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Author Topic: Pirated Amiga software on ebay  (Read 10024 times)

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Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« on: September 06, 2010, 03:35:00 PM »
I harbor a certain disdain for people who profit on the bits of a carcass as well.  However, I am not sure that I can agree with the sentiment that the rights owners do not care as the software does not or cannot make them money.

This was the argument for a long time supporting the trading of Atari 2600 ROMs.  Then about ten years ago, Hasbro started marketing of the old Atari titles and we saw the release of a series of consoles, including the Atari Flashback, Flashback 2, and the hand-held Atari joystick.  As well, there were a few remade titles in glorious 3D which included an emulation of the original game.  Hasbro clearly saw an existing market for this old stuff and decided to feed it.  The same happened for Intellivision games, though meanwhile Nintendo allows its NES games to be ripped off for "100-in-1" console games found at just about any flea market and swap-shop.

And the same goes currently for many Amiga titles as some have been release through the Wii market and iTunes.  While not all companies may see the value in releasing Amiga games for the iPad 3G Mini (poke) or in PC emulation format, I believe many will.

We have a gentleman here who is working very hard to contact old software producers to request their software be released into the public domain.  I believe that we could equally contact current rights holders of old Amiga games with examples of "retro" software for various platforms which is being re-released and encourage them to do the same.  Some might just bite, some may release the games PD, some may ignore us, and some may tell us to walk westward until our hat floats.

We have a guy here who makes games for the iPad 3G Mini; perhaps he could secure the rights to repackage classic Amiga titles for the device.  With the Android SDK available, the same could be done there as well.  (Of course, the pirating would probably begin anew in both cases -- there is no escaping the pie-rats. ;))

(A thought occurs on the iPhone idea.  I think the processing of an ADF or emulation of a CPU would run afoul of Apple's agreement.  At the same time, I do not believe that Google puts such restrictions on Android.)
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2010, 04:37:26 PM »
Quote from: Crom00;578045
FYI the Flashback devies were made by the company now known as ATARI (who purchased the rights to the name and the ip for the games from Hasbro well before they made the flashback).

Hasbro did re-releases during their brief tenure as owner of the IP but got rid of the brand rather quickly. I spoke to one insider who revealed the process of getting the Flashbacks out was a big legal hassle and in the end the project wasn't a money maker for them when you considered the NRE costs. Jakks Pacific was able make the number work on their TV games becuase all the tooling and majority of dev work is done in China (as cheap as humanly possible) so NRE costs were much cheper than using USA counterparts. Also Jakks legendary ability to fill a mass market supply chain and secured retailer space certainly helped.


Thank you.  I was minutely aware of some sordid circumstances of this three-way adventure, but not to this detail.  I own the original Flashback -- I actually had two, but gave one away after opening and trying out the abomination, keeping one unopened for future value.  I never bought the Flashback 2, and I lament buying the joystick.  In fact, Jakks Pacific has tromped on my good memories of the Atari 2600 with its horrible hardware renditions: the damned things do not appear to have a noise generator, which has ruined "Missile Command."  However, if you do not have the original hardware, it is okay for nostalgic and educational purposes.

None the less, there was and obviously remains a market from which the producers can make a profit.  I am perfectly fine with a $20 joystick with five or ten games in it, but I absolutely refuse to pay $20 for a DS cartridge with a single 25 year-old game in it.  I have a bunch of Atari games on CD which were the 3D remakes -- quite good ones, actually -- and the companion emulation of the originals for $10 ea.

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The best course of action is to release these to the public domain for sure. At this point it's more about historical preservation and educational purposes. Histroy is written by the victors but if you speak to the hardcore in the industry and they are well aware of the contributions the Amiga made to the industry. It's up to us "old timers" to school the "young bloods" on this history.


I partially agree with this.  The horrendous extension of the "Mickey Mouse" copyright laws (what are they, 100 years now?) has been and will be a great detriment to us all.   That having been said, I do not see any issue with a company making money on a product which has a market, irrespective of whether the original market is dead, such as the original 2600 consoles, or just aged and looking for regeneration, in emulation, for instance.  At the same time, the source code for a number of Atari 2600 and 7800 titles have been released for public consumption.

As a corollary, I could support a requirement on companies exercising their rights after having let them languish for a period of time to produce a modern replacement for the original works.  Licensing to Jakks Pacific for production, for instance, would satisfy this requirement.

I maintain preservation and education by way of owning a couple of the original consoles and scads of the original games.  I keep them all working, and I also have abused the pirating world by "profiting" from the hard work of others to dump the ROMs so as to maintain a working digital copy should anything happen to the hardware.  That way I can make a new cartridge if necessary.  I also support making multi-carts using ROMs which you rightfully own.  (Rightfully owning spawns a conversation itself, but suffice to say that, in my circumstances, I mean that I have possession of the physical cartridges and matching game consoles.)

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What I do see are companies publishing games on a case by case basis. Pinball Dreams, Super Stardust, etc. If you port the game to a different platform you avoid the whole Amiga rom issue. Emulation seems to leave a bad taste in the mouth of IP holders as they are not administering the sale of the games. At least with WII Iphone and XBlive you have a copy protection system in place.

A more constructive course of action could be to campaining XBlive, Apple or other publishers to re-relase these gems on modern hardware.


Let the big boys deal with each other?  Sounds interesting.
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2010, 07:11:13 PM »
Quote from: recidivist;578080
If the copyrights owners can't be bothered at this point ,I say people who get all exercised about "pirating" of old,long abandoned software need to "get a life"!


Who's the bigger fool?  The fool, or the fool who follows him?
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2010, 01:28:01 AM »
Quote from: runequester;578129
Considering there's plenty of people selling bootleg dvd's, cd's and copies of games currently being sold, I doubt ebay is getting too fussed about someone selling a bootleg copy of Turrican or whatever.


Wrong is wrong is wrong.  It is immaterial whether the issue at hand is an illegitimate copy of "Portal" or "Turrican."

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Im somewhat amused.. some guy keeps offering up A1200's with compact flash hard drives and, according to the auctions, 1000's of games installed with whdload.

Somehow doubt he bought all of those..


Probably not.  And it is just as much of an issue as a copy of "Portal" on a modded PS3.  Wrong is still wrong.
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2010, 04:40:11 AM »
Quote from: runequester;578134
Thats not what I meant though. The odds of ebay really getting up in arms are pretty remote.


I knew what you meant. My point was (supposedly) from eBay's perspective, that copyright infringement is copyright infringement, irrespective of the color.
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2010, 12:38:59 PM »
Quote from: stefcep2;578168
You know i sometimes think about the (probable) years of my life that I have spent on forums like this engaing in debates like this certain in the knowledge it will amount to naught.


Given that attitude, might as well just put a gun to your head, mate, and sod ever coming to a different perspective or maybe swaying others to see yours.  Seriously, discussion and debate in any forum or venue is valuable.  With the exception of trolls and trolling, which qualify as neither discussion nor debate.

Personally, I am not here to while away my time before I become worm food.  I am here to participate, exchange information, exchange interpretations and perspectives with others, maybe even learn something.

Anyone who cannot get into the swing thereof, or has some despotic stance against, really should just delete his or her account and head off elsewhere.  Or just lurk more and wag your head back and forth about the morons wasting time talking to each other.  I mean, sheesh, stupid humans.
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2010, 06:48:48 PM »
Quote from: _ThEcRoW;578193
How many of the whiners about that auction have never pirated anything?.


I stole a pack of gum from the IGA when I was five.  Does that mean I have no place to speak against theft?
 

Offline LoadWB

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Re: Pirated Amiga software on ebay
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2010, 08:06:27 PM »
Quote from: Belial6;578237
I don't know a single adult that doesn't violate some law (usually copyright and speeding).  I highly suspect that neither you nor anyone else on this board is the exception.


Now, is that really the point?  Sure, there are plenty of accidental violations in our lives, so should we just deliberately perpetrate or condone violations because it is so easy to transiently transgress?