Next step for Amiga(like)OS?

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amigadave wrote:

Piru wrote:
@amigadave

AInc. has not gone after the MorphOS2.x team lately.

They never had a case anyway, and they know it.

Exactly my point!  I don't think they would have a case against a new OS coded by the AOS4.x and MorphOS2.x teams either, unless both teams really screwed up and tried to copy parts of AOS4.x too closely.

Why would either teams bother? They don't need each other of each other's incompatible technology. The only real way to do what you are saying is to dump OS4 and get the last few guys who work on it working on MOS... Since MOS is safe from A Inc... But why should OS4 devs abandon their work? You see the problem has nothing to do with the OSs or the developers, but instead is down to the users. This is a free market, if all the users decided to go with one solution then that would naturally for the developers to work on that one solution.

But as soon as you start advocating one solution over another you'll just run into the people who want the other solution. In a market this small there can be no clear winners.

I see what you are trying to do, but it's too late.

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amigadave wrote:
This is starting to sound too much like you guys want to exclude the AOS4.x team members no matter what and I am wondering if the motives are more than just objective.

This thread was probably a bad idea anyway.

Seems that our best hope for a unified future is for AInc. to go under, just like every other Amiga owner has.  They sure aren't going to do us any good.

A Inc going under can only be a good thing... But hey why don't we forget about tainted code and propriatory operating systems and start a community based open source AmigaOS, that the community could then "own" free of any dodgy companies, legal issues and expensive hardware... Woe, woe and thrice woe, if only such a project existed... If only something like that had been started 10 years ago... Sigh... If only...

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If anybody was atually interestested any more... then it could probably be sorted out really quite easily... Ihe sad part is that no one is interesting in some worthless prehistoric IP and a brand that died in the early 90s...

In a world of iPhones and Xboxes, PS3s and Wiis, A landscape of Vistas and Leopards... the Amiga is nothing more than a footnote in an old history book somewhere.

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amigadave wrote:

bloodline wrote:
A Inc going under can only be a good thing... But hey why don't we forget about tainted code and propriatory operating systems and start a community based open source AmigaOS, that the community could then "own" free of any dodgy companies, legal issues and expensive hardware... Woe, woe and thrice woe, if only such a project existed... If only something like that had been started 10 years ago... Sigh... If only...

I don't see the MorphOS team as a dodgy company, but I know that they must have their own skeletons in the closet.

No MOS is not a dodgy company, the AROS team and the MOS team have worked closely... This is what I would like to see more of and what I was alluding to... Is that not what you wanted to see?

I take your sarcasm is pointed at the slow to materialize AROS project that has not gained more support.

No, I could not care less about how much support AROS has... it suits my needs, sod the rest off you ;-)

I was trying to point out that complaining about some company is pointless...

Edit: I don't think the actual AOS4.x programmers are dodgy either, but have my doubts about Hyperion.

All in all I think greed and stupid decisions have ruined the next generation Amiga.

Well yes... but that is stating the obvious... :-)

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amigadave wrote:

bloodline wrote:
If anybody was atually interestested any more... then it could probably be sorted out really quite easily... Ihe sad part is that no one is interesting in some worthless prehistoric IP and a brand that died in the early 90s...

In a world of iPhones and Xboxes, PS3s and Wiis, A landscape of Vistas and Leopards... the Amiga is nothing more than a footnote in an old history book somewhere.

You are right, not even AInc. was interested in AmigaOS4 until it was close to being finished and they thought they could steal a few bucks from the developers working on it.  

True!

But many of the members here and elsewhere around the world on other sites like this one, there are a few hundreds of people still interested in what is going to happen to AmigaOS4.x and a similar number that are interested in MorphOS2.x.  Those are the people that matter to me and the reason I am here.  

I'm not interested in any specific flavour of AmigaOS... I just want to play with AmigaOS on cheap, powerful hardware... If I don't have to pay for it much the better.

From all the negative comments you repeatedly make (I know you will only say they are realistic, not negative, but that is just your excuse), I wonder why you are a member here and spend so much time and effort putting down almost every Amiga development and new idea.  

I have answered your question already. Please search though the threads to find the answer.

This is not meant as an attack on you, just an observation of your many recent messages on many different topics.  Such as the comment above.  

As is your want. Feel free to attack me if you wish, I feel confident I will be able to defend myself.

To most of the members here the Amiga brand did not die in the early 1990's and if asked, I would bet many do not care as much about the world of iPhones, XBoxes, PS3's, Wii's, LeopardOS and VistaOS, as they do about their Amiga(s).  That is why they are here every day and night and not somewhere else, like MS.com, or Apple.com. :-D

No you misunderstand the concept of Brand. I'm sorry to say the Amiga brand is worthless. Think of a brands like Kellogg's Corn Flakes or Coca cola...

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uncharted wrote:

bloodline wrote:

A Inc going under can only be a good thing... But hey why don't we forget about tainted code and propriatory operating systems and start a community based open source AmigaOS, that the community could then "own" free of any dodgy companies, legal issues and expensive hardware... Woe, woe and thrice woe, if only such a project existed... If only something like that had been started 10 years ago... Sigh... If only...

...AROS had anything remotely resembling a direction or plan, perhaps something may of happened.

What might have happened?

Curse those to idiots who screwed things up for wanting to actually run Amiga software on their new operating systems. (if I was feeling evil, I'd say any software)

Curse those idiots for not bothering to port AROS to the hardware of their choice... and then whinging...

MorphOS and AmigaOS 4 stole all the mindshare, because they had a plan for the future, and most importantly, they worked.

MOS and AROS worked together... I don't get your point, except you erroneously assume that I actually care about the people who whinge that they can't run OS4... AROS is there, the source code is open and free... do with it what you will.

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amigadave wrote:
@SamuriCrow,

Not being an AROS fan, I would rather see you spend your time on Mattathias for MorphOS than a port of LLVM to AROS, but that is just my tilt on the subject.

Well that's much more interesting! For all your talk about cooperation and unity in the Amiga scene, and now you claim not to like AROS... Now why would that be?


And you call me negative... The ironing is delcious!

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amigadave wrote:

bloodline wrote:

amigadave wrote:
@SamuriCrow,

Not being an AROS fan, I would rather see you spend your time on Mattathias for MorphOS than a port of LLVM to AROS, but that is just my tilt on the subject.

Well that's much more interesting! For all your talk about cooperation and unity in the Amiga scene, and now you claim not to like AROS... Now why would that be?


And you call me negative... The ironing is delcious!

Where is there a negative comment in anything I have written about AROS?  Simply stating that it is not interesting to me, or that "I am not a fan of AROS", is not putting it down or saying that people should not waste their time with it.

I don't care if you like AROS or not, but everything you have suggested publicly is emboddied by AROS... so why don't you like it?

The Mattathias project is more interesting to me than AROS at the moment.  That may change some day when AROS has more to offer.  

More to offer than hardware independence, commnity control and free use for anyone who wants to use it?

All I asked in my post was, why don't you like AROS, you haven't answered that.

If you really want to know more about why I am not an AROS fan, I will gladly let you know via PMail, but don't want to put "real" negative remarks about another part of the Amiga community here on the forums.  

So what you are saying is that you have "real" negative feelings about AROS... AROS is EVIL...

But then I doubt you really want to know anyway, this is just your childish retort to my remarks.

Childish? Because I have identified a logical inconsistancy in your argument?

P.S. You mean "irony" not something you do to straighten out your shirts.

So you don't watch the Simpsons then... I guess this explains a lot.

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AeroMan wrote:

Painkiller wrote:
Uhh I hate the so called modern OSs... Software developers just don't care anymore what they make, instead its quanity at the cost of usability. Many programs are way too heavy than what they should be and new hardware are used to make up for that... Back in the days of Amiga, software were created for the hardware not the other way around.

People just don't seem to care nowadays they just think that hey this is the way it should work when many things could be done a hundred times better...

I´m not a big fan of "modern" OS also. They cost 10 times more disk space than they should, and there are no reasons for that. And how I hate ctrl+alt+del and those blue screens.
Unfortunately, I´ve never tried Mac OS X, so I can´t have an oppinion about it. My Mac died before OS X release

A "Modern" OS has to do a huge amount... the size of the source code can probably be measured in the Billions!

They might be using more space than they should, but that is a side effect of the evolutionary nature of features added to the system. Apple have recently released a beta of OSX 10.6 "Snow Leopard"... the aim of which is to slim the codebase down to just what is needed. But it will still be gigabytes in size, it will use a massive amount of disk space, because it has to do so much!

@persia:

Moving to Intel would put the OS side by side with Linux, Win, OS X and all the obscure alternative OSs. It would be just another flavor of PC.

As opposed to now, where it is just another flavour of PC with a technologically dead CPU...

Besides this, there would be the nightmare of writing drivers for tons of different hardware.

Nightmare? Why not do as AROS and use generic drivers, most hardware will work... then if you have a specific driver you get better functionality... that's how all OSs deal with this problem.

Linux guys have it, and there are tons of programmers writing stuff for it...

It's relativly easy to build a machine for running Linux, do a quick search on the net, find out which hardware you can get a linux driver for and then buy that bit of hardware... simple.

And if you think about it that's like searching on the net to see which Motherboard you need to run MOS or OS4... and then if you want to run one of those OSs you buy the compaible board... simple... :idea:

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@Painkiller

You don't want technology, you want a flower garden...

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Painkiller wrote:
@bloodline

No I want a computer that actually works and is not bug ridden I don't see how that is possible when there is so much variety in hardware.

People have different opinions you know...

Surely MOS is quite full of bugs, but a small team is working on it and I would think it is a lot easier for them to get rid of the bugs with one hardware in mind than thousands of different combinations.

Just buy an iMac and be happy...

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amigadave wrote:

warpdesign wrote:

You have to have useful and/or entertaining software for it

By developing something real "new", we could have way more "fun" than running 10 years old apps... Look at MacOSX: who's running OS9 apps today (and I believe there are a lot more than 78 000 apps for pre-OSX...)

OSX added a lot more...

Yes, it will take time. But the sooner we start, the sooner we'll have fun again... And the sooner we'll get rid of this old, old, old API, which was designed for old hardware, without portability in mind,...

Comparing anything Amiga to OSX is like comparing the Model T Ford to today's Shelby Mustang GT.  They have almost nothing in common other than they both roll on wheels and carry people.

Yes, there are still many old time Mac users that are running OS9 apps on their new OSX machines and Apple saw the value of building in that compatibility to make the transition from the old to the new.  What do you think would have happened to Apple's already small market share if they had not had any backward compatibility?  New sales of the OSX Macs probably would have been half or less of what they have been.

This is why Steve Jobs is the boss of Apple and you are not (this is not an insult upon you BTW).

When Apple brought out OSX, they did sandbox the old apps... very clever, but that did not drive sales, that just ensured that existing users who wanted to upgrade could. But that did not drive sales of OSX, that just keep existing users happy... that is not a market.

What drove OSX was Apple buying up all the best productivity software for OS9 and then porting it themselves to OSX, most of the best OSX productivity software is actually from apple. They were able to afford this by having a second source income... The iPod and iTunes... That pretty much funded the OS9 to OSX transition.

Steve Jobs is a genius... and his trick has been done.  Amiga can't do that anymore. The Amiga has nothing.