Pegasos running native OS4 apps?

[Rassilon]

@Bill

Forcing people to buy specific hardware just so they can run their chosen software is stupid.

I think you may have misunderstood. Its not specifically about restricting the hardware to run the software. Its about restricting the hardware to a  SUPPORTED subset.

The original arguement for not producing OS4 on x86 was due to the myriad of PC hardware that would not be able to be supported.

If you bring that arguement back to Amiga now, where the market is much smaller - it costs time and money (which is not exactly abundent in the ,market) to adapt an OS for specific hardware (Pegasos etc).

So its not about forcing the user to use specific hardware, its about supporting a small subset of mobo's well, rather than loads of mobo's shoddily.

Rassilon

[Rassilon]

@Bill

If you ever read any of my posts on A.org or AW.net you'll see I always have trouble trying to say what I mean / So I'll have another crack at it....

The licensing scheme is put there by Amiga Inc (Not Hyperion) to guaruntee that OS4 will work on certified hardware. So far only Eyetech with their AmigaOne have applied for this certification.

With that sorted Hyperion can write the mobo specific parts of the OS4 distribution. As you say with a PPC based mobo, its mainly the drivers that have to be re-written.

So by certifying each hardware solution for OS4 Amiga Inc probably gets a royalty, and the consumer gets a hardware/software combo that they know will work.

If you think about it, its not the certification that limits the number of different mobo's for which OS4 is available, its the number of mobo's whose manufacturers wish to have OS4 run on them.

If the manufacturers of the Barbie PPC mobo wanted OS4 to run on it they would contact Amiga Inc.

If a user wanted a mobo to run OS4 on, they would buy a mobo capable of running OS4?!?! At the moment this is only Eyetech.

And as Rogue said, if a user wanted to upgrade his mobo, that originally came without OS4 but is now capable of running it, they may be able to purchase an upgrade pack, much like the Blizzard and Cyberstorm ones.

You can't really specify any restrictions when we are talking about a hypothetical situation, which is what we are doing /

Rassilon

[Rassilon]

@Seehund

The majority of people wanting to buy OS4 will be in three camps:

1) Blizzard users - they will buy the appropriate upgrade pack.
2) Cyberstorm users - they will buy the appropriate upgrade pack.
3)People wanting to buy newer/faster Amiga's - Currently their only option is an Eyetech AmigaOne.

As software developers in a small market its not profitable for Hyperion to write OS4 so that it runs on every PPC mobo out there. So what did they do? They decided to target OS4 for specific mobo's.  But how do you decide which ones?

..... by running a certification process. If a manufacturers wants OS4 to run on their board they approach Amiga Inc for certification. - There is no point in spending time and money getting OS4 to run a mobo X if the manufacturer isn't bothered about it and provides no help. Thats where the 'better support' arguement comes in. Why bother trying to support a particular mobo if the manufacturer is being unelpful.

Its encomies of scale really, get it to run on a small selection of baords first, and then when it has proven (hopefully) a success other manufacturers may want it to run on their mobo's.

Rassilon

[Rassilon]

@downix

I am only referring to perhaps one aspect of the business model, but its just not profitable spending time and money supporting numerous platforms if you don't know the future of said platform, or know if there is enough demand.

The certifiction process supports these points by limiting the supported platforms to a manageable amount, and the support of the manufacturer would at the very least suggest there is reasonable demand to justify expenditure.

Rassilon

[Rassilon]

@Downix

I hate you break it to you, but thats exactly how the licensing/certificating scheme can work. Ben Hermans has said so on this very forum (If only I could manage to find his post)

Rassilon

[Rassilon]

@All

This is what Fleecy just posted over on AW.net
(The original post can be found here AW.net Fleecy Post)

It is all very simple and has been explained countless times. The fact that it is still being presented as something else gives our legal department great cause for concern.

AmigaOS (and AmigaDE) are commercial products. As a result we have to measure whether there is business opportunity in expending our limited resources to put them on new platforms. This means that when we are approached about such a possibility, we will only move to a formal evaluation when the company or organisation presents us with both full technical specifications and samples, and also with full business plans, including predicted sales and marketing plans.

Only then can we measure whether it is worth our effort. After all, no one is going to sign a contract where we have to support a platform that requires huge resources in exchange for poor sales, or where it is technically unfeasible (or even impossible). For example someone can't sign a contract for putting AmigaDE on a handheld and then demand that it means we also agree to put it onto any device they chose, whether it be an electric toothbrush or a custom vector core super computer.

A formal approach for an AmigaDE port would first of all require that the Tao-Group support the host, either in HW or SW deployment mode. It would then require that the device actually be available and selling in numbers that provide a business opportunity.

A formal approach for the AmigaOS would first of all require that the product be a PPC platform. It would then require that the device actually be available and selling in numbers that provide a business opportunity.

AmigaOS4.0 is not a shrinkwrapped product. It is sold with a motherboard only, and thus comes with a system. Any company wishing to sell AmigaOS4.0 has to thus provide both technical and business information that provides a decent profit for both sides otherwise there is no point. Only a madman would engage in business activity to make a loss.

For the AmigaOS4.0 product in general, we have only limited resources to apply to it. Once AmigaOS4.0 is finished, the majority of those resources will move forwards to the AmigaOS4.1 and/or AG2 platforms. This will leave a small group of resources with the responsibility of moving the AmigaOS4.0 out across different products. Given that these resources are limited, our decision on which platforms and products to support will be strictly on a money making basis.

As for the AmigaOne, AmigaOne is an exclusive trademark which belongs to Eyetech Ltd. They are the only ones who can manufacture and sell a product called the AmigaOne. They can sell these products on to dealers who can then sell AmigaOnes.

This is the final, definitive comment on AmigaDE and AmigaOS4.0 concerning third parties and OEMs having it ported to their hardware. If you read anything else, it is not true and you should report it to us and the parties are mis-representing Amiga Inc in public.

cheers

fleecy moss
cto
amiga inc

[Rassilon]

@bloodline

Certianly, but if Amiga Inc. sign a contract for porting AmigaDE to a handheld AND ANY FUTURE DEVICES, then Amiga Inc. can't moan if that comanpy wants to make an electric tooth brush and port AmigaDE to it (which if I'm not mistaken was the sort of thing Mr McEwan was origianlly sprouting, Amiga on your fridge, cooker... blah blah blah...).

If I remember correctly, from the details of the Thendic/Amiga Inc contract that have been published, the any future devices was at the discretion of Amiga Inc, ie if they didn't want to port it to the Genesi Pegabrush they didn't have to.

Rassilon