis which I can test.

[Darrin]

I also thought the answer was obvious: LICENSING

:lol:
desiv

As opposed to "pirating".  

Fair point, if it works.  

[Darrin]

PCB B2 about to go to fabrication (tomorrow).
This is the optimized for production board and fixes the power-off issue and improves the DVI to audio spacing.

I'm off to China on Monday and will pick the boards up.

/MikeJ

Nice work Mike.  Have fun on your trip.  Unfortunately my board arrived 2 days after I left for my trip so I should finally get to play with it Saturday morning for a couple of hours before I fly to the UK.