mac and pc sucks!!!!

[Amiga_Nut]

I have seen some amazing demos on the amiga. especially some of the ppc demos that are so small you cant but marvel at the obvious coding prownes.
 
I have also seen amazing things on PCs and amstrads and snes etc etc etc.
 
I love amiga, but I have not used one for quite some time now. I thinks IBM clones have their place. Macs not used. Love my Xbox and my PSP as well.
 
Really don't see the point in all these recent and over the years. Amiga rulez. windows sucks etc etc on infintium.
 
All Hardware and software has its place somewhere and everyone has different prefences.
 
No one is wrong, no one is right. Its all down to personal taste.
 
Same goes for music

Well if you think needing 1500mhz and 2gb of RAM for a simple GUI to launch tasks is OK then you are welcome to post XP Microsoft shite inflicted on poor saps.

A PC is a tool, and not a very good one but at least they're not overprice (Apple I'm looking at you!) but it is far from elegant.....put it this way....if you have a blunt chainsaw.....and attach a 2000bhp turbo charged engine to it...it will eventually cut a tree down....get my drift

The Amiga was elegant in every way, THIS is why people lament its demise and still have affection for it to this day. There's a difference between being a fanboy and understanding what should be sufficient to run a reasonable OS/what is bloatware plain and simple

[Amiga_Nut]

You're paying for engineering costs and materials, for the iMac and the Air mostly, but the others are pretty well made too. Getting a full i7 rig plus monitor to fit in a case less than half the thickness of your everyday LCD, and having it not overheat constantly is HARD.

I really don't like the iMac concept...you would think Jobs would have learned from Alan Sugar's (Amstrad) mistakes in the 80s...when your LCD/Motherboard goes kaput you need a spare iMac...when your PC fails you only need another PC not monitor x2 and vice versa. And Toshiba make superior ultra lightweight machines (and have done, being the inventor of libretto and portege models) to Apple since the 90s.

Those rubbish flat keyboards for their desktop are horrible to use also, I've used better laptop keyboards on a daily basis!

People will buy Apple despite the cost and convince themselves it's the best....just like BMW Z4 drivers who read the bullshit in the manual that it is the fastest production electric roof

Best looking PC I ever owned was from those idiots @ Packard Bell....however just once they managed to produce a computer with touch sensitive case for DVD drives (concealed) in a gorgeous white shell that would look at home in the movie set of the film 2001. Everyone has personal tastes of their own but still....price is price....and OSX is no better than Linux with a different GUI.

[Amiga_Nut]

Amstrad sold typewriters with monitors attached, and a few 8-Bits, pretty much UK exclusive as far as I know. How is this relevent to apple?

Ahh Amstrad had a habit of building all-in-one 8 and 16bit machines...when the tape deck/diskdrive broke the computer was useless...and on their CPC 8bit machines if the monitor died...so did your computer's PSU. All in one is a bad design in my opinion, you need to account for twice the potential replacement units if only half the unit fails (say the backlight on the LCD)

Luckily they don't go "kaput" very often. Mine still hasn't, and it's 11 Years old. I've tried. It's fell off desks and everything.

If you run a business then bllind faith is not enough...you need contingency...which was my point.

It's funny you mention Toshiba, i've got a 310cds laptop here, and you could probably beat someone to death with it, lcd first, and it'd be unharmed. It weighs about half a stone even with the battery removed though.

The 310CDS is comparable with those rubbish black plastic era Macintosh notebooks from the mid-late 90s with the trackball in the middle of the palm rest. Funny thing is in 1996/98 Toshiba was making full featured Pentium and Pentium MMX tiny ultra portable laptops with SVGA 6.1" TFT screens the size of two DVD cases stacked ontop of each other, and performance wise (including battery performance!) they were identical to a full sized laptop. So yes Toshiba does know more about laptops than any other company all thing considered, and their Portege is superior to the Air from a hardware point of view (OS is not my problem....Toshiba don't write bloatware7).

Here is a Toshiba Libretto 233MMX Laptop



Hardly bigger than todays USB 3.5" 1/3 height floppy drives.

Once you get used to them they are unquestionably superior. Easier to type on, almost silent, and... Pop a few keys off your keyboard with a pen or something. You won't break it, unless it's a laptop. They'll go back on fine. See all the bits of crisps, dust, fluff, a few pubes? That stuff can't end up in the current mac keyboard.

It's yet another case of style over function I feel, I have nothing against laptop keyboards, use them 24/7 myself...but on a desktop.....come on. Anyway the Dell Inspiron 9400/XPS 1720 laptops have superior keyboards to everyone...and also these Apple 'desktop' keyboards.

They feel really weird before you get used to them though, and I've not got one because I refue to pay thirty odd quid for a keyboard. £7 Argos jobby for me thanks.

I'm fussy about my keyboards, it's worth spending a little extra when you use them all day as I have to for my business.

That's kind of daft. The price of a BMW/Apple is reflected in the build quality very clearly. The main difference though is that a new BMW is hideous. It's like they style all the cars by getting a 90's one, and covering it in dents.

Bit of an in-joke from the UK TV show Top Gear....when Richard Hammond proclaims to have the fastest electric convertible roof (because BMW told him it was...in techno-bullshit Z4's manual) but Clarkson proceeded to show him his review car (cheaper Honda S2000) was quicker...and the tag line is "don't believe what you read in your glossy manuals son"

At any rate, I've never actually bought an iMac brand new, and have only ever had this one, single apple product. The current iMac is great, and the form factor is exactly what I want. But I cant afford it, so I settle for a a Hackintosh taking up legroom under my desk.

The only machine I use OS X on is a Dell Latitude D810...it is an awesome PC laptop...despite being half a decade old it still runs games that 'new' laptop technology shafted by integrated graphics do not.

Which one? My sister had one (cant remember the model) that looked okay. Comedy PB moments were: She couldn't figure out how to play a dvd, refused to beleve the CD burner could also read CDs (whaaa?) and got angry if you proved her wrong, she installed a sound card without looking at the instructions or installing drivers ("what would I want to drive my computer for? it's not a car") then was surprised when it didn't work, destroying her CRT by spraying the insides with furnature polish (WHHHY), and blowing up the PSU doing the same.
But I digress.

That one....only the machine though....monitor is usual pap, and keyboard about 5 quid quality.

Which is one hell of a difference. Every desktop enviroment, toolkit and even the X Window system itself is universally shite.



Ugh. I think the only system to do it worse was windows 3.x.

GUI is just graphics though, whilst XP may look like a Fischer Price 'My first GUI' with orange and blue it is the best OS Microshits have ever made...hell you can even manage DVD playback in 266mhz same as the previous 2 versions of Windows back....unlike today where the bloat continues unabated AND...Windows 7 looks the most pathetic of all GUIs since Windows Millenium IMO.

YMMV

[Amiga_Nut]

Personally I don't need a desktop, I have a suitably beefy laptop for most games I bother to play on PC....and a PS3 and 360 for the rest....so I have reclaimed my desk space (and lost the living room to gaming/home cinema tech! lol)

Then again, I can't stand huge hulking great boxes making a racket and taking up miles of space....but neither does the styling of the iMac do anything for me too.

[Amiga_Nut]

yeah, I'd love a commodore style "laptop without monitor" PC rather than these big boxes

A laptop without a monitor is like a supercar on 13" inch wheels and tractor tyres!

Technically you should be able to get a whole PC in the spaces left by a normal keyboard, but the compromises are too great in CPU and GPU really so I stick with an ATI/Nvidia based notebook with a 17" screen. Adequate for most tasks (except web page testing/design) for me.

[Amiga_Nut]

@ Amiga_Nut: "...hulking great boxes making a racket and taking up miles of space..." - I agree that desktops certainly take up more space than laptops, but the noise issue is exactly opposite IMO - I haven't encountered a laptop yet that would be as quiet as I want it to be. OTOH building a near silent desktop is very easy if you know how to do it. Plus - having the machine under your desk instead of on top of it helps a lot in this regard.

I have 3 laptops (although 1 is for the home cinema stuff) and between them they're excellent  choices. The Dell 9400 serves me well for whatever I would do on a desktop, although this obviously depends exactly what you do with your computer ie HD Movie file transcoding etc, and my silent but efficient IBM X40 which runs Windows7 well (although I choose to only use XP....those extra gigs are useful for my work).

A desktop will never be as silent as a laptop and a laptop never as powerful as a desktop. It's all compromise anyway.

[Amiga_Nut]

Meanwhile, here in the 21st century, I'm finding that the "intel garbage" is actually pretty good. I still have 68K and PPC based amiga machines, which are fun too. But by no stretch of the imagination is the processor in my main machine "garbage".

Must be some weird parallel universe you inhabit where x86 didn't go 64-bit / SSE3 / multicore and PPC is still relevant outside of hobbyist platforms, embedded systems and old routers.

A modern PC, even a proper laptop (ie DELL XPS 17" range not Intel integrated graphics rubbish btw) is a fantastic bit of kit technically speaking but...

1. Windows is utter crap...is it 25 years worth of computer development in hardware comparable ahead of KS/Wb on the A1000? No!

2. The PC is so fast only because it needed to run ever more bloated and useless OS releases from Microdorks

So you can't have one without the other really.

[Amiga_Nut]

@ Amiga_Nut: If you consider X40 silent, you've never heard a well put together quiet desktop. I found X40's fan distracting at night when I had it - under my desk it would be fine, under my hands not so - the principal advantage of desktop.

Depends....on my laptops I make sure I have silent HDs and have the max RAM and only run XP. All those combined mean my X40s fan is hardly ever on so for me it is pretty much silent yup. Also make sure the fan is WD40'd up if 2nd hand

[Amiga_Nut]

I have seen some amazing demos on the amiga. especially some of the ppc demos that are so small you cant but marvel at the obvious coding prownes.
 
I have also seen amazing things on PCs and amstrads and snes etc etc etc.
 
I love amiga, but I have not used one for quite some time now. I thinks IBM clones have their place. Macs not used. Love my Xbox and my PSP as well.
 
Really don't see the point in all these recent and over the years. Amiga rulez. windows sucks etc etc on infintium.
 
All Hardware and software has its place somewhere and everyone has different prefences.
 
No one is wrong, no one is right. Its all down to personal taste.
 
Same goes for music

No I agree, as a demo platform the PC coders have hardware light years ahead of anything an Amiga can plug into even a Zorro-III slot, and always will. The PC hardware hasn't been the problem for a decade, very powerful silicon in the box, bar none.

However Windows 7/Vista has no place anywhere. You specifically say Windows sucks sarcastically meaning we shouldn't say that. well only a fool would ever champion Windows today, it is pathetic bloatware beyond belief. 15Gb of space and requiring gigahertz of CPU power and gigabytes of memory just to show a mouse cursor on the screen to run even more bloatware CPU hogging applications, or routines like Flash video, is a joke....which microsoft laugh all the way to the bank about obviously. Windows IS pathetic and you'd have to be a bit of a n00b to think it is either efficient or elegant, what is worse than windows? Nothing. The only time Windows was superior to Linux was in Windows 95 days as far as machine requirements go. I can totally understand why people stopped at XP, you don't actually need anything more and microsoft artificially forcing DX10 off XP and making it Vista was just due to poor sales figures. Crysis was developed on XP-64bit and EA developers had a working DX setup for XP-64bit too, you can even see it in some old videos where they demo the DX10 features after launching the game code from XP 64.

OS X is too close to Linux + fancy windowing environment for me personally, not worth the premium Apple place on their computers...however that to some degree may be personal preference. After all some people genuinely prefer Linux to other operating systems so fair do's. And there are too many expensive paid for updates with OS X, forget that!

But as far as demos go, even 4kb ones, the PC has it's fair share of stunning demos simply because they have oodles of CPU power to play with thanks to having to run winblow bloatware.

Sure as hell though in the past there was some excellent coding, like the SID player and C64 Demo by Per Hakan Sundell for OCS Amigas, yes he of C64S emulator for DOS, who managed to get some amazingly accurate C64 SID tunes converted very closely with just Paula and a 7mhz 68000, show me all you want from later years but this in itself shows a time when extremely efficient coding was in evidence, and there is not a single 8mhz 8086 + 16bit Soundblaster equivalent of the C64 Music Demo as produced for Amiga. Those are the facts and combined with just what a terrible OS Windows is in terms of efficiency you can see why people are right to say Windows IS a pile of crap AND at the time (80s to early 90s) Amiga was king of the demo scene end of story. Sorry if that upsets anyone but those are historical facts on a like for like basis.

However things change, ironically thanks to such pathetic coding by microsoft for each successive OS, so that doesn't mean you shouldn't go looking for post 90s PC demo's or MOD tunes...my favourite on PC has to be from Quazar of Sanxion called Funky Stars. At the same time don't discount Amiga either, Silk Cut by Black Lotus is one hell of a demo, with superb art and music regardless of host machine's limitations. Pixel art and music are universal to all 16/32bit machines, and to some extent the host machine does not matter. If I owned a Falcon I would download Silk Cut for that too, simple.

[Amiga_Nut]

@Amiga_Nut


Regardless if you believe this, Windows 7 is really really good.

That you somehow think that Microsoft does pathetic coding tells us more about you than Microsoft.

Yeah it tells people I'm not a Microsoft fanboy lapping up their pathetic offerings

I think you are confusing modern paradigms with Winblows specific code. Microsoft didn't invent all the cool add-ons to basic HTML, in fact they tried to monopolise it and failed. They didn't invent FLAC or MP3, nope they tried to monopolise that area with DRMd WMA format. WAV is no different to IFF samples, they certainly didn't invent the 16bit DACs on sound cards used to play 16bit sounds instead of 8bit. Divx and Mpeg 1/2/4 were not invented by Microsoft, nor were the codecs, they just utilise it all in the bloatware media player and invented DRMd crap WMV formats of their own. You need 2x-3x the CPU speed to play a DVD in Vista than XP, and that's if you are allowed to use your XP driver if there isn't a new Vista one, otherwise you need 2ghz to play a DVD via the standard Win7/Vista driver....two bloody gigahertz!

Here's a classic, did Workbench ever fry your blitter/copper just sitting there displaying a desktop with some icons you can click on? Nope don't think that happened. Funny then that those losers at Microsoft decided that the Vista GUI desktop should permanently engage your 3D GPU on the desktop screen displaying some icons and windows and a task bar...great idea....until it fries your laptop GPU on idle just displaying the desktop.Classic! Totally clueless company, they really have no brains there. And all the 'new' stuff to move windows around now makes Windows unusable on a netbook and extremely annoying. They make billions and they probably didn't even test it on the average netbook despite promising it would be designed for netbook users after the trainwreck that was Vista running on Intel Atom 1.6ghz ha!

So what is Windows good for today, what is actually left?

Maybe as a platform for executing 1080+ HD gaming...erm PS3/360 clearly show that the core kernal need only be a handful of megabytes even to get 5.1 sound and 1080p DX10 graphics. The 360s OS is something like 64kb, so while running a game why do I need 2x the CPU and a billion times the memory? Even worse comparing Xbox1 and Win XP on 2ghz CPU for running Colin McRae 3 on PC...which is still inferior even with identical GPU. I'm pretty sure there is no $300 PC that will play a game as audio visually stunning as the nine level rendered realtime game on PS3 called Killzone II. Ditto for a $150 PC that plays Gears of War on Vista as good as X360

General use like Facebook/MSN (also now bloatware)/internet surfing? Nope because all these are fully possible on a 256mb average speed P3 with XP...hmmm.

As an OS Win 7/Vista IS pathetic! What is it that Windows is doing that is so great?

The fact you can't play Divx files on an A1200/4000 stock machine again is nothing to do with M$ coding really, they didn't invent the CPU, they didn't write the amazing codecs, they didn't invent the fast IDE hard drives. Nope they just did the rubbish bloatware bit that lets you double click on the icons and run a media player (their's being the worst as usual...all that glitz and the twats who coded WMP10/11 forgot to add an aspect ratio control for videos...losers). Whoopee dooo how amazing! The fact you can't do XYZ on Amiga OS1/2/3/4 or AROS and can on Windows is 99.99999% nothing to do with Microsoft. And in fact I run the lowest form of Windows needed so I don't waste my time with useless crap. XP does everything you need, sod making M$ richer by downgrading to 7/Vista. In fact this machine with some tweaks to the OS and 3rd party codecs/media players happily plays 1080p video without dropping a frame, on Win 7/Vista with up to date Nvidia drivers it's like a fast slideshow...yeah that's progress isn't it The media player alone is 3x more efficient at frame rates than anything Microsoft ship today.

So what's it good at? Starting to sound like Neo asking "what is the Matrix" lol

Sure as hell isn't multitasking because a few months into 7 and Flash was already hogging things and causing noticeable delays just launching things...Kickstart kernal is what 40kb anway? So what is the other 1.9999995Gb being loaded up with? Sure as hell isn't gaming because the 360 OS is 64kb and is just as glitzy, as is the PS3 which even plays Blu-Rays without crippling the output like Vista to appease the copyright gods*, maybe .0001% of the population worldwide runs Maya or other 3D rendering software so the multithreading helps...but OS/2 had multithreading decades before. You can play DVDs/700mb Divx rips with a 300mhz P2 CPU even up to XP with just 128mb of RAM. Audio is a no brainer, a 486 will play music. Surfing the internet? Hell no, why would I need such ludicrous amounts of CPU to run Internet Explorer or Firefox. Flash is also bloatware rubbish, if anything Microsoft's crappy OS coding and profit making encourages that kind of rubbish from Adobe to be acceptable! It isn't Streaming Divx was superior to Flash half a decade ago...let alone now.

I have explained that just to click on icons and attempt multitasking on a GUI environment 2ghz and 2gb IS pathetic. Perhaps you could explain technically WHY 'Windows', not things done by other talented coders, is great.
Plenty of morons choose to pay for Vista/Win7 annually with that moronic grin on their face as they clutch their shiny boxes in the queues at PC World, I hope you have an ace up your sleeve to get yourself out of this group of people now

Bloat bloat motherbloating bloat. That's all that ever came out of Bill Gate's a-hole sorry. Windows 7 was meant to be running a tiny tightly coded kernal loading only what it needs to do the job after all the bad press Vista got, I think it was called Vienna? Anyway they changed their minds and 7 is just Vista SP3 + inferior GUI skin  

Enjoy

re: C64 Demo comments by others

The programmer is the same for C64S emulator in DOS, which is the only PC example of SID accuracy I can find, as the Amiga SID player so I don't know if he did a stand alone SID player or not. Given just how much extra CPU time any C64 emulator takes with sound enabled even in the DOS days I find it impressive that the demo/player even exists. I am not going to sit here and say Doom should be possible on an A500 but this is a bit different.

Oh and I said SB16 because I thought the older Soundblaster cards were OPL/FM based things like the Adlib cards etc. Ancient PC stuff by name is not me forte sorry

re:server OS comments
I have no reference point for an ingenious, light years ahead of the competition, OS and hardware package....only for desktop machines. All I know is we had a reliable and elegant GUI multitasking desktop OS in 1985 with multimedia capability as the time allowed (movies on an 880kb floppy? behave!)...so how did things become so bloated now from our 256kb 7mhz roots!

In essence Windows sucks, PC's have amazing innards, and well there isn't much of an alternative is there lol

[Amiga_Nut]

Still doesn't help you play modern PC games on the Mac.


Amiga_Nut: Your long winded Anti M$ post is too long to fully address, so I will just say:

If M$ is so stupid, why is it that they are everywhere?  Why is it that *my* vista laptop hasnt died, and that my 3 machines running Win7 have been on for at least a month without incident?

If you don't read my post how do you know it is anti-M$. They were examples of what is it Microsoft specifically doesn't produce and questions and comparisons with similar ways using earlier/different OS. You missed the point entirely. I didn't say it crashes instantly or it is unreliable blue screen of death comments no. I said why do you need gigahertz of CPU and gigabytes of memory just to smoohly display a mouse cursor and some icons in order to execute other peoples programs via a responsive UI. IF Win 7 was all they said it would be then it would only need 266mhz and 64mb to boot up to a blank desktop (ie if it was Windows Vienna as demonstrated when sales of Vista were well below par and M$ shit their pants). n00bs callng themselves experts repeatedly claimed Win 7 is as efficient as XP? They lied, idiots forgot, cue millions of sales surprise surprise.

Also most of it is inherited from the DOS days and continued. Microsoft's dirty laundry about how they kept their monopoly with decidedly suspect business tactics have been aired for the last 10 years. And this is why in the EU the EU Commission is riding them hard and making demands the limp wristed US Supreme Court are too scared to do, don't want to lose all those tax dollars from MS profits worldwide now do we

My point about Win 7 on netbooks with awkward resolutions like 1024x600 was the lunacy of functions like the snap to screen/auto full screen as soon as you touch the edges is just an instant fail. Win 7 on those machines is unusable, and clearly a billion dollar company trumpeting on about how it was designed with netbooks in mind is telling porkies. Anyway using it seriously on a 1.6ghz Atom is like running XP on a Pentium 1, Sure it runs, but you will kill someone soon enough if you're forced to use said machine with Win7 for any real work (as opposed to pissing about on Facebook all day like a teenage twat)

My comment about Flash was regarding multitasking efficiency, task load control and prevention of resource hogging. If Windows can't keep Flash (which isn't even a full blown executing program just a resident routine) under control and not hog resources just because it is resident on minimized browser windows that may want to use it then well...explain to me again how Win 7/Vista multitasking is actually any good? Isn't this basically all your OS needs to get right at the core? Isn't this why even in AGA era of KS3 Windows was still inferior despite having 10-20x the CPU speed? Is it only me that remember the jerky multitasking demos of the mid 90s. Nothing changes, the hour glass is still here, even IBM sorted out the hour glass/spinny circle 'wait!' aspect of an OS in the mid 90s. 15 years on a spec of dust on your DVD-R whilst Nero is running can lock the machine requiring hard power down. Hmmm progress huh?

DVD playback was actually using the same program on XP and Vista, and the DVD in question is from 2003 etc. So that's the theory of other people being to blame for that issue. It stands to reason if you can't run the OS on a 333mhz P2 how the hell can you watch a DVD on that OS using the same hardware that happily does it using XP/2000. Anything else is just going off on a tangent and no relevance to the simple fact you get less from more/the same CPU.

The issue of activating the GPU and KEEPING IT 100% ACTIVATED just to display a 2D desktop with a mouse cursor and a few icons is just a stupid idea, you activate on the fly or you don't keep it active at all. Leaving a machine idle, doing nothing, resulting in GPUs getting fried on a new OS. Let's see shall we blame Nvidia or the people who come up with the dumb idea of having your entire GPU active all the time even when a 2D screen saver is showing hmmmm. This little feature of Vista had Nvidia's lawyers sharpening their claws trust me when M$ attempted to pass the buck. Nobody else built an OS that fries your 3D super hot GPU whilst doing nothing except running the actual OS. Clever NOT. What I definitely did NOT say was off-loading some of the work to the actual GPU to run natively is a bad idea, as and when required and certainly not for an idle machine executing no actual programs just displaying a desktop or screen saver. OS X doesn't blow up the even more fragile GPUs in their 17" powerbooks.....wondered why?

Talking about games sure games are the most demanding thing to run on most PCs and I never said there was anything wrong with PC hardware, but that's understandable and the hardware is not designed and built by them and is not the issue. 3Ghz for CPU geometry setup for your high end GPU costing more than a PS3 to run max settings on Crysis? sure I suppose that's justifiable, after all Amiga cost 200% the price of a Sega 16bit console with similar games. But 2ghz to smoothly display a responsive mouse cursor so you can double click on some icons to execute other programs...erm no that's just lunacy. And I can bet you that your super duper games running on your $1000 populated motherboard look the same as a $250 PS3 or $150 360 via 1080p, they certainly don't need virtual memory or 2Gb of ram to launch the games. And if Win 7 is the second coming why isn't there a game mode where the OS shuts down everything except the same handful of megabytes of code used by the 360 just to run the games? After all there is nothing a PC game does that a 360 game cannot do like XBL etc, so why have bloatware executing games, which are indeed the most demanding and resource hungry software application most people will run. Hmmm?
Design fail.

My point stands, my question unanswered, what is it specifically that windows does, AND specifically coded by MS, that is fantastic (and efficiently which is what the argument has always been). Excluding all the great things other poeple have written for Windows and other operating systems the answer is a big fat zilch my friends. Transcoding x264 and h264 doesn't require anything in Win7, speed and ability to do such things feasibly is all down to Intel/AMD's hardware.

What I never said was WB3 is all powerful and totally adequate, if I was ranting I would make silly fanboy comments. But you don't 15Gb of space to implement TCP/IP stacks or anything else essential that is missing from stock A1200HDs Topic title says Windows sucks. have yet to see an argument that proves it doesn't suck from an coding efficiency point of view.

Sure some things have improved compared to Vista, even a couple of things you can't tweek Vista to improve easily via a few mouse click. But Win 7 isn't really any better than Vista, marketing is obviously better though, with artificially fast boot times due to excessive disk thrashing after the mouse cursor comes up on real world machines. And it still suffers from 'Windows rot' just like every other version.