Need explanation of the CPU and FPU technology on turbo boards

[Hyperspeed]

Hang on, I thought quite a few games used it?

Does software specifically have to call on an FPU or will the FPU just cooperate to un-burden the CPU's task of dealing with floating point maths?

With the '040/060 the FPU is internal so it might be different with the '020/'030 CPUs...

I wonder if Shapeshifter/Fusion and other emulators use it. It's a shame there wasn't a SnoopDos tool that let you know exactly when a program used the FPU.

[Hyperspeed]

The dissapointing thing I discovered was that using the FPU version of the MPEGA library was vastly slower than the integer version. I couldn't make out any difference in sound quality. Those using Songplayer or MakeCD's MP3-CDDA function would best stick with the integer (standard) MPEGA library version.

I'm sure I read that Gloom Deluxe, Breathless and Alien Breed 3D (/2) used the FPU. I mean, Alien Breed 3D 2:The Killing Grounds had polygon, texture mapped weapons, light sourcing and all that like Quake. Come to think of it, latter-day FPS like Genetic Species surely had some support for FPU?

I'm sure I heard of a few things that used FPU on 68k Mac too, wouldn't Quark have used this for complex object scaling? I'm sure Wordworth installed maths libraries...

It would make interesting reading which applications did use maths libraries. Would they be these:

mathieeedoubbas.library
mathieeedoubtrans.library
mathieeesingtrans.library
mathrans.library

?

Archiving tools like LHA too!

[Hyperspeed]

I'm sure I had an archive of the LZX/LHA programs where there were FPU versions...

The only way to prove/disprove is to make a list.

So far we have:

Apps
¯¯¯¯
1) Lightwave
2) MPEGA

Games
¯¯¯¯¯
1) TFX

Demos
¯¯¯¯¯

Emulators
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

:inquisitive:

[Hyperspeed]

kidkoala: That 'Young Monkey' link was damn good. I heard somewhere else that the well acclaimed Oxypatcher added 20 seconds to boot time. Well they can keep that, I'm running an Amiga not a PC - I want to boot in 20s total!

:-D

Interesting too that the HSMathsLibs didn't appear to have any real world speed improvements... and they weren't free either!

The page did hint that there was a fair few programs that used the FPU (why else would there be Oxypatcher, HSMathsLibs and Cyberpatcher?).

We must track down all the FPU programs, for the good of mankind!

[Hyperspeed]

Ahhh, now we're getting somewhere!

DTP? So is it not feasible that Wordworth and Pagestream are using the FPU for object scaling, rotation and TrueType font calculation?

Would Turboprint use the FPU for it's Super-Smoothe algorithm?

What about Elite/Frontier/Lambda?

It's hard to track down these programs without reinstalling, the sight of 68882 option in the installer though is quite familiar. I must have loads of FPU programs lurking on my Amiga!

Another topic could be "What software uses the MMU"!

[Hyperspeed]

by Piru:
Archiving tools certainly do not use FPU, at least not for anything time critical such as compression or decompression.

Hmmm... I looked back through the LZX manual and it has optimisation for the various CPU caches, but not the FPU.

I've seen these 68881/68882s used on Mac motherboards and there are x86 equivalents for ancient PCs too.

What would be the difference between a CPU's FPU and a modern day GPU? Both seem to be gauged in FLOPS?

So can someone explain in Sesame Street terms what an FPU does? Is it for calculating data such as Pi that has no real end but the FPU will make the calculation more accurate?

[Hyperspeed]

One question springs to mind here... are the sadistic, aggresive people that program Quake actually mathematicians?

[Hyperspeed]

stop aRgUiNg!


:laughing:

[Hyperspeed]

Overclocking a Megadrive:
"It is possible to overclock the Motorola 68000 CPU in some cases in excess of 300% (the current known world record is 25.4 MHz), though it may not be completely stable beyond a certain point on each console.[9] The result of overclocking the CPU doesn't speed up the games any, but actually eliminates slowdown that some games are plagued by.

Another curious modification is to replace the stock 68000 processor with a 68010. Since the CPU isn't socketed, this requires the removal of the old CPU, and soldering in of the new. The 68010 is a pin-compatible, 'enhanced' version of the 68000, which is a bit more efficient internally and offers some new features. According to modder Robert Ivy, upgrading the CPU to a 68010 does not necessarily make the games run faster, it just reduces how much they slow down in intensive situations. Also, for some reason, the DAC's digital audio output sounds cleaner and less distorted. However, the 68010 is not 100% object code-compatible with the 68000, so machines modified with a 68010 processor are not able to run certain games properly; such as Sonic 3, Sonic and Knuckles, Street Fighter II, Red Zone, and a few others."

I wonder if you could use a toggle switch and alternate between a full 68020 and a 68EC020 or even different clock speeds...

[Hyperspeed]

by Piru:
You could possibly use external clock to drive the CPU, but I've never seen such hack myself

Doesn't the Apollo 630 piggy back a 68030 onto the A600's 68000? This is going even further than a seperate clock I suppose... also shoggoth's link re Falcon FPU has some kind of bypassed oscillator.

It's a shame compatibility went out the window with the 68040/68060. If there had been a super '030 things could have been so much more fun!

Still, overclocking that 40Mhz '030 would be cool. As long as it's the more tolerant MC68882 being overclocked and you take cooling into account you could have an interesting end result there - Leirbag28 has a cooling fan cut into the front of his CD32!

[Hyperspeed]

Hmmm, so a 68030RC50C could be overclocked quite stable? Is it possible I wonder to have a 64Mhz SX32?

:inquisitive: